2015 NFL season general discussion thread

[NateW]

Lets be clear -- Pacman Jones got the 15 yarder for slamming into the ref trying to get at Porter. Porter will be fined, but he didn't do anything unnecessary there. He'll be fined for not being with Brown at that point (as he should have been). Pacman should never have run at Porter and tried to get at him. Hitting the ref sealed that penalty for him.

Burfict deserves to be suspended for multiple games as it's obvious fines are not enough to dissuade him from intentionally trying to hurt players. He has a long history of this, and the only thing that's surprising is that the great Marvin Lewis didn't reign him in much earlier. He deserved the 15 yarder as well.

Shazier's hit should have been a 15 yarder, but it wasn't nearly as intentional as the Burfict hit (and he did hit him with the helmet, THEN the shoulder). That was a play where Bernard turned around and they both put their helmets down. Shazier should know better, but I didn't feel like it was a cheap shot.

The Bengals had plenty of chances to win that game in the last minute and a half, and f*cked every single one up. There's a reason the franchise hasn't won a playoff game in 9,000 days.

Burfict makes an amazing interception, and that should seal up the game. Forget the fact he acted like a complete and total ass while running into the tunnel at the OPPOSITE end of the field after the play (which should have been yet another 15 yarder for unsportsmanlike conduct against him).

All they needed to do was take a knee, and give the ball back to the Steelers with a minute left and a whole field to go with no timeouts. Instead they hand it off, and Hill fumbles.

Then they just need to stop the Steelers from driving 75 yards, and they gift them 30 yards. The Bengals lost the game, the refs didn't give it to the Steelers. You must be a Bengals, Browns, or Ravens fan if you believe that.

You're really contradicting yourself here. You say it wasn't unnecessary but yet it deserves a fine. If it deserves a fine then it deserves a flag. If Joey Porter wants to be mixing it up in a pack of Bengals player then he shouldn't have retired.[/QUOTE]

 

[Orangeman]

what specific plays are you referring to?

The spearing non-penalty on the steelers that complete changed the game and sent the entire stadium (not just the players) into a tailspin

Almost willful incompetence by the officials

And then to watch the replay 40 times both on the screen and under the replay hood, and see how bad you missed the call, then award the ball to the other team, then call two undportsmanlike penalties on the bengals (one of which was yay like about 4 other altercations that occurred throughout the last 10 mins)

I am indifferent about these teams, I'm saying it's not as simple, at all, as saying "the Bengals lost their cool"

No, they were screwed AND watched their player leave the field in a stumble after losing consciousness on an illegal hot that wasn't called

But that's the narrative the NFL wants you to buy so they get what they want

"The Bills are undisciplined...the bengals are undisciplined. Etc etc"

Maybe, just maybe, there's a higher force

Spearing has been a penalty for 80 years, it doesn't matter if he was "defenseless" or a "runner"

Embarrassing, league is a sham

 

[Orangeman]

Further, you know Nantz and the CBS crew are in on it...Bengals player gets speared, only focused on whether "he was a runner", blah blah blah

But we get a 10 min examination of whether Big Ben was tackled illegally (he wasn't)

 

[Toga]

Lets be clear -- Pacman Jones got the 15 yarder for slamming into the ref trying to get at Porter. Porter will be fined, but he didn't do anything unnecessary there. He'll be fined for not being with Brown at that point (as he should have been). Pacman should never have run at Porter and tried to get at him. Hitting the ref sealed that penalty for him.

Burfict deserves to be suspended for multiple games as it's obvious fines are not enough to dissuade him from intentionally trying to hurt players. He has a long history of this, and the only thing that's surprising is that the great Marvin Lewis didn't reign him in much earlier. He deserved the 15 yarder as well.

Shazier's hit should have been a 15 yarder, but it wasn't nearly as intentional as the Burfict hit (and he did hit him with the helmet, THEN the shoulder). That was a play where Bernard turned around and they both put their helmets down. Shazier should know better, but I didn't feel like it was a cheap shot.

The Bengals had plenty of chances to win that game in the last minute and a half, and f*cked every single one up. There's a reason the franchise hasn't won a playoff game in 9,000 days.

Burfict makes an amazing interception, and that should seal up the game. Forget the fact he acted like a complete and total ass while running into the tunnel at the OPPOSITE end of the field after the play (which should have been yet another 15 yarder for unsportsmanlike conduct against him).

All they needed to do was take a knee, and give the ball back to the Steelers with a minute left and a whole field to go with no timeouts. Instead they hand it off, and Hill fumbles.

Then they just need to stop the Steelers from driving 75 yards, and they gift them 30 yards. The Bengals lost the game, the refs didn't give it to the Steelers. You must be a Bengals, Browns, or Ravens fan if you believe that.

Aside from omitting that Porter had no business being where he was and no doubt mouthing off - I completely agree with each point.

 

[Toga]

Further, you know Nantz and the CBS crew are in on it...Bengals player gets speared, only focused on whether "he was a runner", blah blah blah

But we get a 10 min examination of whether Big Ben was tackled illegally (he wasn't)

I had no horse in this race but you are dead nuts on on both counts. Why was it even a discussion on the sack?

 

[bpo57]

If I were Cincinnati I would fire Marvin Lewis and hire Tom Coughlin. That team has so much talent but is totally undisciplined.

I'd go two steps further. On Monday morning after I fired Marvin Lewis I would immediately release Burfict and Pac man Jones.

 

[rrlbees]

I'd go two steps further. On Monday morning after I fired Marvin Lewis I would immediately release Burfict and Pac man Jones.

One person said it perfectly. Lewis should be let go because he had no control over his players but Tomlin should be let go because he had no control over his coaches.

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

You're really contradicting yourself here. You say it wasn't unnecessary but yet it deserves a fine. If it deserves a fine then it deserves a flag. If Joey Porter wants to be mixing it up in a pack of Bengals player then he shouldn't have retired.

[/QUOTE]
You're right, I wasn't clear there. He did not do anything in that given situation that could have been an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. He didn't push, didn't shove, etc... He should have been with Brown, but that in and of itself is not a penalty, or not one they were willing to throw at that moment in the game.

You can see the refs just trying to keep the peace. They weren't going to throw a flag in that situation for players (and a stupid coach) woofing at each other. Pacman got the penalty because he slammed into the ref as he was trying to get to Porter. That was dumb, dumb, dumb on his part. Any time you touch a ref it's an immediate 15 yarder, and he needed to be smarter there.

So, to sum up -- Porter will be fined for being on a part of the field he shouldn't have been on, but that was not an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. I agree, it sounds a bit counterintuitive, but welcome to the NFL of 2016. I think the Rules Committee will probably look at that specific play in the offseason, and potentially make it a penalty for coaches to interact with players on the field in that manner.

 

[bpo57]

One person said it perfectly. Lewis should be let go because he had no control over his players but Tomlin should be let go because he had no control over his coaches.

Can't argue that.

It amazes me the stupidity of players and coaches. Week after week you see players (particularly nfl) that consistently do things that directly hurt their teams chances of winning football games. And the coaches are just as dumb. With the bengals having first and ten after the Burfict pick why do they run the ball there. I would have taken three knees and kicked a FG (said it at the time). Steelers would have had to have scored a TD with a little more than a minute left and no TOs.

How many times have you seen brutal fumbles in those situations when they run the ball? Happens all of the time but these dumbasses continue to do it.

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

The dumbest play was a coaching call on the two point conversion, with the Bengals up just 1 point under 2 mins, where they threw a lateral to Hill that really came close to being a disaster...that's willful dumbness

Would have been amazing if Burfict was not down on the INT and created a 2pt Safety out of it, giving the Steelers the lead and the ball.

Played exactly into the NFL's hands, knowing they've wanted Pittsburgh all along (go watch the all-of-a-sudden favorable home-cookin' the Bills got against the Jets last weekend).

It is utterly absurd to take the ball away from one team on a completely illegal, non-called Spearing penalty and then make those calls down the stretch.

The refs screwed that game up bad, again. The Bengals lost their cool, but they should have had at least another FG if not a TD (would have had 1st & 10 at the 12 or whatever).

The fact that the ex-head of NFL officials makes no mention that the Steelers tackler led with the Crown of his helmet and Speared the "Runner" into unconsciousness tells me all I need to know about this league and its "Messaging"

Seems like most of you only watched the last 2 mins of this game to see the Bengals' sins (and they were bad), but sports and life is a narrative, not a series of "instances" and the officials did a terrible job, again. There needs to be the ability to retro-actively penalize aggressive, illegal hits like that so the refs can correct their mistakes...that was a huge one and it clearly impacted the rest of the game.

NFL got what they wanted though, best TV matchup on Sat night next week

So just to be clear, you think because they missed an obvious penalty on the Shazier hit, they SHOULDN'T have called those penalties down the stretch? I don't think that's what you mean, I'm just trying to get some clarity.

 

[Phenomenon]

So just to be clear, you think because they missed an obvious penalty on the Shazier hit, they SHOULDN'T have called those penalties down the stretch? I don't think that's what you mean, I'm just trying to get some clarity.

The non-call on that changed the entire course of the game.

The Bengals starting running back is concussed and taken off of the field, never to return. They SHOULD have had 1st and 10 from the 10 yard line, almost guaranteeing either a touchdown or a field goal. The guy committing the non-penalty, could've been ejected. Instead, the Steelers are awarded the ball.

Minutes later, the Bengals back-up running back coughs up a fumble in a would-be game clinching situation, to the same guy that committed the non-penalty earlier. Had he been ejected, that doesn't happen. Had the correct call earlier been made, the Bengals just kneel on it and kick a game clinching field goal.

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

The non-call on that changed the entire course of the game.

The Bengals starting running back is concussed and taken off of the field, never to return. They SHOULD have had 1st and 10 from the 10 yard line, almost guaranteeing either a touchdown or a field goal. The guy committing the non-penalty, could've been ejected. Instead, the Steelers are awarded the ball.

Minutes later, the Bengals back-up running back coughs up a fumble in a would-be game clinching situation, to the same guy that committed the non-penalty earlier. Had he been ejected, that doesn't happen. Had the correct call earlier been made, the Bengals just kneel on it and kick a game clinching field goal.

He wouldn't have been ejected, just as Burfict wasn't ejected for the hit on Brown, so that's a misnomer.

We can play the 'what if' game all day if we want to. If they get the first down, do they score? Who knows. Does Burfict make it a point to drive Roethlisberger into the ground and injure him? Does he spear Antonio Brown over the middle at the end of the game? If they get the correct penalty, do those things happen? Maybe, maybe not.

It's really easy to say "if this happened, then that would have happened, and that would have happened..." It's fruitless to even try to do that. Who thought Jeremy Hill would fumble in a game clinching situation? No one could have predicted that, so you predicting the outcome of a game based on one non-call is ludicrous.

By the way, Bernard is the back up. Hill is the starter. They split snaps typically, but Hill is the starter.

Still not answering my original question though "So just to be clear, you think because they missed an obvious penalty on the Shazier hit, they SHOULDN'T have called those penalties down the stretch?" Because that's the way Orangeman wrote it.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

You're right, I wasn't clear there. He did not do anything in that given situation that could have been an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. He didn't push, didn't shove, etc... He should have been with Brown, but that in and of itself is not a penalty, or not one they were willing to throw at that moment in the game.

You can see the refs just trying to keep the peace. They weren't going to throw a flag in that situation for players (and a stupid coach) woofing at each other. Pacman got the penalty because he slammed into the ref as he was trying to get to Porter. That was dumb, dumb, dumb on his part. Any time you touch a ref it's an immediate 15 yarder, and he needed to be smarter there.

So, to sum up -- Porter will be fined for being on a part of the field he shouldn't have been on, but that was not an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. I agree, it sounds a bit counterintuitive, but welcome to the NFL of 2016. I think the Rules Committee will probably look at that specific play in the offseason, and potentially make it a penalty for coaches to interact with players on the field in that manner.

It's already a rule.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeoza...oey-porter-to-give-steelers-win-over-bengals/

Article I, section 8: Non-player personnel of a club (e.g., management personnel, coaches, trainers, equipment men) are prohibited from making unnecessary physical contact with or directing abusive, threatening, or insulting language or gestures at opponents, game officials, or representatives of the League. The penalty: 15 yards.

 

[ssbriefcase]

So as far as the AFC is concerned, no way Ben sits out next week, we've all seen this movie before. And Brown will play too. Not falling for the okie doke. The fools gold chefs without Maclin are going to get stomped.

The Broncos still have a really bad taste in their mouths from the game at Pittsburgh 20 days ago, when they blew a 17 point lead. They will be hell bent on proving they're the better team, and have both starting safeties back. Whoever wins at Mile High will be the AFC rep imo.

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

It's already a rule.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeoza...oey-porter-to-give-steelers-win-over-bengals/

Article I, section 8: Non-player personnel of a club (e.g., management personnel, coaches, trainers, equipment men) are prohibited from making unnecessary physical contact with or directing abusive, threatening, or insulting language or gestures at opponents, game officials, or representatives of the League. The penalty: 15 yards.

No one has any idea what he said. He didn't hit anyone, and in the clip everyone is seeing he isn't even saying anything. There's a clip before that where Burfict is trying to tap Antonio Brown on the shoulder to say he is sorry, and he inadvertently catches Porter with his hand as Porter is trying to walk off the field with the coaches who were out there with Brown.


That dispels the rumor that Porter wasn't out there with the crew that was tending to Brown. After he was hit by Burfict, I haven't seen any other video that shows Porter doing anything other than backing up and smirking, before Jones comes in and slams into the ref. I'm not naive enough to think that Porter didn't say anything, but three refs were there to keep the peace and didn't do anything about it. They had no trouble throwing the flag on Munchak earlier in the game, so if Porter was doing something egregious there, why not throw the flag?

Best case scenario for the Bengals is that those two penalties off set. We just have a bunch of people assuming something without having any idea. I'd like to think the refs who were right next to Porter would have tossed a flag if Porter was doing something wrong. If they didn't do anything, well that's an issue. None of us have enough information to say what was right or wrong in that situation.

Funny enough -- after I wrote that last response, I looked up the exact same article you posted and read it! Great minds think alike I guess

 

[CuseFaninVT]

No one has any idea what he said. He didn't hit anyone, and in the clip everyone is seeing he isn't even saying anything. There's a clip before that where Burfict is trying to tap Antonio Brown on the shoulder to say he is sorry, and he inadvertently catches Porter with his hand as Porter is trying to walk off the field with the coaches who were out there with Brown.

That dispels the rumor that Porter wasn't out there with the crew that was tending to Brown. After he was hit by Burfict, I haven't seen any other video that shows Porter doing anything other than backing up and smirking, before Jones comes in and slams into the ref. I'm not naive enough to think that Porter didn't say anything, but three refs were there to keep the peace and didn't do anything about it. They had no trouble throwing the flag on Munchak earlier in the game, so if Porter was doing something egregious there, why not throw the flag?

Best case scenario for the Bengals is that those two penalties off set. We just have a bunch of people assuming something without having any idea. I'd like to think the refs who were right next to Porter would have tossed a flag if Porter was doing something wrong. If they didn't do anything, well that's an issue. None of us have enough information to say what was right or wrong in that situation.

Funny enough -- after I wrote that last response, I looked up the exact same article you posted and read it! Great minds think alike I guess

He NEVER should have been out there. It is illegal for any coaching staff other than the Head Coach to come out for an injured player.

I can't find any videos showing Porter anywhere near Brown as he was going off. Can you point me in that direction?

 

[CuseFaninVT]

No one has any idea what he said. He didn't hit anyone, and in the clip everyone is seeing he isn't even saying anything. There's a clip before that where Burfict is trying to tap Antonio Brown on the shoulder to say he is sorry, and he inadvertently catches Porter with his hand as Porter is trying to walk off the field with the coaches who were out there with Brown.


That dispels the rumor that Porter wasn't out there with the crew that was tending to Brown. After he was hit by Burfict, I haven't seen any other video that shows Porter doing anything other than backing up and smirking, before Jones comes in and slams into the ref. I'm not naive enough to think that Porter didn't say anything, but three refs were there to keep the peace and didn't do anything about it. They had no trouble throwing the flag on Munchak earlier in the game, so if Porter was doing something egregious there, why not throw the flag?

Best case scenario for the Bengals is that those two penalties off set. We just have a bunch of people assuming something without having any idea. I'd like to think the refs who were right next to Porter would have tossed a flag if Porter was doing something wrong. If they didn't do anything, well that's an issue. None of us have enough information to say what was right or wrong in that situation.

Funny enough -- after I wrote that last response, I looked up the exact same article you posted and read it! Great minds think alike I guess

Nice find on the video. If that angry old white guy hadn't reacted so violently to Burfict, who should be suspended for that hit, the game would have ended much differently.

Still, there is no reasonable argument for a linebacker coach to be on the field after a hit to a wide receiver. Porter was wrong just by being on the field.

 

[NateW]

If there is one thing that is certain, it is that these players earn every last cent of their paychecks. The violence of the game is insane. Modern day gladiators.

The intensity is only magnified by the playoffs. Damn good television.

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

Nice find on the video. If that angry old white guy hadn't reacted so violently to Burfict, who should be suspended for that hit, the game would have ended much differently.

Still, there is no reasonable argument for a linebacker coach to be on the field after a hit to a wide receiver. Porter was wrong just by being on the field.

You're right on that. Why he was out there is anyone's guess. I'm not a Steelers apologist by any stretch, but both sides were at fault at the end. Knowing the way Porter was during his playing days, it's no surprise that dolt was involved in the fracas.

Still, you hit a ref, you're being penalized. Pacman should have recognized that. If it's offsetting penalties (as it should have been), the Steelers still had time to pick up another 10 to 15 yards, and kick a field goal. It certainly helped them, without a doubt.

When Shazier hit Bernard and knocked him out of the game, and the Bengals lost their collective minds, I turned to the people I was watching the game with and said "Roethlisberger and Brown should be very nervous. They're going to be going after them." And they did.

So while we all act incredulous over a coach who shouldn't have been on the field, maybe we should be just as incredulous that a team and a player that had that game won decided they were still going to head hunt to the detriment of his teammates and fan base. Don't knock Brown out on that cheap shot, and none of this is an issue.

 

[Phenomenon]

He wouldn't have been ejected, just as Burfict wasn't ejected for the hit on Brown, so that's a misnomer.

We can play the 'what if' game all day if we want to. If they get the first down, do they score? Who knows. Does Burfict make it a point to drive Roethlisberger into the ground and injure him? Does he spear Antonio Brown over the middle at the end of the game? If they get the correct penalty, do those things happen? Maybe, maybe not.

It's really easy to say "if this happened, then that would have happened, and that would have happened..." It's fruitless to even try to do that. Who thought Jeremy Hill would fumble in a game clinching situation? No one could have predicted that, so you predicting the outcome of a game based on one non-call is ludicrous.

By the way, Bernard is the back up. Hill is the starter. They split snaps typically, but Hill is the starter.

Still not answering my original question though "So just to be clear, you think because they missed an obvious penalty on the Shazier hit, they SHOULDN'T have called those penalties down the stretch?" Because that's the way Orangeman wrote it.

The ejection is open to the referees. That's why I said Shazier could have been ejected.

Yes, if the Bengals are 1st and 10 from the 10, they do score.
Yes, Burfict makes it a point to drive Roethlisberger into the ground.
No, he probably doesn't spear Brown into the ground, because like I said, if they make the correct call, the Bengals kneel on it and kick the field goal to ice it.

Bernard is not the backup. He always closes out games because throughout his career, he has NEVER lost a fumble. Hill has lost five. That is why Bernard was getting all the plays up until the injury.

But no, you still make that call on Burfict. You call the game by the rules regardless. The call against Jones though was quite egregious. It is common knowledge that they never call those penalties on the guy that instigates it but the guy that retaliates. To assume that the refs would've made a call on Porter since they were right there had he done anything is foolish. Porter is a savvy vet and knows how to play that game.

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

If there is one thing that is certain, it is that these players earn every last cent of their paychecks. The violence of the game is insane. Modern day gladiators.

The intensity is only magnified by the playoffs. Damn good television.

That's the truth.

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

The ejection is open to the referees. That's why I said Shazier could have been ejected.

Yes, if the Bengals are 1st and 10 from the 10, they do score.
Yes, Burfict makes it a point to drive Roethlisberger into the ground.
No, he probably doesn't spear Brown into the ground, because like I said, if they make the correct call, the Bengals kneel on it and kick the field goal to ice it.

Bernard is not the backup. He always closes out games because throughout his career, he has NEVER lost a fumble. Hill has lost five. That is why Bernard was getting all the plays up until the injury.

But no, you still make that call on Burfict. You call the game by the rules regardless. The call against Jones though was quite egregious. It is common knowledge that they never call those penalties on the guy that instigates it but the guy that retaliates. To assume that the refs would've made a call on Porter since they were right there had he done anything is foolish. Porter is a savvy vet and knows how to play that game.

My point on the above is, if I had said to you the Bengals have the ball with 1:30 left and just need to run out the clock to win the game would they? 98% of the time the answer is yes. So to say we KNOW they would have scored is not correct. The probability is with them, but who's to say Hill doesn't fumble there? Anyways, I'm picking nits, as are you at this point.

I would consider the guy first on the depth chart as the de facto starter, but I'll defer to you on how they use Bernard (you'd think I'd know more about the guy given he was the running back on my fantasy team this year!). My overriding point is no one knows how the rest of that game plays out. We can't extrapolate on what would have/could have happened. I point to the crazy/insane way that game ended as Point #1 on how we NEVER know how games could go based off of one play!

Anyways, as Nate said, it made for good TV didn't it? Gives all of us schmucks something to talk about on a lazy Sunday before the next two games!

 

[Orangeman]

We know this much:

This was a Playoff officiating crew, should be on top of the rules and capable of enforcing them

We know they enforced two 15-yard penalties that were technically good calls against the Bengals. The first (hit on defenseless receiver) was clear-cut, and moved the Steelers into FG range for a 50-yarder. The second was an interesting one, a 15-yarder that moved the FG to 35 yards...I think we can all agree a 35 yarder vs. 50 yarder makes a big difference in that situation.

We know they willfully ignored or did not enforce two 15 yard penalties against the Steelers -- the Spearing penalty that resulted in a change of possession instead of 1st & Goal for the Bengals which would have likely led to points for the Bengals. They then missed that a representative of the Steelers was on the field when he shouldn't have been, which led to the 2nd 15 yard penalty on the Bengals. Those would have off-set leaving a 50 yard attempt.

The point I was making is that the veteran officiating crew really screwed up this game...they missed a major penalty which resulted in a Turnover and cost one team points, momentum, etc.

The call was so bad it changed what was already a challenging environment into a down-right hostile one, throughout the stadium.

The lead official had to see on the replay that they'd blown a major, major call when he justified the fumble. They all have earpieces on, is it not so that they can communicate this fact amongst themselves?

I've read here that contact with an official is an auto-flag for 15 yards. Well, first, so is Spearing, and they didn't flag that. Second, as a result of the officials' horrendous missed call, there were about 3-4 major altercations over the last 10-15 mins of the game. Presumably there were tens if not a hundred incremental "contacts" between the officials and the players as they kept these conflicts, which flared because of the officials' own incompetence, to small skirmishes and separated the players...so it's NOT true that contact with an official is an automatic flag. There appears to be a healthy level of discretion the officials can bring to bear on the situation.

And what I'm suggesting, is since they had screwed up so bad...the officials should have reached back into that bag of discretion and not penalized the Bengals on that last play...they moved the FG from 50 yards to 35, further ensuring the Steelers would win after all they'd already done to change the outcome of the game.

YES, I think the official should have used his discretion to not throw the last flag, as annoying as Jones might have been, because they'd already helped determine the outcome of the game way more than they should ever.

One last point, where is there a statute of limitations on some penalties and not others...the officials can gather and throw a late Flag on Grounding but not Spearing? It was an obvious penalty, why can't they see the replay, see it was an obvious foul and drop a flag? What's the reason?

The Bengals lost their cool, but they were hosed, plain and simple. But, CBS and the NFL wanted a Steelers/Broncos rematch and they got what they wanted. I would imagine this "elite" officiating crew will be well-comped for helping to facilitate a more attractive TV match-up.

 

[Cusefan0307]

The bengals should of just kneeled on the ball. Pittsburgh only had two timeouts. They at best would of got the ball back with 45 seconds and no timeouts. On top of that, they may have been up 4 instead of 1 and Pittsburgh would of needed a touchdown from a QB with a bad shoulder.

 

[Orangeman]

The bengals should of just kneeled on the ball. Pittsburgh only had two timeouts. They at best would of got the ball back with 45 seconds and no timeouts. On top of that, they may have been up 4 instead of 1 and Pittsburgh would of needed a touchdown from a QB with a bad shoulder.

No, the Steelers had 3 TOs

No one would have kneeled there...a FD ends the game, even a 4 point lead is not safe with 1:30 left.