UNC at SU - Morning After Video Stills

[Fly Rodder]

Ugh, just a brutal loss. That's been covered. Couple of things I saw in the closing minutes that jump out.

1) Second to last (relevant) offensive play by SU, Judah drives in, shakes off Davis and takes a quick jumper. All other SU players are otherwise removed from the play, two are screened (Maliq, and Bell), one is being grabbed by Bacot (Jesse), and Joe - for some reason - is near halfcourt as the safety (I understand having a safety, but I don't like it being Joe, a weak defender and better offensive player). The refs are all watching the play. Bacot is handsy, but he's not pulling or grabbing, the arm allows him to simply pivot around Jesse and box him out. This is basic basketball, don't get screened or boxed out. Maliq is trying but Nance does a good job keeping him out of the play. Bell or Joe can't help at all. Two points here changes the game bigly.

2) Nance's missed FT that goes out of bounds which Joe saves for an easy UNC bucket. Ugh. Bacot just pushes Hima in the back and moves him from the top of the charge circle to well under the basket. No call. This is an egregious non-call right here. Two refs have a good look at what is happening. Its in the open and not in a scrum and they are looking right at the players. If Bacot gets whistled, that's 5 on him, SU would have the ball up 1 with 20 seconds left. Neither Joe or Maliq box out Black, who gets the best chance at the board, but Bacot knocks it out of his hands and then Joe saves the ball by passing to directly to Nance

Maliq, Judah, and Bell, completely ignore the 6'10" Nance who follows his miss and puts in an easy go-ahead bucket.

3) Last play relevant offensive play. A touch over 14 seconds remaining as Judah crosses halfcourt. Joe and Bell trailing the play, Maliq and Benny already inside the three point area, but they pretty much just stand back and watch. Joe never catches up

 

[two3zone]

Ugh, just a brutal loss. That's been covered. Couple of things I saw in the closing minutes that jump out.

1) Second to last (relevant) offensive play by SU, Judah drives in, shakes off Davis and takes a quick jumper. All other SU players are otherwise removed from the play, two are screened (Maliq, and Bell), one is being grabbed by Bacot (Jesse), and Joe - for some reason - is near halfcourt as the safety (I understand having a safety, but I don't like it being Joe, a weak defender and better offensive player). The refs are all watching the play. Bacot is handsy, but he's not pulling or grabbing, the arm allows him to simply pivot around Jesse and box him out. This is basic basketball, don't get screened or boxed out. Maliq is trying but Nance does a good job keeping him out of the play. Bell or Joe can't help at all. Two points here changes the game bigly.

View attachment 224471

2) Nance's missed FT that goes out of bounds which Joe saves for an easy UNC bucket. Ugh. Bacot just pushes Hima in the back and moves him from the top of the charge circle to well under the basket. No call. This is an egregious non-call right here. Two refs have a good look at what is happening. Its in the open and not in a scrum and they are looking right at the players. If Bacot gets whistled, that's 5 on him, SU would have the ball up 1 with 20 seconds left. Neither Joe or Maliq box out Black, who gets the best chance at the board, but Bacot knocks it out of his hands and the Joe saves the ball by passing to directly to Nance


View attachment 224474

Maliq, Judah, and Bell, completely ignore the 6'10" Nance who follows his miss and puts in an easy go-ahead bucket.

View attachment 224475

3) Last play relevant offensive play. A touch over 14 seconds remaining as Judah crosses halfcourt. Joe and Bell trailing the play, Maliq and Benny already inside the three point area, but they pretty much just stand back and watch. Joe never catches up
View attachment 224477

The last one, little time came off the clock, Judah should’ve slowed it down a second or two. Simple

 

[Fly Rodder]

Last play continued. Judah is taking it to the house, Davis is sagging him, but constantly moving his feet and is never set. There are two referees directly watching the play.

At no point does Davis set his feet. He's already been clocked in this still, it happened super fast, but his feet are still shuffling. There's zero chance that this is a charge. I'm changing this up. I think it can be called a charge, but it's really iffy.

From the NCAA: Additionally, the defending player is not allowed to move in any direction before contact occurs (except vertically to block a shot).

But ultimately, as I've posted elsewhere, my biggest issue with it is that SU does this waaaaaay too often.

 

[Orangezoo]

The last one, little time came off the clock, Judah should’ve slowed it down a second or two. Simple

While it never should have gotten to that point he has to know his teammates here. You don't go straight in with the best player on the team out of the picture.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I still don't understand why Brown, Bell, and Mintz just stood there when Joe went to the ball. Lots of heat on Joe, but everyone failed on that possession.

 

[Trueblue25]

I find it hilarious the board blames Judah

That was an obvious blocking foul by the UNC defender.

It looks like Judah’s “out of control” because the defender gave him no space to operate. Davis is in motion the entire play and gets elbowed because he’s essentially reaching with his face in the path of a scoring move. He never sets his feet. You dont get a charge because you’re back pedaling in defense, thats a block.

It’s all ridiculous. Not a flagrant and hardly an offensive foul.

 

[Brooky03]

On the missed FT, Maliq inexplicably made no effort to box out Black. I don’t know if he expected our 6’ guard to do it or what. I noticed it last night when I rewatched the play and steam started shooting from my ears. If he just puts a body on him Joe catches the rebound pretty much uncontested. And I’m confident the ball was going OOB off of Girard after it was tipped (by Black, I think).

 

[Brooky03]

I find it hilarious the board blames Judah

That was an obvious blocking foul by the UNC defender.

It looks like Judah’s “out of control” because the defender gave him no space to operate. Davis is in motion the entire play and gets elbow because he’s essentially reaching with his face in the path of a scoring move.

It’s all ridiculous. Not a flagrant and hardly an offensive foul.

I still can’t wrap my head around the ‘out of control’ criticism on that play. I don’t know what was so out of control about it.

 

[Orangezoo]

I find it hilarious the board blames Judah

That was an obvious blocking foul by the UNC defender.

It looks like Judah’s “out of control” because the defender gave him no space to operate. Davis is in motion the entire play and gets elbowed because he’s essentially reaching with his face in the path of a scoring move. He never sets his feet. You dont get a charge because you’re back pedaling in defense, thats a block.

It’s all ridiculous. Not a flagrant and hardly an offensive foul.

And never should have been necessary had earlier calls been made properly.

I don't put it all on Judah- still think you take the time you have and look to find Joe here though. Really bugged me how much Davis went full on FIFA regarding the contact. Sure seemed to have the officials attention with how much "pain" he was in.

 

[Fly Rodder]

After the collision it looks like the trailing ref called a block and the ref under the basket calls the charge.
I'm not an expert on these hand signals, so maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Cusefan0307]

After the collision it looks like the trailing ref called a block and the ref under the basket calls the charge.
I'm not an expert on these hand signals, so maybe I'm wrong.

View attachment 224481

Which makes zero sense to me because how in the world did Ayers have a better view than him?

 

[Brooky03]

After the collision it looks like the trailing ref called a block and the ref under the basket calls the charge.
I'm not an expert on these hand signals, so maybe I'm wrong.

View attachment 224481

afaik, that’s just the signal that he has a foul call on the play. It doesn’t indicate if it’s a block or charge. Charge = hand behind head, block = hands on hips.

 

[Fly Rodder]

I still don't understand why Brown, Bell, and Mintz just stood there when Joe went to the ball. Lots of heat on Joe, but everyone failed on that possession.

That's three freshmen who are getting schooled by a team of 28-year old G-league guys. OK, so they're not 28, but that's a team of seniors.

 

[NYCCuse826]

After the collision it looks like the trailing ref called a block and the ref under the basket calls the charge.
I'm not an expert on these hand signals, so maybe I'm wrong.

View attachment 224481

It just means there's a foul. Not an indicator of who committed it.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Last play continued. Judah is taking it to the house, Davis is sagging him, but constantly moving his feet and is never set. There are two referees directly watching the play.

View attachment 224478

View attachment 224480

View attachment 224479

At no point does Davis set his feet. He's already been clocked in this still, it happened super fast, but his feet are still shuffling. There's zero chance that this is a charge.

Easy for me to say but I still think Judah should have continued going right instead of trying a euro step crossing over to his left. Judah had a step on him and Davis was to Judah’s left. Was Judah trying to get it to Benny? (Who I wish had cut towards the basket earlier). Young Judah is so fast and talented though as a freshman.

 

[NineOneSeven]

I have a lot of problems with the FT alignment. The obvious is to pinch down on Bacot and sandwich their clear best rebounder. Why Brown AND Bell appeared to "shade" to box out the shooter is extremely odd. Look how much space Bacot has! Foul or not, that's terrible. Why was Joe even in the paint? You can make a sub after the first FT, right? Seems like a pretty good time to not have Joe and Mintz in together there. We also have a timeout left anyway to sub back in who you want post FT, make or miss.

And I say again... we had to assume a miss and nothing else mattered.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Easy for me to say but I still think Judah should have continued going right instead of trying a euro step crossing over to his left. Judah had a step on him and Davis was to Judah’s left. Was Judah trying to get it to Benny? (Who I wish had cut towards the basket earlier) .

Absolutely agree.

 

[NYCCuse826]

I still can’t wrap my head around the ‘out of control’ criticism on that play. I don’t know what was so out of control about it.

It's the go-to criticism when he does something wrong. He did what you'd ask in that situation. The only thing I'd like to see in that scenario is adding the stop and pop to his repertoire. Use the defender's momentum against them with a sudden stop to clear space.

 

[djcon57]

2) Nance's missed FT that goes out of bounds which Joe saves for an easy UNC bucket. Ugh. Bacot just pushes Hima in the back and moves him from the top of the charge circle to well under the basket. No call. This is an egregious non-call right here. Two refs have a good look at what is happening. Its in the open and not in a scrum and they are looking right at the players. If Bacot gets whistled, that's 5 on him, SU would have the ball up 1 with 20 seconds left. Neither Joe or Maliq box out Black, who gets the best chance at the board, but Bacot knocks it out of his hands and then Joe saves the ball by passing to directly to Nance


View attachment 224474

Maliq, Judah, and Bell, completely ignore the 6'10" Nance who follows his miss and puts in an easy go-ahead bucket.

Maliq had his moments, but he was in outer space for 55% of the game. I have no idea what he's doing on that play. He HAS to get that board. Its the main reason he's in the game

 

[two3zone]

I find it hilarious the board blames Judah

That was an obvious blocking foul by the UNC defender.

It looks like Judah’s “out of control” because the defender gave him no space to operate. Davis is in motion the entire play and gets elbowed because he’s essentially reaching with his face in the path of a scoring move. He never sets his feet. You dont get a charge because you’re back pedaling in defense, thats a block.

It’s all ridiculous. Not a flagrant and hardly an offensive foul.

Gotta bush up on the rules. As defined it is, you can disagree with the rule, but it wasn’t an egregious call.

 

[Fly Rodder]

You dont get a charge because you’re back pedaling in defense, thats a block.

I don't blame Judah and he is definitely not the first SU player to drive with the ball for the last points and then get whistled for a charge. This is the result of an offensive philosophy where the head coach with 50+ years of experience puts the decision making on a kid with 1-2 years of D1 experience. It happens to SU every year, at least once if not 5 times.

It's a terrible idea to force a ref to make a decision on the last play of the game. I'm tired of watching a final "play" knowing that it's going to be a 1-1 ISO drive (or a Tyus Battle step-back jumper with one foot inside the 3P line) which will result in a charge call.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Easy for me to say but I still think Judah should have continued going right instead of trying a euro step crossing over to his left. Judah had a step on him and Davis was to Judah’s left. Was Judah trying to get it to Benny? (Who I wish had cut towards the basket earlier) .

Yeah, hindsight is always 20-20. I started putting these together because I wanted to look at who was where, where were they looking, and what was the overall (apparent) plan. Watching in realtime once or a select replay doesn't really do it justice. But the stills make it easier to see how little things can change the outcome of a play.

ETA: what I've seen in the last few games, when looking at the stills, is that this team has a definite issue with just standing around and watching plays unfold. It's highly aggravating.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Maliq had his moments, but he was in outer space for 55% of the game. I have no idea what he's doing on that play. He HAS to get that board. Its the main reason he's in the game

HIs first ten minutes he was an absolute zero, but then turned it up a bit. I think this was a game where he just got big-boyed by talented and much more experienced players and it knocked him out of his usual rhythm.

 

[djcon57]

HIs first ten minutes he was an absolute zero, but then turned it up a bit. I think this was a game where he just got big-boyed by talented and much more experienced players and it knocked him out of his usual rhythm.

Definitely fair take.

 

[CorduroyG]

I don't blame Judah and he is definitely not the first SU player to drive with the ball for the last points and then get whistled for a charge. This is the result of an offensive philosophy where the head coach with 50+ years of experience puts the decision making on a kid with 1-2 years of D1 experience. It happens to SU every year, at least once if not 5 times.

It's a terrible idea to force a ref to make a decision on the last play of the game. I'm tired of watching a final "play" knowing that it's going to be a 1-1 ISO drive (or a Tyus Battle step-back jumper with one foot inside the 3P line) which will result in a charge call.

yup. im so sick of watching our guys get screwed with bs charge calls late in games, but its the same damn play over and over and over. how bout we run a play to get an open jumper?? we make it too easy for the defense, they know whats coming. pg is gonna drive, just get in his way