We’re just unlucky too

[OttoinGrotto]

Even if you want to absolve the Zone and focus on Offense, it stills comes back to the Zone.

We recruit for it, and if some want to argue we don’t, it’s pretty clear we have trouble recruiting elite players because of it. It’s documented as the reason we aren’t on certain players radars.

Let’s be real, maybe this changes next year, but why did we go after Chukwu? I think we all know why. Why did we go after a tall shooting guard to be our point guard? I think we all know why. There’s your answer as to why our offense sucked last year and this year.

Eh, sorta.

I don't think we're as limited offensively as we look. I think our system isn't very good, and we also play really lazy offense. I think offense has become a weakness in how Jimmy B coaches.

 

[syrBossHogg]

Last year teams made .318 of their 3's against us, 22nd best 3PT defense in the country for us. This year with the same cast of players, teams made .329 of their 3's against us, 90th best 3PT defense in the country. Did teams get that much better at shooting or did we get a little unlucky this year? Who knows. Having said that, sometimes you have to make your own luck. Have a solid backup defense would be a wise decision

 

[Millhouse]

I can save you lots of time. Teams shot 32% from 3 against Syracuse and that includes Virginia having the greatest shooting game of all time against us, and Baylor shooting high 40's with the help of 2 banked in threes. Syracuse wasn't getting lit up left and right from 3 this year and you are wrong.

i think it's fair to say that the distribution of 3p% against is a little wider than other teams but i think people are overdoing it - you can't get torched all the time and still be ok overall

 

[br801]

Last year teams made .318 of their 3's against us, 22nd best 3PT defense in the country for us. This year with the same cast of players, teams made .329 of their 3's against us, 90th best 3PT defense in the country. Did teams get that much better at shooting or did we get a little unlucky this year? Who knows. Having said that, sometimes you have to make your own luck. Have a solid backup defense would be a wise decision

Last season it was Battle and Howard at the top of the zone almost exclusively. This season you had two freshmen in the mix up top for significant minutes. Still, the difference is only one made three per 100 attempts, which could be the result of a handful of "lucky" makes.

 

[Millhouse]

People may say I’m crazy but Baylor 1/10 today from 3 and have had some open looks. Teams were extra lucky vs us this year too. It happens. UConn even went Bizerk vs us

baylor is incredibly stupid here at the end of the game

i'm also tired of the white guy with the ingrown toenail laying there like he's dying every time he gets fouled

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Last season it was Battle and Howard at the top of the zone almost exclusively. This season you had two freshmen in the mix up top for significant minutes. Still, the difference is only one made three per 100 attempts, which could be the result of a handful of "lucky" makes.

Frank wasn't moving around as well.

Marek at over Hughes at might make a difference.

Who knows.

 

[syrBossHogg]

Last season it was Battle and Howard at the top of the zone almost exclusively. This season you had two freshmen in the mix up top for significant minutes. Still, the difference is only one made three per 100 attempts, which could be the result of a handful of "lucky" makes.

Very true, I'll also add that Chukwu was a little more inconsistent this year than last. He even got benched for a conference game (Clemson) but was able to finish the season stronger

 

[Millhouse]

Eh, sorta.

I don't think we're as limited offensively as we look. I think our system isn't very good, and we also play really lazy offense. I think offense has become a weakness in how Jimmy B coaches.

i think the zone is the reason for that, indirectly, because of the tradeoffs between big guards vs good guards (when big good guards are hard to get)

 

[General20]

Hmm I am wrong, eh?... So only 2 teams lit us up from 3 this year??

Try six teams with 10 or more 3 pointers against us. The percentages aren't pretty either:

Team | Date | Result | 3-Pt Att | 3-Pt %

uconn | 11/15 | loss | 12-21 | 57.1%

vpi | 1/26 | loss | 14-30 | 46.7%

fsu | 2/5 | loss | 11-22 | 50.0%

uva | 3/4 | loss | 18-25 | 72.0%

pitt | 3/13 | win | 10-23 | 43.5%

baylor | 3/21 | loss | 16-34 | 47.1%

There was also a number of teams that had (9) 3-pointers against us that are not listed above.

3 of those games were this month.

So 6 times teams shot well from 3 against Syracuse, if you define shooting well as 10+ threes and over 40%.

Syracuse did that 8 times in ACC play alone so I guess nobody in the ACC can play D either.

 

[kingtidge]

Very true, I'll also add that Chukwu was a little more inconsistent this year than last. He even got benched for a conference game (Clemson) but was able to finish the season stronger

He sometimes gets a little flailing with the ping pong paddles...

 

[OttoinGrotto]

i think the zone is the reason for that, indirectly, because of the tradeoffs between big guards vs good guards (when big good guards are hard to get)

Again, I think that's part, but not all of it.

There are programs with lesser talent that run much better offenses. Their action is cleaner. Passing is more crisp. Guys fight more for position and are more active creating space. The angles set for screens and picks are better.

I've long believed we don't help ourselves enough. There are things we could do to make the game easier on the offensive end, that we just don't.

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

Man D can get on 3 pt shooters quicker

 

[kingtidge]

So 6 times teams shot well from 3 against Syracuse, if you define shooting well as 10+ threes and over 40%.

Syracuse did that 8 times in ACC play alone so I guess nobody in the ACC can play D either.

10 threes dropping is 30 pts.

That's a half of basketball for a lot of teams.

The point is, you claimed that only two teams lit us up from 3 this season.

Your claim is false.

We got shellacked from three in 6 games this season and 3 of those games were this month.

 

[General20]

10 threes dropping is 30 pts.

That's a half of basketball for a lot of teams.

The point is you claimed that only two teams lit us up from 3 this season.

Your claim is false.

We got shellacked from three in 6 games this season and 3 of those games were this month.

Okay but we did it more to our opponents thsn our opponents did it to us, and we were a mediocre team this year, so isnt that an indication that our game plan is succesful?

 

[br801]

Frank wasn't moving around as well.

Marek at over Hughes at might make a difference.

Who knows.

Yes, Frank was definitely not the same player defensively this season. And the team as a whole never really gelled on the defensive end for long stretches, even though the pieces seemed to be there. Last season they were really locking down opponents consistently at the end of the year.

 

[kingtidge]

Okay but we did it more to our opponents thsn our opponents did it to us, and we were a mediocre team this year, so isnt that an indication that our game plan is succesful?

It is.

Hopefully we can finish middle of the pack ACC with a handful of dumb losses, sneak by the bubble once more, and get bounced in the first game of the NCAA's again next year.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

Baylor is getting similar looks against Gonzaga as they got against us and just and missing badly. I still think our game would have turned out much differently had they not banked in 2 early against us.

Nope. The pressure defense was the difference

 

[Cowtown]

People may say I’m crazy but Baylor 1/10 today from 3 and have had some open looks. Teams were extra lucky vs us this year too. It happens. UConn even went Bizerk vs us

Our defense gave Baylor way too much room in the perimeter especially in the first half. Gonzaga, in both m2m and zone extended out more than we did. They have better athletes out there. Not a knock, just an observation.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

If we could play man we win going away. Last time we tried, we got our doors blown off by a Division 8 team, in our building.

6 FREAKING YEARS AGO...these kids were in grade school then

 

[CsonkaStash]

We could have definitely hung with Gonzaga. It’s amazing that Baylor shot 19 percent with some decent looks from 3

 

[blust2i3d4]

I think we could have hung with the Zags actually

We should have been leading after the first half, like we did against UNC, Duke and Virginia. But The size of Zags should prevail in the end. It would be a better game than Baylor-Zags.

 

[General20]

Nope. The pressure defense was the difference

Baylor scored 71 against Gonzaga and 78 against us, including 2 banked in 3s. Take thise two lucky 3s away and Baylor scored 1 more point against us than the 1 seed, and that includes us giving them free foul shots at the end to stop the clock.

I think the difference was Gonzagas 83 points.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

Baylor scored 71 against Gonzaga and 78 against us, including 2 banked in 3s. Take thise two lucky 3s away and Baylor scored 1 more point against us than the 1 seed, and that includes us giving them free foul shots at the end to stop the clock.

I think the difference was Gonzagas 83 points.

Thanks!

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

Thanks!

Baylor scored 71 against Gonzaga and 78 against us, including 2 banked in 3s. Take thise two lucky 3s away and Baylor scored 1 more point against us than the 1 seed, and that includes us giving them free foul shots at the end to stop the clock.

I think the difference was Gonzagas 83 points.

As Cowtown said earlier...

Our defense gave Baylor way too much room in the perimeter especially in the first half. Gonzaga, in both m2m and zone extended out more than we did. They have better athletes out there. Not a knock, just an observation.

 

[General20]

As Cowtown said earlier...

Our defense gave Baylor way too much room in the perimeter especially in the first half. Gonzaga, in both m2m and zone extended out more than we did. They have better athletes out there. Not a knock, just an observation.

No doubt they have better athletes. They are a 1 seed for a reason. They are better than us.