Ticky tack fouls and the future of hoops

[cuseincincy]

I don't get the swallow the whistle crowd. Fouls should always only be called when they are obvious. If a ref isn't sure then he shouldn't guess and blow his whistle. The biggest problem with basketball refs is they call tendencies and not just what they see. I learned a lot sitting next to the OHSAA District head of officiating for a couple years. He would explain why a call was made and I would say "that's stupid" and he would respond "you asked why it was called, not whether it should have been." Biggest lesson I learned was on reach ins whether there is any contact or not..."if you reach up, no foul. If you reach down, they'll blow the whistle almost every time." Thats is actually teachable to players at least.

 

[Otto'd]

I like him... though I disagree with him on this. He's pretty funny and entertaining to me.

Exactly. And knows NOTHING.

 

[xc84]

Exactly. And knows NOTHING.

HOFer. I think he knows something.

 

[Otto'd]

HOFer. I think he knows something.

Not a college basketball hall of famer. Just a cringeworthy pitchman for the most painful Credit card ads Ive ever seen.

But seriously, let me ask you something. What college basketball knowledge has that clown ever laid on you during pre game or halftime?

Ive [icked opposite every pick he made in a tournament and made money multiple times.

 

[xc84]

I was talking well before 2013. You used to be able to get away with more but the games were higher scoring. One, coaches didn’t teach all the hand checking that goes on now. Two, teams were more fluid on O. So it was harder to hand check in the first place.

I think it is the opposite. They used to call it, and now they don't That's part of why scoring is down now and 3-point attempts are the thing and more of a focus. The defense gets away with a ton more today. Either way, I posted that the rules are virtually the same prior to 2013 v. 2013+.

 

[xc84]

Not a college basketball hall of famer. Just a cringeworthy pitchman for the most painful Credit card ads Ive ever seen.

But seriously, let me ask you something. What college basketball knowledge has that clown ever laid on you during pre game or halftime?

Ive [icked opposite every pick he made in a tournament and made money multiple times.

This is all subjective of course but I think Barkley is the star of the Capital One commercials despite them having actual actors on them. That's why a lot of them revolve around him.

As for what he has said. Damned if I know but you could ask me that about pretty much anyone and I would not have a quote to give you. I'll watch some more games and take notes next time.

Even guys like Vitale or Raftery, while knowledgeable, get paid because they are entertaining. Same for Barkley. People like the guy. (well, not you)

 

[Otto'd]

Even guys like Vitale or Raftery, while knowledgeable, get paid because they are entertaining. Same for Barkley. People like the guy. (well, not you)

Did you just mention Raftery (jesus even Vitale) in the same breath as Charles Barkley when it comes to College hoops?

 

[Ozone!]

Watching these tournament games and the rough plays without calls is akin to bumper cars​

 

[xc84]

Did you just mention Raftery (jesus even Vitale) in the same breath as Charles Barkley when it comes to College hoops?

So which point(s) do you disagree with?

1.Vitale or Raftery, while knowledgeable, get paid because they are entertaining.
2. Barkley gets paid for being entertaining.
3.People like Barkley (but you don't).

 

[cuseincincy]

This is all subjective of course but I think Barkley is the star of the Capital One commercials despite them having actual actors on them. That's why a lot of them revolve around him.

As for what he has said. Damned if I know but you could ask me that about pretty much anyone and I would not have a quote to give you. I'll watch some more games and take notes next time.

Even guys like Vitale or Raftery, while knowledgeable, get paid because they are entertaining. Same for Barkley. People like the guy. (well, not you)

I'd much rather hear Charles talk basketball than either Raftery or Vitale. I could probably speak Raf and Dicky V's lines as well as they do. They haven't changed in 30 years. Charles? You never know what he's going to say. He has a huge SEC bias but no worse than Vitale with Duke or Raftery to the Northeast.

 

[cuseincincy]

Not a college basketball hall of famer. Just a cringeworthy pitchman for the most painful Credit card ads Ive ever seen.

But seriously, let me ask you something. What college basketball knowledge has that clown ever laid on you during pre game or halftime?

Ive [icked opposite every pick he made in a tournament and made money multiple times.

Funny thing. If you'd bother educating yourself instead of just giving your opinion as fact you'd see that not only is Charles Barkley in the College Basketball Hall of Fame his name is the first listed in the inaugural class in 2006.

Players & Legends | Hall of Fame | College Basketball Experience

Discover the legends of college basketball. Read through the National Collegiate Basketball Hall of Fame's online player listings, history, and more.

collegebasketballexperience.com

 

[sufandu]

Really? I find they hardly ever call travels any more. They just say, "Euro Step":

That's what I mean. They're travels but they're not called.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

the reason basketball is hard to watch is because the dont call enough fouls not because its too soft.

I disagree. It’s because it’s not consistent. Not from game to game, ref to ref, half to half. I don’t actually care which way you call it, just be consistent from start to finish.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Yeah, so many of the ankle breaking crossovers or spin moves now are travels.

Or carries. Point is the same.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Except Rutchsman is able to turn balls into strikes.
Statcast Catcher Framing Leaderboard

Scooch: you seem locked in with this. My O’s sent down their #1 pitching prospect ( he is recovering from minor injury). Isn’t there a new rule about guys getting full season credit if they think the club was trying to manipulate service time? Thanks

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

If I knock the ball out of bounds, it’s the other team’s ball. - you knocked it out of bounds.

If I throw the ball and it hits the referee who is standing out of bounds, it’s the other team’s ball, because the ref was out of bounds. - the ref is part of the court. If he is out of bounds, they you threw the ball out of bounds.

If I throw the ball and it hits the opponent who is standing out of bounds, it’s my ball. - the ball was in play until the opponent touched it out of bounds. What if the guy who was out of bounds knocked the ball from your hands? Would that be ok? Of course not.

As to your last point, of course not. It enforces my point OB is OB. If he is standing OB and touches the ball in my hands, I believe it’s a “T”, because he is off the court.

I just think if you are OB and in throw it off of you, I have thrown it OB.

I don’t lose sleep over it

 

[xc84]

As to your last point, of course not. It enforces my point OB is OB. If he is standing OB and touches the ball in my hands, I believe it’s a “T”, because he is off the court.

I just think if you are OB and in throw it off of you, I have thrown it OB.

I don’t lose sleep over it

Well, what if he was defending you with a foot on the line and deflected a pass you threw. Since he was out of bounds, did you throw it out of bounds? Or is it your ball because it touched him while he was out of bounds? I mean we know it is your ball but do you think that is fair?

 

[Oakland]

I’ll use your post as a jumping off point for this comment, SWC. I’m not necessarily disagreeing.

I think a sport needs to set rules that are realistic given the way humans move and the way a game is naturally played.

To me, it’s not realistic to expect that humans running and jumping at breakneck speeds never make contact with one another. Yet that’s largely how basketball rules are established.

I’m a big believer that, across sports, rules should be set to penalize the egregious acts. So for hoops there should absolutely be rules against whacking someone’s arm or hand while they shoot, etc.

But incidental body contact on drives, or laying hands on someone like we say yesterday? Meh. I’d let that stuff go. Unless I saw that play incorrectly, he didn’t really grab or shove the ball handler.

Aside from that specific play, I just find long stretches of hoops to be tedious because there are whistles on every possession. It’s so rare for a game to have flow for more than a minute at a time. You just don’t see that in sports like hockey, soccer and lacrosse.

Pitino, Pitt, etc. luv your take. Somehow the NBA has cleaned up its game from the Detriot/NY Knick thugball of the 1990s. Don't know why college BB can't do it.

 

[CuseCPT]

I don't get the swallow the whistle crowd. Fouls should always only be called when they are obvious. If a ref isn't sure then he shouldn't guess and blow his whistle. The biggest problem with basketball refs is they call tendencies and not just what they see. I learned a lot sitting next to the OHSAA District head of officiating for a couple years. He would explain why a call was made and I would say "that's stupid" and he would respond "you asked why it was called, not whether it should have been." Biggest lesson I learned was on reach ins whether there is any contact or not..."if you reach up, no foul. If you reach down, they'll blow the whistle almost every time." Thats is actually teachable to players at least.

Yeah, and I don't get your crowd. But I guess if we did we'd be in different crowds. It's decided at birth. Ditto for whether or not running up the score is okay or not.