Wide Receiver Issue

[HRE Otto IV]

Wide Receiver has been an issue for years. That should tell us we need a run based O and running QB. Yes, that will be less exciting to watch but going 7-6 is better than 4-8. Look at what we have had the last 18 years. I would say close to 1/3 of those years we don't have a good #1. And another 1/3 we only have a #1 but no #2. I would say 2012, 2015, and 2016 were the only years we legit had 3 guys.

Top 3 WRs in yards by year:

2004- Jared Jones, Steven Gregory, Andre Fontenette
2005- Rice Moss, Tim Lane, Nick Chestnut
2006- Mike Williams, Rice Moss, Taj Smith
2007- Mike Williams, Taj Smith, Rice Moss
2008- Donte Davis, Lavar Lobdell, Marcus Sales
2009- Mike Williams, Marcus Sales, Alec Lemon
2010- Van Chew, Marcus Sales, Alec Lemon
2011- Alec Lemon, Van Chew, Dorian Graham
2012- Alec Lemon, Marcus Sales, Jared West
2013- Ashton Broyld, Jarod West, Chris Clark
2014- Jarod West, Steve Ishmael, Ben Lewis
2015- Steve Ishmael, Brisly Estime, Erv Philips
2016- Amba Etta-Tawo, Erv philips, Steve Ismael
2017- Steve Ishmael, Erv Philips, Devin Butler
2018- Jamal Custis, Sean Riley, Taj Harris
2019- Trishton Jackson, Taj Harris, Sean Riley
2020- Taj Harris, Anthony Queeley, Nykeim Johnson
2021- Taj Harris, Anthony Queeley, Sharod Johnson

 

[Alsacs]

The thing is WR should be easy to find.
Non P-5 schools find them easily.
We aren’t going to get the freak NFL talents but we should be able to find 2 WRs each recruiting cycle that can play.
Gadston is too young but I like his potential.

I have seen him on special teams hope he can get on the field.

 

[javadoc]

Wide Receiver has been an issue for years. That should tell us we need a run based O and running QB. Yes, that will be less exciting to watch but going 7-6 is better than 4-8. Look at what we have had the last 18 years. I would say close to 1/3 of those years we don't have a good #1. And another 1/3 we only have a #1 but no #2. I would say 2012, 2015, and 2016 were the only years we legit had 3 guys.

Top 3 WRs in yards by year:

2004- Jared Jones, Steven Gregory, Andre Fontenette
2005- Rice Moss, Tim Lane, Nick Chestnut
2006- Mike Williams, Rice Moss, Taj Smith
2007- Mike Williams, Taj Smith, Rice Moss
2008- Donte Davis, Lavar Lobdell, Marcus Sales
2009- Mike Williams, Marcus Sales, Alec Lemon
2010- Van Chew, Marcus Sales, Alec Lemon
2011- Alec Lemon, Van Chew, Dorian Graham
2012- Alec Lemon, Marcus Sales, Jared West
2013- Ashton Broyld, Jarod West, Chris Clark
2014- Jarod West, Steve Ishmael, Ben Lewis
2015- Steve Ishmael, Brisly Estime, Erv Philips
2016- Amba Etta-Tawo, Erv philips, Steve Ismael
2017- Steve Ishmael, Erv Philips, Devin Butler
2018- Jamal Custis, Sean Riley, Taj Harris
2019- Trishton Jackson, Taj Harris, Sean Riley
2020- Taj Harris, Anthony Queeley, Nykeim Johnson
2021- Taj Harris, Anthony Queeley, Sharod Johnson

I have a feeling that we have a good set amongst the newcomers, but for whatever reason Dino chooses not to play them yet. We could have used an ace recruiter at the WR coaching spot, but I fear it's too late for that. Weren't Estime and Ishmael recruited by McDonald?

 

[orangenauburn]

2015- Steve Ishmael, Brisly Estime, Erv Philips
2016- Amba Etta-Tawo, Erv philips, Steve Ismael
2017- Steve Ishmael, Erv Philips, Devin Butler
2018- Jamal Custis, Sean Riley, Taj Harris

These guys didn't have issues catching balls

They were put in a spot to make catches and plays, and did. Same with:

2012- Alec Lemon, Marcus Sales, Jared West

 

[NineOneSeven]

Man, I loved that 2012 team. Heck of a squad. Lemon/Sales/West were great options on top of 2 backs that each averaged >5 ypc. That team was better than 8-5 (especially considering the 3 ooc P5 opponents in the first 4 games).

 

[Killdozer]

That 2009 squad was pretty good

 

[HRE Otto IV]

That 2009 squad was pretty good

Sales was only a Soph and Lemon a Frosh. They were both good but too young back then. We took a big hit that season after Williams left.

 

[Alsacs]

Chandler Jones still probably has more fantasy points than any Syracuse skill position guy in the NFL since Delone Carter.

That is a problem.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

The thing is WR should be easy to find.
Non P-5 schools find them easily.
We aren’t going to get the freak NFL talents but we should be able to find 2 WRs each recruiting cycle that can play.
Gadston is too young but I like his potential.

I have seen him on special teams hope he can get on the field.

It should be easy to find but look at those WR units. Most years were really rough.

 

[Goin' Deep]

I just think 1 problem with our passing game, other than drops, are the patterns run by the receivers.
TDP...too darn predictable. The defense sees the formation and has a good idea where the receiver is heading.

 

[qdawgg]

We should play to whatever the team strengths are. If your Alabama you can recruit for your exact system. If your SU, you need a coach that can adapt to the players you have at that time. Right now we have some solid RB’s and TE’s, then a who knows whether they’ll try to make a catch, run the right route, be noticed by the QB, complain like a baby WR group. Or at least some of the group that is the most heavily favored in the system

 

[Alsacs]

I just think 1 problem with our passing game, other than drops, are the patterns run by the receivers.
TDP...too darn predictable. The defense sees the formation and has a good idea where the receiver is heading.

That is stuff is on the HC and recruiting.

I give.Scott Shafer a hard time but finding guys like Erv Philips and Steve Ishmael every year shouldn’t be hard.
Shafer didn’t find enough.
Dino hasn’t found any. We had Michigan State transfer, Maryland transfer he can’t find HS guys.

That is on the coaching staff.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

We should play to whatever the team strengths are. If your Alabama you can recruit for your exact system. If your SU, you need a coach that can adapt to the players you have at that time. Right now we have some solid RB’s and TE’s, then a who knows whether they’ll try to make a catch, run the right route, be noticed by the QB, complain like a baby WR group. Or at least some of the group that is the most heavily favored in the system

We have struggled this millennium to get quality WRs and quality passers here. We have had plenty of quality RBs. Running QBs aren't that hard to find. It is easier to run block vs pass block. Taking all of that into account, IMO we should be looking at a 2013 like O system (just with an OC that has half a brain).

 

[HRE Otto IV]

That is stuff is on the HC and recruiting.

I give.Scott Shafer a hard time but finding guys like Erv Philips and Steve Ishmael every year shouldn’t be hard.
Shafer didn’t find enough.
Dino hasn’t found any. We had Michigan State transfer, Maryland transfer he can’t find HS guys.

That is on the coaching staff.

Marrone has major issues as well. He got Jarod West. Then who?

 

[Scooch]

Dino hasn’t found any. We had Michigan State transfer, Maryland transfer he can’t find HS guys.

That is on the coaching staff.

Bingo. Dino's high school WR recruiting has been atrocious, and that seems unforgivable given the whole #OITNF thing he preached for his first 4 seasons.

That being said, there have been moments when our various walkon QB replacements seem to get more out of our WRs than the 3 year starter. So who knows, really?

 

[NKR1978]

Man, I loved that 2012 team. Heck of a squad. Lemon/Sales/West were great options on top of 2 backs that each averaged >5 ypc. That team was better than 8-5 (especially considering the 3 ooc P5 opponents in the first 4 games).

Still angry about that Northwestern game.

They also completely blew Minnesota and Rutgers. In light of the way they won USF and Missouri, those four games evened themselves out.

Also the end of the season before the Pinstripe SU put out videos of the players dissecting plays in some of those late season wins.

 

[Alsacs]

Still angry about that Northwestern game.

They also completely blew Minnesota and Rutgers. In light of the way they won USF and Missouri, those four games evened themselves out.

Also the end of the season before the Pinstripe SU put out videos of the players dissecting plays in some of those late season wins.

The refs screwed us in the Cincinnati game with a bunch of bad calls mixed with stupid undisciplined penalties.
If we beat Cincinnati we go to the BCS.

 

[perdurabo]

How about using Adams and Howard at WR?

 

[RMH44]

Wide Receiver has been an issue for years. That should tell us we need a run based O and running QB. Yes, that will be less exciting to watch but going 7-6 is better than 4-8. Look at what we have had the last 18 years. I would say close to 1/3 of those years we don't have a good #1. And another 1/3 we only have a #1 but no #2. I would say 2012, 2015, and 2016 were the only years we legit had 3 guys.

Top 3 WRs in yards by year:

2004- Jared Jones, Steven Gregory, Andre Fontenette
2005- Rice Moss, Tim Lane, Nick Chestnut
2006- Mike Williams, Rice Moss, Taj Smith
2007- Mike Williams, Taj Smith, Rice Moss
2008- Donte Davis, Lavar Lobdell, Marcus Sales
2009- Mike Williams, Marcus Sales, Alec Lemon
2010- Van Chew, Marcus Sales, Alec Lemon
2011- Alec Lemon, Van Chew, Dorian Graham
2012- Alec Lemon, Marcus Sales, Jared West
2013- Ashton Broyld, Jarod West, Chris Clark
2014- Jarod West, Steve Ishmael, Ben Lewis
2015- Steve Ishmael, Brisly Estime, Erv Philips
2016- Amba Etta-Tawo, Erv philips, Steve Ismael
2017- Steve Ishmael, Erv Philips, Devin Butler
2018- Jamal Custis, Sean Riley, Taj Harris
2019- Trishton Jackson, Taj Harris, Sean Riley
2020- Taj Harris, Anthony Queeley, Nykeim Johnson
2021- Taj Harris, Anthony Queeley, Sharod Johnson

I get your point...but, IMO, this has far more to do with the pitcher than it does with the catcher(s).

Example: In 2018 opposing coaches often mentioned that they game planned to keep the ball out of Riley's hands. All of a sudden, in 2019, it was posted here numerous times that he's too small, he sucks etc. It was blatantly clear to me that TD had developed a close relationship with T Jackson during his RS year. TJ was, almost exclusively, TD's primary target regardless of the defense. This helped lead to some of Taj's frustration and eventual outbursts. In some ways, I don't blame Taj.

For me, the bottom line is that TD rarely makes the correct call at the LOS and if his predetermined 1st target is covered he panics. In his defense, the OL was so bad last year he rarely had time to run through his progressions which only highlights the importance of making the correct pre-snap read and take what the D gives him.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

2015- Steve Ishmael, Brisly Estime, Erv Philips
2016- Amba Etta-Tawo, Erv philips, Steve Ismael
2017- Steve Ishmael, Erv Philips, Devin Butler
2018- Jamal Custis, Sean Riley, Taj Harris

These guys didn't have issues catching balls

They were put in a spot to make catches and plays, and did. Same with:

2012- Alec Lemon, Marcus Sales, Jared West

2012 we had 3 guys who could catch the ball and knew the position along with a scheme that got them open as well. Sales and Lemon both found the open parts of the field as well. They were both very crafty and neither were more athletic that our top 3 guys right now, IMO. The current receivers to me drops the ball too much and are very confused. in 2012 the QB was also very tough and would hang in and take hits to get the receiver open. They could also run the ball which helped and had an NFL tackle when they were really good the last 6-7 games along with competent O Line elsewhere. It was a well balanced offense from top to bottom including coaching. The last few games it was a well oiled machine.

 

[Chip]

We took a big hit that season after Williams left.

We took that hit during the season. He was the leading receiver in our first 6 games, then never heard from again. Passing game sputtered, but then found some new life when Marrone took over for Spence the last 2 weeks.

 

[Army AV8R]

We should play to whatever the team strengths are. If your Alabama you can recruit for your exact system. If your SU, you need a coach that can adapt to the players you have at that time. Right now we have some solid RB’s and TE’s, then a who knows whether they’ll try to make a catch, run the right route, be noticed by the QB, complain like a baby WR group. Or at least some of the group that is the most heavily favored in the

We should play to whatever the team strengths are. If your Alabama you can recruit for your exact system. If your SU, you need a coach that can adapt to the players you have at that time. Right now we have some solid RB’s and TE’s, then a who knows whether they’ll try to make a catch, run the right route, be noticed by the QB, complain like a baby WR group. Or at least some of the group that is the most heavily favored in the system

Right now we have some solid TE's...How would anyone know...?
You only need to watch a couple of offensive series to figure out they are just an extension of the offensive line used primary as blockers who occasionally run a route. TD doesn't even have them on his radar as an option to throw to. Landon Morris figured that out during Spring Ball...!!

 

[upperdeck]

without seeing an all-22 really hard to know what the WRs are doing.. I know live you see guys open on some plays but if he is option #4 I dont think a QB is gonna find that guy all too often. Really wanted to see a bit more commitment to the run last week 0-0 throwing or passing what does it matter but if we had run it more maybe we wear down the D a bit and are able to run it late.. once we tied it a 7 we stopped running at all.

 

[NKR1978]

The refs screwed us in the Cincinnati game with a bunch of bad calls mixed with stupid undisciplined penalties.
If we beat Cincinnati we go to the BCS.

And we would have beaten Florida.

 

[Cuse69]

That is stuff is on the HC and recruiting.

I give.Scott Shafer a hard time but finding guys like Erv Philips and Steve Ishmael every year shouldn’t be hard.
Shafer didn’t find enough.
Dino hasn’t found any. We had Michigan State transfer, Maryland transfer he can’t find HS guys.

That is on the coaching staff.

At a minimum he should've brought in a few Wr transfers this off season, it's not like the portal was thin when it came to P5 former top 500 recruits.
I never understood why we didn't take some Wr transfers this offseason. It can't be because they didn't want to come here because plenty of G5 schools got guys who would've helped us here.