What constitutes a Syracuse hoops legend?

[Alsacs]

If GMac isn't a legend, than nobody in the history of Syracuse basketball is a legend.

That is your opinion and that is rational and perfectly sound. A lot of people who disagree with everything I say agreed with you so that made me laugh.
I don't think GMac is a legend in my book. He is a great player and somebody who gave us everything he had for 4 years. We can agree to disagree he had a lot of great moments. I personally have a threshold like the baseball HOF I feel legends are the creme de la creme. I feel GMac is just below that.

 

[jekelish]

Buy a dictionary. Look up the definition of legend.

Then come back and try to argue popularity doesn't matter.
Wait, let me save you the trouble.

************
an extremely famous or notorious person, especially in a particular field.
"the man was a living legend"
synonyms: celebrity, star, superstar, icon, phenomenon, luminary, leading light, giant; More
*********

You know what I don't see in that definition. "Accomplished". Therefore, wins is not a factor.

Here's the way I look at GMac: he's basically our Paul Bunyan. The legend of GMac is very real, and will only get bigger the longer he stays on the coaching staff and, potentially, winds up as the Hop to Hop's JB.

It's kind of hard to believe anyone could have sat in a crowd of 30k in the Dome, the entire place shaking with the chant of "GER-RY!" and not believe he's a legend.

 

[HOFCeluck]

That is your opinion and that is rational and perfectly sound. A lot of people who disagree with everything I say agreed with you so that made me laugh.
I don't think GMac is a legend in my book. He is a great player and somebody who gave us everything he had for 4 years. We can agree to disagree he had a lot of great moments. I personally have a threshold like the baseball HOF I feel legends are the creme de la creme. I feel GMac is just below that.

Next thing you're going to say Billy Celluck isn't a legend...

 

[Alsacs]

If Syracuse created an all-time with 12 players who makes it?
PG- Pearl
SG- Bing
SF- Carmelo
PF- Wallace
C- Coleman
Bench: Douglas, Bouie, Louie Orr, Moten, Owens, Warrick and I guess McNamara.

12th man I picked Gmac over Stevie Thompson.

 

[stone567]

I feel like someone, anyone, should use the line Joe Pesci did in My cousin Vinnie. everything that guy just said is B###. Pearl played with Rony and raf, to name just a couple. He wasn't playing without talent. I loved Pearl but to say that G-mac is argubly a legend is off base, he had 6 3's in the title game but to say Pace and Edelin won us the game is ridiculous. Without those 6 3's, we lose. Bad. And Gerry won us a Big East tournament, pearl didn't. Gerry hit the shot that Pearl didn't make against St John's. Pearl put us on the map. But Gerry accomplished more at syracuse. And the 43 pts against BYU was amazing. Gerry is also the 4th leading scorer in Syracuse history. He averaged the same pts a game as Pearl did for his career.

To say that GMac accomplished more than Pearl at Syracuse is absolutely the most ludicrous thing I have ever heard. Pearl was a two time All-American. How many times was GMac on the All-American teams???? You obviously did not see Pearl play. Comparing the points per game is not fair, considering there was no three point play when Pearl played. and GMac was a three point shooter. Make those adjustments and talk to me. And as for the Big East Tournament (for the little it is worth), are you really to compare the competition that Pearl played against to what GMac did??? Pearl won most valuable player in a losing effort, which is amazing in and of itself. GMac's best year was his freshman year.

Actually, you are incorrect. In the second half of the title game, Kansas adjusted to shut down Gerry. Carmelo was hurt. It was Pace and Edelin who kept us in the lead the second half.

 

[Alsacs]

Next thing you're going to say Billy Celluck isn't a legend...

You know Troy Nunes isn't an actually a magician right? I hope I don't ruin the truth for any young kids in your household.

 

[stone567]

If Syracuse created an all-time with 12 players who makes it?
PG- Pearl
SG- Bing
SF- Carmelo
PF- Wallace
C- Coleman
Bench: Douglas, Bouie, Louie Orr, Moten, Owens, Warrick and I guess McNamara.

12th man I picked Gmac over Stevie Thompson.

I like your selections. I would probably have to get Seikaly on that list. Too good a senior year.

 

[stone567]

So it's OK that Pearl never won anything because of a lack of surrounding talent, but you hold that against McNamara?

Eta, it's could NOT care less. "I could care less about popularity" makes no sense in the context of the idea you're trying to convey.

That is your opinion and that is rational and perfectly sound. A lot of people who disagree with everything I say agreed with you so that made me laugh.
I don't think GMac is a legend in my book. He is a great player and somebody who gave us everything he had for 4 years. We can agree to disagree he had a lot of great moments. I personally have a threshold like the baseball HOF I feel legends are the creme de la creme. I feel GMac is just below that.

You put that perfectly.

 

[HOFCeluck]

You know Troy Nunes isn't an actually a magician right? I hope I don't ruin the truth for any young kids in your household.

Whoa

 

[Jake]

To say that GMac accomplished more than Pearl at Syracuse is absolutely the most ludicrous thing I have ever heard. Pearl was a two time All-American. How many times was GMac on the All-American teams???? You obviously did not see Pearl play. Comparing the points per game is not fair, considering there was no three point play when Pearl played. and GMac was a three point shooter. Make those adjustments and talk to me. And as for the Big East Tournament (for the little it is worth), are you really to compare the competition that Pearl played against to what GMac did??? Pearl won most valuable player in a losing effort, which is amazing in and of itself. GMac's best year was his freshman year. Actually, you are incorrect. In the second half of the title game, Kansas adjusted to shut down Gerry. Carmelo was hurt. It was Pace and Edelin who kept us in the lead the second half.

Wait, are you saying you watched pearl play and think his scoring average would go up if he played with the three point line? Seriously? Did you watch him actually play.

He probably made one three his entire career, and it was from half court.

Not arguing that Pearl wasn't a legend, because he's #1 on my list, but you can't argue that he was a three point threat.

And for the record...Seikaly, triche, Addison Alexis > trob, dnic, Mookie & Devo.

 

[stone567]

So it's OK that Pearl never won anything because of a lack of surrounding talent, but you hold that against McNamara?

Eta, it's could NOT care less. "I could care less about popularity" makes no sense in the context of the idea you're trying to convey.

With Pearl, we were still ascending to a national power and we had to play Ewing, Mullin, Berry, Pickney (all time greats) twice a year. Pearl always made us better.
With McNamara, we were descending. We were absolutely awful his senior year, and McNamara did not make us better (I do take into account he was injured, but his decision-making was not good his senior year)

 

[stone567]

Wait, are you saying you watched pearl play and think his scoring average would go up if he played with the three point line? Seriously? Did you watch him actually play.

He probably made one three his entire career, and it was from half court.

Not arguing that Pearl wasn't a legend, because he's #1 on my list, but you can't argue that he was a three point threat.

And for the record...Seikaly, triche, Addison Alexis > trob, dnic, Mookie & Devo.

The point is that GMac's scoring average goes way down if you take out the three point play. You cannot compare points per game average because of it. they played in a different era.

 

[Forza Azzurri]

With Pearl, we were still ascending to a national power and we had to play Ewing, Mullin, Berry, Pickney (all time greats) twice a year. Pearl always made us better.
With McNamara, we were descending. We were absolutely awful his senior year, and McNamara did not make us better (I do take into account he was injured, but his decision-making was not good his senior year)

You think that 05-06 team would have had the same record without GMAC?

 

[stone567]

Wait, are you saying you watched pearl play and think his scoring average would go up if he played with the three point line? Seriously? Did you watch him actually play.

He probably made one three his entire career, and it was from half court.

Not arguing that Pearl wasn't a legend, because he's #1 on my list, but you can't argue that he was a three point threat.

And for the record...Seikaly, triche, Addison Alexis > trob, dnic, Mookie & Devo.

As for the issue of surrounding talent, my issue is that GMac was a better player when he had surrounding talent. It just didn't matter with Pearl. He was dominant force regardless.

 

[HOFCeluck]

With Pearl, we were still ascending to a national power and we had to play Ewing, Mullin, Berry, Pickney (all time greats) twice a year. Pearl always made us better.
With McNamara, we were descending. We were absolutely awful his senior year, and McNamara did not make us better (I do take into account he was injured, but his decision-making was not good his senior year)

you think we "descended" because of gmac?

 

[jekelish]

With Pearl, we were still ascending to a national power and we had to play Ewing, Mullin, Berry, Pickney (all time greats) twice a year. Pearl always made us better.
With McNamara, we were descending. We were absolutely awful his senior year, and McNamara did not make us better (I do take into account he was injured, but his decision-making was not good his senior year)

Wait - you don't think GMac made us better his senior year? I know a certain Hall of Fame coach who would adamantly disagree with you on that:

 

[Jake]

Gmac has a ring. Pearl doesn't. Now, gmac had Carmelo, but in all honesty, Pearls last game was the biggest choke in Syracuse history up to that point.

We lost at HOME to a team we crushed earlier in that season.

How anyone can argue that Gerry isn't a cuse basketball legend is just incredulous to me.

 

[stone567]

As for the issue of surrounding talent, my issue is that GMac was a better player when he had surrounding talent. It just didn't matter with Pearl. He was dominant force regardless.

And look at the FG%, Pearl was a ridiculous 53%. Different eras. Pearl was one of the best players in the country for two of his three years (and he was a phenom his freshman year). You cannot say that about GMac.

 

[realorange]

I agree you have to be a great player, but I can't disagree more about popularity. Popularity is a massive factor in creating the legend.

Calling Phil Rizzuto. More popular than great player.

 

[jekelish]

Another reason GMac is a legend: outside of Pearl, who in Syracuse basketball history has ever been as beloved as Gerry McNamara? I know, I know, "popularity doesn't matter"...except it absolutely does when determining legends.

And look at the FG%, Pearl was a ridiculous 53%. Different eras. Pearl was one of the best players in the country for two of his three years (and he was a phenom his freshman year). You cannot say that about GMac.

Of course his field goal percentage was better than Gerry's. Pearl's game was driving and slashing. Gerry's was shooting long jumpers. One was a 6-3, physical guard who was tremendous at getting into the paint. The other was a 5-10 kid who was basically Little Mac from Mike Tyson: Punchout. Throwing haymakers FAR above his weight class and still coming out on top more often than not.

 

[Jake]

And look at the FG%, Pearl was a ridiculous 53%. Different eras. Pearl was one of the best players in the country for two of his three years (and he was a phenom his freshman year). You cannot say that about GMac.

Agreed, but their both legends.

 

[stone567]

Wait - you don't think GMac made us better his senior year? I know a certain Hall of Fame coach who would adamantly disagree with you on that:

Boeheim always has his player's back when it comes from the outside. This means nothing.

 

[stone567]

Ultimately, this entire thread proves my point. People agree and disagree with me about GMac being a legend. It is debatable and a point of argument.

Not hearing a whole lot about the status of Pearl.

 

[pfister1]

My Syracuse Legends

Bing, Pearl, Coleman, GMAC, Melo, Louie & Bouie (as a pair not individually) & Sherm. In my view those guys are the ones whose names will endure for a variety of reasons including ability, results, personality, and fan appeal. These guys are known to everyone the real basketball fans as well as the casual observer and their fame transcends (or will transcend) generations.

The next level of guys in my view:

Moten, Owens, Wallace, Warrick. These guys are program greats, that will always be considered program greats by real basketball fans, but may not be as well remembered among the casual fans, especially as time marches on.

There are many other great players, but I think they blend in with everyone else and don't really have that quality that keeps their name in the forefront of the minds of the entire fanbase.

 

[jekelish]

Boeheim always has his player's back when it comes from the outside. This means nothing.

Right. Means absolutely nothing. No way Boeheim actually believed what he was saying, and no way that Gerry was, in fact, the difference between 23 wins and 15 that year. I'm baffled that anyone could possibly think Gerry didn't make that team any better. That was a garbage surrounding cast, and McNamara carried them into the tournament.