Tom Izzo at his PC today

[NKR1978]

I don't know if my memory serves me correctly or not, but didn't MCW's shoplifting charge magically become a misunderstanding? Different and less serious charge, but my point is not a single D1 program would come out unscathed if thoroughly investigated.

MSU isn't a blue blood school and they're good year after year. Maybe the powers that be don't like that. Watch out Jay Wright and Nova. Teams like UK, Duke and UNC can buy off any infractions. We all know what happened after SU won our lone Championship...

The system is a joke, and totally corrupt from the top down.

To me shoplifting, weed and academic fraud are literally nothing compared to the violence and sexual assault involved with MSU and Baylor.

 

[NKR1978]

I used the word ambush for effect, I probably should've used surprised, startled or stunned, take your pick. My larger point was that in no way, shape or form should he have answered or attempted to answer any of those questions in that particular forum, at that particular moment. It's a standard/contractual post game press conference, used to answer specific questions about the game that just ended. It's tough enough, at times, to answer questions about the game depending on the circumstances of it, and the typical high emotions that come as well immediately afterwards. Look how JB typically reacts at times when the post game questions are on point. Izzo is a fiery and emotional guy, and not in the proper mindset. This was not a news conference that the university called, prepared for, etc. to answer questions on this very sensitive subject matter. Human nature is quick to judge this or that, but it's easy from afar, when one has no idea what they would do under the same identical circumstances.

I agree that from a legal perspective that Izzo should never answer those questions in an open forum; but reporters wouldn't be doing their job if they didn't ask.

The guy is paid millions of dollars a year. He presumably isn't an idiot and knows what's coming. He should have prepared himself better so he didn't come off as awful as he did.

 

[Ryand877]

He looked like he hadn't slept in I don't know how long.

 

[SU94]

I can't watch the PC right now. Was it about the Nassar case or about the s e xual assaults allegedly committed by MSU basketball players?

If it's about the Nassar case, idk why Izzo would be under any obligation to field questions. He had no involvement in any of that.

If it's about the basketball players, then fair game, obviously.

My amateur opinion is that Dantoni is on a lot thinner ice than Izzo. Let's begin with he does not enjoy the same lofty stature of Izzo, and finish with the totality or number of alleged assaults (some perhaps proven, not certain of the particulars). Some might counter that a football team has 85 players and a hoops squad only 12-14, but I'd be surprised if they both go down.

Izzo's presser was awkward, but it has very little (if anything) to do with whether he'll retain his job.

 

[two3zone]

To me shoplifting, weed and academic fraud are literally nothing compared to the violence and s e xual assault involved with MSU and Baylor.

What about 30 year assistants playing around with young boys?

 

[orangecuse]

I don't know if my memory serves me correctly or not, but didn't MCW's shoplifting charge magically become a misunderstanding? Different and less serious charge, but my point is not a single D1 program would come out unscathed if thoroughly investigated.

MSU isn't a blue blood school and they're good year after year. Maybe the powers that be don't like that. Watch out Jay Wright and Nova. Teams like UK, Duke and UNC can buy off any infractions. We all know what happened after SU won our lone Championship...

The system is a joke, and totally corrupt from the top down.

Corruption from the top down is a cultural and systemic issue and is generally rampant in this country. It's derived from a society/societal leadership that places money and financial gain first and foremost, far above anything else, with morality being relatively insignificant or consequential. If you haven't seen any, go watch some of the documentaries on the financial crisis/great recession...'Inside Job' is just one of several. It's truly appalling.

 

[Scooch]

He looked like he hadn't slept in I don't know how long.

Yep, he looked and sounded awful.

I wonder how long it took for the victims of assault and rape by MSU players to sleep well?

 

[Ryand877]

Yep, he looked and sounded awful.

I wonder how long it took for the victims of assault and rape by MSU players to sleep well?

I agree. Didn't say I felt badly for him, just making an observation.

 

[cuseincincy]

Not defending Izzo or anyone else specifically, but the media is incredibly two faced. They are out to get Izzo and Dantonio right now but I guarantee if Izzo steps down he will have his choice of media organizations to work for. Dantonio probably won't because he has the personality of a rock.

 

[NKR1978]

What about 30 year assistants playing around with young boys?

Shows how incredibly well SU handled that aside from Boeheim's initial comments that it skated through that relatively unscathed to the point where most people don't bring it up or remember it.

 

[two3zone]

Shows how incredibly well SU handled that aside from Boeheim's initial comments that it skated through that relatively unscathed to the point where most people don't bring it up or remember it.

That's why I think it's premature in expecting Izzo to be fired or step down right away.

 

[Brooky03]

Can somebody summarize for me what Izzo did or did not do that's garnering all of the heat?

He let legally convicted players play basketball? Or he hid information that would have led to convictions? He saw video evidence, or otherwise witnessed crimes, that he ignored?

We're all in agreement that sexual assault allegations should be taken very seriously but should not result in punishment for the accused until after a finding of guilt or in the face of overwhelming evidence, yes? Does this involve women who reported their allegations to somebody other than a law enforcement official or lawyer?

 

[NKR1978]

That's why I think it's premature in expecting Izzo to be fired or step down right away.

He deserves the benefit of the doubt, but if more comes to light that he was basically MSU's version of Art Briles, then he has to go.

 

[orangecuse]

Can somebody summarize for me what Izzo did or did not do that's garnering all of the heat?

He let legally convicted players play basketball? Or he hid information that would have led to convictions? He saw video evidence, or otherwise witnessed crimes, that he ignored?

We're all in agreement that s e xual assault allegations should be taken very seriously but should not result in punishment for the accused until after a finding of guilt or in the face of overwhelming evidence, yes? Does this involve women who reported their allegations to somebody other than a law enforcement official or lawyer?

I think the questions you are asking are uncertain at this time. But, as typical, in our culture today, etc., as well as perception playing a large role here, he clearly didn't do himself any favors in the way he handled that female (OTL's) reporter's interrogation in yesterday's presser.

 

[justgold315]

Not defending Izzo or anyone else specifically, but the media is incredibly two faced. They are out to get Izzo and Dantonio right now but I guarantee if Izzo steps down he will have his choice of media organizations to work for. Dantonio probably won't because he has the personality of a rock.

I agree. The media is taking advantage of the Nassar case. I wonder if anything would be going on if the Nassar case did not ever happen. Izzo and Dantonio would probably still be golden boys

 

[RF2044]

I don't know if my memory serves me correctly or not, but didn't MCW's shoplifting charge magically become a misunderstanding? Different and less serious charge, but my point is not a single D1 program would come out unscathed if thoroughly investigated.

MSU isn't a blue blood school and they're good year after year. Maybe the powers that be don't like that. Watch out Jay Wright and Nova. Teams like UK, Duke and UNC can buy off any infractions. We all know what happened after SU won our lone Championship...

The system is a joke, and totally corrupt from the top down.

I'm not defending MCW here -- stealing is abhorrent. But the reason that he didn't face more significant penalties, IMO, is that he was never arrested, and there never was a "charge." He got pinched by mall security, and forced to pay a fine for attempting to shoplift in exchange for them not turning it into a police matter. MCW paid the fine, and that was the end of it.

A more discipline-oriented coach probably would have penalized MCW in some token way--missing a start, being forced to sit out a game, or something along those lines. But probably not much more than that. JB shrugged his shoulders because it WASN'T a legal matter, and never became one. Right, wrong, or indifferent -- and again, not defending MCW -- but it wasn't a "shoplifting charge."

 

[cuseinseattle]

Shows how incredibly well SU handled that aside from Boeheim's initial comments that it skated through that relatively unscathed to the point where most people don't bring it up or remember it.

I think what really helped Boeheim is that he had his foundation and all the good he had done. If he had never met Juli and gotten involved with that it might have been harder. I remember hearing people who weren't supporting him during that time even preface things they would say with we are not saying he is a bad man and he has done a lot of great things but these comments he made are harmful to victims. I don't know Izzo's background but I don't think he has that goodwill built up.

 

[STEVEHOLT]

I'm not defending MCW here -- stealing is abhorrent. But the reason that he didn't face more significant penalties, IMO, is that he was never arrested, and there never was a "charge." He got pinched by mall security, and forced to pay a fine for attempting to shoplift in exchange for them not turning it into a police matter. MCW paid the fine, and that was the end of it.

A more discipline-oriented coach probably would have penalized MCW in some token way--missing a start, being forced to sit out a game, or something along those lines. But probably not much more than that. JB shrugged his shoulders because it WASN'T a legal matter, and never became one. Right, wrong, or indifferent -- and again, not defending MCW -- but it wasn't a "shoplifting charge."

most memorable part of that entire incident was the estimated size of the mall security guard. must have been like 6'9 400

 

[cuseinseattle]

I'm not defending MCW here -- stealing is abhorrent. But the reason that he didn't face more significant penalties, IMO, is that he was never arrested, and there never was a "charge." He got pinched by mall security, and forced to pay a fine for attempting to shoplift in exchange for them not turning it into a police matter. MCW paid the fine, and that was the end of it.

A more discipline-oriented coach probably would have penalized MCW in some token way--missing a start, being forced to sit out a game, or something along those lines. But probably not much more than that. JB shrugged his shoulders because it WASN'T a legal matter, and never became one. Right, wrong, or indifferent -- and again, not defending MCW -- but it wasn't a "shoplifting charge."

Totally agree. It wasn't a shoplifting charge and before the time of smart phones it wouldn't probably have been known.

 

[Cheriehoop]

most memorable part of that entire incident was the estimated size of the mall security guard. must have been like 6'9 400

and the value of what he stole - like $100 for if I remember correctly for a bathrobe.

 

[br801]

He looked like he hadn't slept in I don't know how long.

But he always looks like that.

 

[Jake]

Not defending Izzo or anyone else specifically, but the media is incredibly two faced. They are out to get Izzo and Dantonio right now but I guarantee if Izzo steps down he will have his choice of media organizations to work for. Dantonio probably won't because he has the personality of a rock.

Hmm. Not so sure about that. Art Briles isn't getting a media gig. Nor is Pitino.

If Pitino had retired 2 years ago, he'd be making a fortune on TV. Literally he was a walking license to print money. Not now.

I can't overestimate how toxic the environment is right now for anyone involved in violence against women.

If Izzo has to step down because of this, no one is putting him on their broadcast. NO ONE.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Revenue athletics (and sometimes even non-revenue) can be a cesspool that warps the thinking of those who benefit most from them.

 

[Scooch]

I agree. Didn't say I felt badly for him, just making an observation.

Totally get it. Apologies if I came off harsh.

 

[Scooch]

Not defending Izzo or anyone else specifically, but the media is incredibly two faced. They are out to get Izzo and Dantonio right now but I guarantee if Izzo steps down he will have his choice of media organizations to work for. Dantonio probably won't because he has the personality of a rock.

Come on, if Izzo resigns because he let assaulters and rapists go without punishment he is not getting a TV gig. No publicly traded media company has any stomach for the sh!tshow that would ensue.