Blue Bloods

[Nicknack]

To me its a balance of historical and modern day.
I only have 4 clear cut - UNC, UK, Duke, Kansas.
Even if Duke's history is shorter, its still been 40 years at this point.
UCLA is close because they do not have quite enough modern day dominance in my view.
Indiana is out.

Using modern day criteria, we need to get it going soon under Red to maintain our tier 2 status.

Yep, I was thinking the same thing. At one time, we were probably getting close to being considered bottom of tier 1 (not a blueblood though). UConn might be on the bottom of tier one with Gonzaga. Villanova, hmmm. Not sure about them.

 

[orangepassion]

When is the last time none of Kansas, Kentucky, Duke, and UNC made the sweet 16?

 

[sufandu]

To me its a balance of historical and modern day.
I only have 4 clear cut - UNC, UK, Duke, Kansas.
Even if Duke's history is shorter, its still been 40 years at this point.
UCLA is close because they do not have quite enough modern day dominance in my view.
Indiana is out.

Using modern day criteria, we need to get it going soon under Red to maintain our tier 2 status.

Duke's history depends on if you count FF's or championships. Their first FF was '63 and then they went to 3 in 4 years. Then they had one more about 10 years later under a 2nd coach prior to K. If you're going by championships it's obviously much shorter.

 

[Forloveoforange]

When is the last time none of Kansas, Kentucky, Duke, and UNC made the sweet 16?

2 years ago.

 

[walsh2012]

My tiers considering entire history:

Tier 1: duke, unc, kentucky, ucla, kansas, indiana

2: nova, cuse, sparty, uconn, michigan, zags

3: florida, houston, louisville,

Probably missing obvious teams but others that come to mind:

Tennessee, texas, lsu, xavier, nc st, gtown,

 

[Day2]

My tiers considering entire history:

Tier 1: duke, unc, kentucky, ucla, kansas, indiana

2: nova, cuse, sparty, uconn, michigan, zags

3: florida, houston, louisville,

Probably missing obvious teams but others that come to mind:

Tennessee, texas, lsu, xavier, nc st, gtown,

I think you need to win a title to be tier 2 or better.

 

[walsh2012]

I think you need to win a title to be tier 2 or better.

I could see houston getting switched with the zags, but they have been excellent for like 25 years now

 

[Nicknack]

For me, tiers and where teams fall is fluid. That's why there is no way I would put Indiana in tier 1. They're tier 2 for sure, along with ucla. We're tier 2, but have been slipping.

About 15 years ago, I remember talking about college basketball tiers with a friend of mine who is a Kansas alumn. At that time, I believed they were top of tier 2, just outside tier 1. That's no longer the case - they are clearly tier 1 now. Zags are tier 2, even without a title. For me, it's not so much how many titles you have but how relevant you are and serious about competing for ncaa titles.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think Kentucky, UNC and Kansas are all a step above Duke historically. Multiple coaches have won at all of those schools. Kentucky and UNC are the 2 best programs all time.

 

[Newhouser]

My tiers considering entire history:

Tier 1: duke, unc, kentucky, ucla, kansas, indiana

2: nova, cuse, sparty, uconn, michigan, zags

3: florida, houston, louisville,

Probably missing obvious teams but others that come to mind:

Tennessee, texas, lsu, xavier, nc st, gtown,

This list makes me realize that this is a great debate. For me history matters and Florida has no business being on the list, and OSU would replace Michigan, and Indiana would bounce down to replace the Zags.

It's also not going to be popular here but there would be a ton of non-orange fans who think we don't belong in Tier 2 - NC State & Louisville can argue their history, as can Houston who would be my only team without an NC considered as they have been relevant for over 50 years.

Interesting conversation.

 

[Day2]

For me, tiers and where teams fall is fluid. That's way no way would I put Indiana in tier 1. They're tier 2 for sure, along with ucla. We're tier 2, but have been slipping.

About 15 years ago, I remember talking about college basketball tiers with a friend of mine who is a Kansas alumn. At that time, I believed they were top of tier 2, just outside tier 1. That's no longer the case - they are clearly tier 1 now. Zags are tier 2, even without a title. For me, it's not so much how many titles you have but how relevant you are and serious about competing for ncaa titles.

Gonzaga has two Final Fours, both resulting in championship game appearances. They were a #1 seed both of those years and have five #1 seeds overall.

Does that mean they’re serious about competing for titles? Given the conference they play in, I would say no. While they do schedule tough non-conference opponents every year and win a lot of those games, they coast through their conference schedule. That results in them getting a high seed, which increases their chances of advancing deep into the tournament. If they played in the PAC-12, those #1 and #2 seeds would probably turn into #4 and #5 seeds.

Look at this season. They were projected to be a #1 seed at the beginning of the year. All it took was an above average season from St. Mary’s to knock Gonzaga down to a #3 seed.

Here’s another way to look at it: Were we in that second tier before 2003? Boeheim’s first 25 years are comparable to this Gonzaga run.

 

[Nicknack]

Gonzaga has two Final Fours, both resulting in championship game appearances. They were a #1 seed both of those years and have five #1 seeds overall. Does that mean they’re serious about competing for titles?

Isn't the very fact that they have played in two national championship games answer your question with an obvious yes?

 

[walsh2012]

This list makes me realize that this is a great debate. For me history matters and Florida has no business being on the list, and OSU would replace Michigan, and Indiana would bounce down to replace the Zags.

It's also not going to be popular here but there would be a ton of non-orange fans who think we don't belong in Tier 2 - NC State & Louisville can argue their history, as can Houston who would be my only team without an NC considered as they have been relevant for over 50 years.

Interesting conversation.

Florida does have two nattys - more than us.

We deserve that spot - six final 4s multiple natty appearances. The prestige of the old BE

 

[Sherman20]

My tiers considering entire history:

Tier 1: duke, unc, kentucky, ucla, kansas, indiana

2: nova, cuse, sparty, uconn, michigan, zags

3: florida, houston, louisville,

Probably missing obvious teams but others that come to mind:

Tennessee, texas, lsu, xavier, nc st, gtown,

Gonzaga has two Final Fours, both resulting in championship game appearances. They were a #1 seed both of those years and have five #1 seeds overall.

Does that mean they’re serious about competing for titles? Given the conference they play in, I would say no. While they do schedule tough non-conference opponents every year and win a lot of those games, they coast through their conference schedule. That results in them getting a high seed, which increases their chances of advancing deep into the tournament. If they played in the PAC-12, those #1 and #2 seeds would probably turn into #4 and #5 seeds.

Look at this season. They were projected to be a #1 seed at the beginning of the year. All it took was an above average season from St. Mary’s to knock Gonzaga down to a #3 seed.

Here’s another way to look at it: Were we in that second tier before 2003? Boeheim’s first 25 years are comparable to this Gonzaga run.

Gonzaga’s only been relevant for like 20 years and an actual top 10 program for like 10. They can’t be on the second tier. Same with Houston. They were largely irrelevant from the mid to late 80s when Lewis retired til Sampson took over a few years ago.

Louisville has like 7 or 8 final fours and 3 titles. They’re firmly in the second tier.

 

[Nicknack]

Florida does have two nattys - more than us.

We deserve that spot - six final 4s multiple natty appearances. The prestige of the old BE

Yes they do, and living in the state of Florida, that makes me want to...

As a program, we have really squandered some good chances to have more than one title. Instead, schools like Florida, UConn, Villanova have accumulated while we came up short for whatever reason. Sucks.

 

[Day2]

Isn't the very fact that they have played in two national championship games answer your question with an obvious yes?

No. If that’s the criteria, we’re overlooking a lot of teams that should be tier 2. I assume you think we were tier 2 before 2003. I maintain you need to win it all in order to be in that group.

 

[Nicknack]

No. If that’s the criteria, we’re overlooking a lot of teams that should be tier 2. I assume you think we were tier 2 before 2003. I maintain you need to win it all in order to be in that group.

Yes I did. They have been in tier two for quite some time. If you'd like to nominate others, let me know and I'll review.

 

[Charbroil]

My tiers considering entire history:

Tier 1: duke, unc, kentucky, ucla, kansas, indiana

2: nova, cuse, sparty, uconn, michigan, zags

3: florida, houston, louisville,

Probably missing obvious teams but others that come to mind:

Tennessee, texas, lsu, xavier, nc st, gtown,

Arizona should be on here. I typically see them at about Syracuse’s level when it comes to program history.

 

[walsh2012]

Arizona should be on here. I typically see them at about Syracuse’s level when it comes to program history.

Definitely agree I totally overlooked them they’re tier 2

 

[walsh2012]

Yes they do, and living in the state of Florida, that makes me want to...

As a program, we have really squandered some good chances to have more than one title. Instead, schools like Florida, UConn, Villanova have accumulated while we came up short for whatever reason. Sucks.

nancy cantor can suck an egg

 

[walsh2012]

Gonzaga’s only been relevant for like 20 years and an actual top 10 program for like 10. They can’t be on the second tier. Same with Houston. They were largely irrelevant from the mid to late 80s when Lewis retired til Sampson took over a few years ago.

Louisville has like 7 or 8 final fours and 3 titles. They’re firmly in the second tier.

The vacated natty knocks them down but i can see them in tier 2

 

[rrlbees]

 

[walsh2012]

Another metric