Thought refs let nova hammer unc down low

[Cheriehoop]

Explain why on the last play ArchieD's pass off and then cutting off in front of the defenders is not a moving screen?

Pretty savvy move by a veteran PG.

 

[OttoMets]

I'm probably biased, but I didn't see the same disadvantage. Seemed overly physical both ways, but nothing egregious. Meeks might have picked up three cheap ones, but they were fouls - you can't take a guy's legs out when he's between you and a loose ball.

Worst call that stood out to me involved the offensive foul called on Jenkins just under 7:00 to play. He'd been hand-checked for 20 feet and the secondary defender seemed late in getting in front of him (and went down without much contact).

 

[Cowtown]

Two hands on the back of a posting player is automatic foul. Doesn't get easier than that.

Someone gets it. It's "black letter law."

 

[Cowtown]

I'm probably biased, but I didn't see the same disadvantage. Seemed overly physical both ways, but nothing egregious. Meeks might have picked up three cheap ones, but they were fouls - you can't take a guy's legs out when he's between you and a loose ball.

"If you force the ref to make a decision, you're stuck with the decision he makes. " Translation: if you don't want slap fouls, don't slap at the ball. Pretty simple, been that way for decades - except in the NBA where the stars get away with everything.

Anyway, UNC's interior players seemed a lot more active against SU. Perhaps that's because (without actually knowing) SU drove the ball into the lane where 'Nova entered the ball more into the post? That means the primary defender is often flat-footed more than not. Anyone else? Either way, 'Nova wasn't intimidated by the contact, and sometimes it seemed (understandably with 3 much smaller freshmen) like SU was.

 

[xc84]

I don't know which team, if any, benefited more that the other...but I thought the refs had too much of an impact...needlessly so.

 

[Cowtown]

I don't know which team, if any, benefited more that the other...but I thought the refs had too much of an impact...needlessly so.

Look, the referees will always have an impact on the game. Both teams and the refs accept that before they even step out on the floor. If the refs are too loose, it becomes thug ball and the more physical team beats up on the lesser, or if both are, it becomes a "rock fight." If they're too tight, it becomes a foul shooting contest with no flow. Nobody likes either scenario. So ideally what you get is somewhere down the middle. And since there will always be partisan interpretation and thus disagreement by players, coaches and fans, all the refs can try to be is consistent in what they'll call and what they won't. There are only 70 refs in the NBA, so it's easier to compel consistency there. There are thousands of refs in college and HS, spread out all over a big country, and you're not going to get them all the same. Period. As fans, we have to accept that.

So if you don't want to get beat by a tight call, or a last-second shot, play better sooner. As a player, that's what you have control over.

edit: not a shot at you, xc84.

 

[SU2NASA]

Officiating was part of the upcoming penalties to be imposed. This was the first to be imposed. They the officials had no qualms about looking one sided.

That's what I told my UNC-fan wife. I thought the officiating went well past absurd.

 

[SU2NASA]

Look, the referees will always have an impact on the game. Both teams and the refs accept that before they even step out on the floor. If the refs are too loose, it becomes thug ball and the more physical team beats up on the lesser, or if both are, it becomes a "rock fight." If they're too tight, it becomes a foul shooting contest with no flow. Nobody likes either scenario. So ideally what you get is somewhere down the middle. And since there will always be partisan interpretation and thus disagreement by players, coaches and fans, all the refs can try to be is consistent in what they'll call and what they won't. There are only 70 refs in the NBA, so it's easier to compel consistency there. There are thousands of refs in college and HS, spread out all over a big country, and you're not going to get them all the same. Period. As fans, we have to accept that.

So if you don't want to get beat by a tight call, or a last-second shot, play better sooner. As a player, that's what you have control over.

edit: not a shot at you, xc84.

You're assuming that the calls go both ways. If the game is officiated consistently, UNC wins by 10.

 

[xc84]

Look, the referees will always have an impact on the game. Both teams and the refs accept that before they even step out on the floor. If the refs are too loose, it becomes thug ball and the more physical team beats up on the lesser, or if both are, it becomes a "rock fight." If they're too tight, it becomes a foul shooting contest with no flow. Nobody likes either scenario. So ideally what you get is somewhere down the middle. And since there will always be partisan interpretation and thus disagreement by players, coaches and fans, all the refs can try to be is consistent in what they'll call and what they won't. There are only 70 refs in the NBA, so it's easier to compel consistency there. There are thousands of refs in college and HS, spread out all over a big country, and you're not going to get them all the same. Period. As fans, we have to accept that.

So if you don't want to get beat by a tight call, or a last-second shot, play better sooner. As a player, that's what you have control over.

edit: not a shot at you, xc84.

No problem. I knew it was not a shot at me. I understand what you are saying and agree that scenario usually plays out. I just though last night the refs inserted themselves too often and many of the replays showed it. I am not saying it ruined the game or anything like that...but as an impartial viewer, I thought they made some unnecessary or even odd calls. It's similar to my view of the ref who called Cooney out of bounds in the Ganzaga game. Refs need to know when not make a call. The next morning I was very happy SU won but still scratching my head over why that ref would even think he could make that call.

 

[Cowtown]

Officiating was part of the upcoming penalties to be imposed. This was the first to be imposed. They the officials had no qualms about looking one sided.

Please tell me you were being sarcastic.

 

[Cowtown]

You're assuming that the calls go both ways. If the game is officiated consistently, UNC wins by 10.

You and I understand officiating differently. :noidea:

And now I'm late for the golf course.

 

[SU2NASA]

You and I understand officiating differently. :noidea:

Get over yourself.

If you don't think that a preponderance of games have an inherent, human bias and inconsistency in which way it is called favoring one team, then you have your head in the sand.

 

[jgeorge322]

Get over yourself.

If you don't think that a preponderance of games have an inherent, human bias and inconsistency in which way it is called favoring one team, then you have your head in the sand.

guys, its ok to have a difference of opinion. reasonable people can see things in different lights.

 

[cuseinseattle]

It kind of felt like they really didn't want UNC to win the game probably based on what will happen in a month. Some of the fouls called on Meeks were especially bad and that last touch foul was a little too blatant. I'm happy for Nova but it had a SU-Ohio State feel to it.

 

[stuckinbig11]

Two hands on the back of a posting player is automatic foul. Doesn't get easier than that.

it looked like a touch with one hand, maybe not

 

[NashvilleOrange]

That was absolutely terrible officiating last night and it significantly hurt UNC. Almost made me glad that we weren't playing in the final because in all likelihood we would have been dealing with the same disadvantage.

 

[cspades99]

Looking back on it now, where I think they really screwed the pooch were lack of travel calls. I stopped counting the number of dragged pivot feet in the first half after the first six or so.

 

[SUFan44]

In the first place, there has to be contact for there to be a foul. Second there has to be disadvantage created by the contact, and UNC's perimeter stood there and watched, making no real attempt to get to the shooter. And since there's no such thing as a "moving screen violation" there's no call there. Period. Honestly, and with no vitriol, the ref-bashers here - and there's lotsa - should get out and ref. And I don't mean a handful of games with 9-10 year olds. You'll discover a different game from what you think you're seeing, and how difficult it is to do it well. And you'll start watching games with your eyes instead of your heart.

The call that I had a problem with was the travel/foul call that gave Villanova two FT's with less than a minute remaining.

Michael Stephens is the absolute worst and should not be officiating a Final Four.

 

[CU44SE]

Me and my roommate watching last night, no real rooting interests, just looking for a good game. Me being a Syracuse fan probably had more bias involved but he is completely neutral, just loves the tournament and doesn't follow a team. But the amount of no calls on Villanova when UNC drove with under 10 minutes left was eye opening and astounding. their was so much body involved in every challenge. Then they would go down to the other end and a simple hand check would be called. I think the biggest example of this was with about 45 seconds left and the foul call on hicks I believe. Looked like all ball and a quick whistle was blown.

 

[Cowtown]

Get over yourself.

If you don't think that a preponderance of games have an inherent, human bias and inconsistency in which way it is called favoring one team, then you have your head in the sand.

I'd suggest that reveals more about you than it does me. No matter, I'll continue to light the candles, and you can continue to curse the darkness.