everyone needs to remember

[zjscuse]

Babers literally warned the entire fan base that this year was going to be painful. He knew exactly what he signed up for and understands its going to take a couple years of recruiting for this train to really get ch0ugging. I will say being present at the game i think considering the way last season went and all the uncertainty, the crowd at the beginning of the game was loud and decent. It was the secondary being completely lost that literally lost the crowd. The offense was decent and if we actually had a decent o line and secondary the game would've been you know an actual game. I do give them big props for atleast making it interesting at the half and giving us a chance. I did notice that when jackson is pressured he does make bonhead decisions and i was waiting all game for the coaching staff to pounce on this and blitz but after watching film i believe they can correct all these things. Your all forgetting it was literally the second game against a top 10 opponent in a new system for both sides of the ball. Everyone who is saying the sky is falling needs to shut it and remember that everyone was warned of these growing pains from the get go, Babers isnt going anywhere.

 

[djorange1989]

Good post. Some folks dismissed Dino's warnings, saying he was just trying to lower expectations but didn't really mean it. He meant it. There are maybe 5 Power 5 teams with less talent than us.

 

[SoBristol]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

 

[Noexcuse]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

After 2 games, it's probably too early to decide if we regressed from last year. The only thing I would say at this point is we are likely not beating Clemson or Florida State and probably not Notre Dame.

 

[djorange1989]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

We needed OT to beat CMU and a last second FG to beat a lousy BC team. We just as easily could have been 2-10 last year. I don't know why people think it is easy to completely change systems on both sides of the ball. It isn't. Especially with changes this extreme. Slowest offense ever to lightning fast offense. Hyper-aggressive defense to a passive Tampa 2. I am not burying our season at all but a regression is certainly possible and unfortunately not totally shocking

 

[721Comstock]

We needed OT to beat CMU and a last second FG to beat a lousy BC team. We just as easily could have been 2-10 last year. I don't know why people think it is easy to completely change systems on both sides of the ball. It isn't. Especially with changes this extreme. Slowest offense ever to lightning fast offense. Hyper-aggressive defense to a passive Tampa 2. I am not burying our season at all but a regression is certainly possible and unfortunately not totally shocking

We're also playing against a tougher schedule this season too.
We opened with 3 tuna cans last year.
Llvll is probably a Top 10 team, when all is said and done.

And a dual threat athletic QB like Jackson has always been Kryptonite for our D - regardless of system.
We made BJ Daniels look like Mike Vick.

I'm still 100% on board the Dino train.
We still may not be able to stop anybody on D, but at least this year we've got a pretty good chance of outscoring them on O.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

This argument slays me... We are playing an entirely different on both sides of the ball yet the team which won only 4 games last year after being recruited to play in the old system are supposed to automatically do as well in the new system against opponents who are a year older both physically and in terms of experience in their system. I love how the argument ignores all of the hundred other factors that go into winning and instead jumps right to the transitive property that I won x games last year so i should win x this year even though the team, the systems, and the opponents are all different.

 

[LIBALL]

I have seen teams with less talent compete because of technique and coaching. You have to play with the hand you are dealt and do your best with out excuses. I get we all have high hopes for Syracuse ,yes we want to compete and win. But what I don't get is knocking down the players who give their all out there. Do I think everyone out there should be put there? No, but I respect their effort. This goes for the fans and the staff. To hear your coach and fans say the players aren't good enough, can't wait to get rid of them ( in so many words). That is not fair!! Why they hell should they give you their all?? In honesty recruits want to go to a winning school. Yes, it sounds good we are rebuilding so are other programs who don't get scraped so bad. They look at the final score no way around it allowing 62 points is bad. It may of soften the blow if we put up 59 points, would a should a could a. Take away ETTA and Dungey what do we have? A better defense will spy Dungey and double up on Etta, then what? I hope we do better this week. Back to the drawing board and come out swinging this week. I saw a lot of people complain about Schafer using time outs improperly. Did I see us burn a time out for challenging the spot of the ball which would of only made it a one yard difference ? Will that happen in a big game? We have a lot of growing to from the top to the bottom of this team. I look forward to seeing our finished product. Go ORANGE!!!

 

[PhatOrange]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

Also lost Simmons at DE and John Raymon at DT. They were solid.

Our problem isn't really inside though. It's DE and the DBs.

 

[Cusefan95]

I'm fine with patience...but I'd expect 3-4 wins this year with an outside chance to reach 6. I'd be concerned if we go 1-11 that the poor on-field results would scare away recruits. How we do this year is irrelevant...unless it's so bad Syracuse looks like a tire fire that's radioactive to recruits. If that happens, the results this year will have long term negative consequences.

 

[alphaorange]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

So how do you think last year's team does against this UL team? I feel like we would have looked worse than we did last year. Lost by 24 last year with a lot less possessions. This UL team is far and away better than last years and we are transitioning. People need to have a shot and a beer and relax.

 

[Shenexon]

We may not win as often as we like for a bit, but it's going to be exciting. I hope the learning curve is just a week slow compared with Babers' statement that the biggest growth normally comes between the 1st and 2nd games. We do have playmakers, especially on offense, but that also made 3 takeaways on Friday. They're going to get better as they understand the system better, but we have enough challenges with the defensive roster to last the season. My major expectation is that Babers et al will make their systems work or change them to something that will work. Babers wants to win. He's not planning to lose and has a good team of coaches. I'm looking forward to see what they do this week...

 

[BrooklynCuse]

Babers also said we'd surprise people(hopefully we still will) so he didn't/doesn't think the cupboards are empty. But don't blame the players.

We are going to play at least two or three teams a year with better athletes. Does that mean we never beat those teams?

I thought the whole idea with Babers systems are you can beat better competition with them?

I'm all in with Coach Babers just don't like him saying we don't have the talent to win.

 

[kcsu]

We lost to a team with top 5 Talent and an Excellant coaching staff. The pig got chops.

 

[TheCusian]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses. 2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff. No reason we should regress.

I think we regress slightly at first due to transitions to new systems coupled with scoring being amplified due to tempo - and this is what you get. I also still think we shock someone later in the season.

 

[ejz555]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

Same talent back? Thompson, Raymon, Simmons, Sheppherd, Arciniega, Carter & Ealey all gone from the D-Line... Just a slight understatement I would say..

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Same talent back? Thompson, Raymon, Simmons, Sheppherd, Arciniega, Carter & Ealey all gone from the D-Line... Just a slight understatement I would say..

That's 6 defensive ends if I'm counting right.

I'd say we're green at defensive end, but it's more like we're green at defensive end the way color blind people see green.

 

[Deuga]

So how do you think last year's team does against this UL team? I feel like we would have looked worse than we did last year. Lost by 24 last year with a lot less possessions. This UL team is far and away better than last years and we are transitioning. People need to have a shot and a beer and relax.

Exactly. By the end of last season I'd become convinced that we were running an offense that put the QB at too much risk of injury. It wasn't going to matter how great the offense was in theory if you need 5 QBs to make it through every season (yes I know I'm exaggerating a little).

 

[OrangeFoo]

Babers also said we'd surprise people(hopefully we still will) so he didn't/doesn't think the cupboards are empty. But don't blame the players.

We are going to play at least two or three teams a year with better athletes. Does that mean we never beat those teams?

I thought the whole idea with Babers systems are you can beat better competition with them?

I'm all in with Coach Babers just don't like him saying we don't have the talent to win.

So if he's honest with us and sets realistic expectations, we don't like it because we call it sandbagging or somehow insulting our players. If he blows sunshine up our ass (thank you top gun) and we don't meet those expectations everyone will want to run him out of town.

 

[RF2044]

Babers also said we'd surprise people(hopefully we still will) so he didn't/doesn't think the cupboards are empty. But don't blame the players.

We are going to play at least two or three teams a year with better athletes. Does that mean we never beat those teams?

I thought the whole idea with Babers systems are you can beat better competition with them?

I'm all in with Coach Babers just don't like him saying we don't have the talent to win.

Holy literal.

 

[SoBristol]

Same talent back? Thompson, Raymon, Simmons, Sheppherd, Arciniega, Carter & Ealey all gone from the D-Line... Just a slight understatement I would say..

No -- Raymon wasn't on the 2015 team; Ealey & Shepperd did not play much (true frosh, barely scratching the two deep -- Shepperd certainly had potential); Carter did not play; Arciniega was a converted LB playing back up at DE for the first time. The starting DEs graduated (Simmons) or left for the NFL (Thompson -- undrafted).

We have the same talent back in 9 positions (now minus Cordy to injury). Add Wilson & Coleman -- who match up very well with the back up DEs you listed. Add McKinley Williams who is far better than Carter. Adjust the DL so Slayton, Clark & Samuels all start. Replace one starter (Hodge) with a better LB (Thomas). Add another year of S&C for the 9 returning starters, and another year of experience with the coaching in the Spring and in August. You have 9 positions better than in 2015, and the DEs (even with Slayton) not so much.

The defense should not regress compared to last season.

 

[anomander]

One thing that is glaringly obvious on defense is our size. LB's are all undersized and have a very hard time getting off blocks. The whole defensive backfield is tiny. The only group that has some size is the DL, but that is the most inexperienced unit. I understand that these guys were recruited for an entirely different defense, that emphasized more speed over size, but even their speed (which is questionable) can't make up for their lack of size in this defense. We really need to upgrade the talent...and size on that side of the ball. If there are some blue chip recruits that want to come in and play right away at DB, LB, or DE, then Syracuse is the place because we need a major overhaul with that unit. The cupboards are definitely bare.

 

[RF2044]

One thing that is glaringly obvious on defense is our size. LB's are all undersized and have a very hard time getting off blocks. The whole defensive backfield is tiny. The only group that has some size is the DL, but that is the most inexperienced unit. I understand that these guys were recruited for an entirely different defense, that emphasized more speed over size, but even their speed (which is questionable) can't make up for their lack of size in this defense. We really need to upgrade the talent...and size on that side of the ball. If there are some blue chip recruits that want to come in and play right away at DB, LB, or DE, then Syracuse is the place because we need a major overhaul with that unit. The cupboards are definitely bare.

Agree across the board. We have some talent [albeit young talent] at DT. Every other positional unit on defense is subpar for this new system, and depth / size are major concerns in the back 7.

The cupboard is mostly bare, except for DT.

 

[tep624]

Let's not go overboard with the excuses.
2015 team won 4 games, should have beat UVa, played Pitt to a 3 point game, and wasn't embarrassed against LSU or Clemson, playing with a walk-on qB. Essentially the same talent back (other than Ron Thompson), except we have a soph Dungey (much better) and a WR in Etta Tawo who is better than anyone we had last season. 17 starters back -- not nearly so young overall as in 2015; better off-season S&C; better offensive coaching staff.

No reason we should regress.

That's just not reasonable. You have a coach that has brought in a staff that is implementing two new systems on both sides of the ball - they aren't catering these systems to the talent, they are instilling the systems and letting the chips fall where they may (and we can debate the merits of that until the cows come home but that is DB's way clearly based upon what he has done in his past and what he communicated prior to this season). That's why we're playing a Tampa 2 with a 5'8 safety (love Cordy but let's get real here - if Babers was in a gym class picking players for a team he's not picking a 5'8 to play safety in his system). There was a reason why this staff rolled the dice on adding two late additions, at least from a size perspective, prototypical DB's for their system in Moore and Pierre who both unfortunately didn't qualify. There's a reason why Carl Jones is playing as a true frosh.

We shouldn't have regressed if this was Shafer's staff using the same systems as last year and the players they recruited for those systems. This is year one with a lot of square pegs and round holes. It's going to be painful. I think our D Line will eventually become stronger as the season progresses but the back 7 is for the most part not suited for this system and it will show week in, week out.

My only hope is that the offense kicks in early enough that they can overcome the defensive limitations we are going to have all season and we can win enough shootouts to get bowl eligible. Other than that - don't count on it.

 

[Cuse'91]

It may be distasteful, but I think we need to over recruit on offense, and then "conveniently" switch a few of those guys to defensive backfield...