If our OL performs/holds up we are going to score some pts.

[qdawgg]

I think Marrone didn't like it much. That translates. I think he valued game planning and experience over youthful enthusiasm and the ability to relate (trade off is clear).

I don't think Twitter hashtags do a thing - I think that Shafer gets CFB better than Doug and that it translates pretty clearly to recruiting. Business works better with NFL guys.

I think, I think, I think, but I don't know. "That" translates. That is revisionist history at it's finest.

On this topic you just aren't correct. You're taking great liberties by taking a couple things he said over his time here and translating that into his actions.

Again, if you followed recruiting closely during this period, overall there is absolutely no way you could accuse him of being detached from the process.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Last year was a train wreck for so many reasons McDonald being a poor OC was a major part of it but the injuries were a much bigger reason. Hunt going down... The biggest reason however was the fact that our OL was destroyed by injuries. Somebody posted that we didnt field our first team OL all year. Maybe not even a healthy OL for the opener. This year if we can stay healthy up front i think we score over 30 a game. I really like Trudo at center. Sure he has had some snap problems but the kid is a bull with a mean streak to match. Robinson is seasoned and fights his ass off and Palmer is tough as well. Foy is the key, actually him and Trudo. If this line can perform and they should as they have a ton of experience we should move the ball.

I know that it remains to be seen but i think Hunt has a great year because Lester will play to his strengths and keep him comfortable. Outside of him we have some real weapons. Sure they are mostly unproven but they sure as heck look the part. We have a true number one receiver and i have always liked Cornster. Custis is due for a break out year add in all of the other kids and we have some real talent for a change. RB is a mystery to me but im betting on Mcfarland to shine and my dark horse is the frosh JF who seems to have a great combination of speed vision and power. Heck the kids is built like a wrecking ball already at 210.

So if the Ol stays healthy im predicting good things for this O.

Why? Did we get a different qb?

 

[anomander]

Revisionist history. Amazing how the story of recruiting under Marrone has been so distorted. Clearly people have created their own history of recruiting under Marrone but never followed it.

I'll say it again, read the comments from the recruits when they were being recruited. We heard all the same words and phrases then, that we do now.

- Family atmosphere
- Easy to talk to
- Coaches care about them
- My parents really got a great feeling from him (yes, even Dougie)

Yeah I think there's a misconception that Marrone wasnt a good recruiter because he wasnt on twitter and he doesnt have the personality of Shafer. There are many great head coach's who recruit well with Marrone business style. You dont have to have phrases like orange revolution and hardnosed to win over recruits. Cutcliffe comes to mind. He's doing great bringing in talent.

DING DING DING DING

Marrone not liking recruiting had absolutely no effect on his staffs recruiting abilities. The piss poor facilities, and 1 win season took care of that.

your right, he probably had a higher emphasis on game planning and experience but just because he doesnt show enthusiam doesnt mean he's not as good of a recruiter. Give him the ACC and the IPF now and see what he would do.

Forget the IPF, at least give him some renovated facilities and let's see what he could have done. I don't know if people forget or what, but renovations weren't completed until 2012.

I said it before, but if Marrone and his staff had the same exact resources that we have now I am positive the recruiting results would be similar.

 

[rrlbees]

DING DING DING DING Marrone not liking recruiting had absolutely no effect on his staffs recruiting abilities. The piss poor facilities, and 1 win season took care of that. Forget the IPF, at least give him some renovated facilities and let's see what he could have done. I don't know if people forget or what, but renovations weren't completed until 2012. I said it before, but if Marrone and his staff had the same exact resources that we have now I am positive the recruiting results would be similar.

Marrone did manage to piss off half of Jersey to the point of some coaches not allowing him in their schools. So he's got that going for him. Marrone was not a good recruiter and DID hate it. He wasn't gonna kiss anyone's butt, not kids, not parents. He did have some staff that had key connections in certain areas such as Adkins in the south, mainly Georgia, and Anselmo in NYC.

 

[TheCusian]

your right, he probably had a higher emphasis on game planning and experience but just because he doesnt show enthusiam doesnt mean he's not as good of a recruiter. Give him the ACC and the IPF now and see what he would do.

There's no way to combat that argument or evaluate it fairly as its hypothetical.

In a vacuum if take the energy guy with personality over the business side when it come to recruiting. And Shafers young staff over Marrones.

I suspect you'd be right that the IPF and ACC would help - but I think we're selling Shafer and staff short as recruiters by saying it's just those things.

 

[TheCusian]

I think, I think, I think, but I don't know. "That" translates. That is revisionist history at it's finest. On this topic you just aren't correct. You're taking great liberties by taking a couple things he said over his time here and translating that into his actions. Again, if you followed recruiting closely during this period, overall there is absolutely no way you could accuse him of being detached from the process.

Cmon. He may have been involved - but we have stories where he turned away a heisman finalist who revered Ernie Davis. He can be cold and business like (an asset in other ways) and it doesn't translate like Shafers personality.

I followed recruiting during those days and it was a near constant drumbeat of "why can't we reel in the big recruits" and now that we have with Shafer its "the IPF and ACC"... Remember that video of Marrone with Ishaq!?! Couldn't have come off odder.

 

[qdawgg]

I suspect you'd be right that the IPF and ACC would help - but I think we're selling Shafer and staff short as recruiters by saying it's just those things.

This is the problem, not one person has sold Shafer short. In fact everyone on here has said that it seems Shafer long term is better at recruiting.

 

[TheCusian]

DING DING DING DING Marrone not liking recruiting had absolutely no effect on his staffs recruiting abilities. The piss poor facilities, and 1 win season took care of that. Forget the IPF, at least give him some renovated facilities and let's see what he could have done. I don't know if people forget or what, but renovations weren't completed until 2012. I said it before, but if Marrone and his staff had the same exact resources that we have now I am positive the recruiting results would be similar.

There's no way to combat that argument. If Shafer had Sabanon staff with SEC money he'd be a better recruiter too.

How about acknowledging the strides we've taken and the hard work this staff has put in? Parents of recruits coming to the board and saying "we went to FL and something about this staff" ... It's okay to look at Marrones numbers and wonder what could have been with better facilities - but saying that's the only difference is being hugely disingenuous.

 

[qdawgg]

Cmon. He may have been involved - but we have stories where he turned away a heisman finalist who revered Ernie Davis. He can be cold and business like (an asset in other ways) and it doesn't translate like Shafers personality.

I followed recruiting during those days and it was a near constant drumbeat of "why can't we reel in the big recruits" and now that we have with Shafer its "the IPF and ACC"... Remember that video of Marrone with Ishaq!?! Couldn't have come off odder.

LOL, I'm not sure if you're serious or not. Are you being serious?

Other than Washington, isn't this the same argument we've had on here the last few months with a number of recruits. Quite a few posters feel we are reaching on certain recruits, wondering why they are getting offers when no other big schools are interested, etc.??? I'm not saying I agree with their rationale but every single staff faces the same questions. Again, you say those are recruiting negatives during the Marrone era and the exact same things have occurred under Shafer. It's not a result of either coach, it's a result of the "recruiting game".

 

[TheCusian]

This is the problem, not one person has sold Shafer short. In fact everyone on here has said that it seems Shafer long term is better at recruiting.

You honestly think Marrones staff is as good as this staff at recruiting? I really don't see it.

 

[qdawgg]

How about acknowledging the strides we've taken and the hard work this staff has put in?

You really lose any credibility by making statements like this. No knowledgable poster is claiming Shafer hasn't made strides. You're just making things up to fit your agenda.

 

[TheCusian]

LOL, I'm not sure if you're serious or not. Are you being serious? Other than Washington, isn't this the same argument we've had on here the last few months with a number of recruits. Quite a few posters feel we are reaching on certain recruits, wondering why they are getting offers when no other big schools are interested, etc.??? I'm not saying I agree with their rationale but every single staff faces the same questions. Again, you say those are recruiting negatives during the Marrone era and the exact same things have occurred under Shafer. It's not a result of either coach, it's a result of the "recruiting game".

"Other than Washington" ... And who was Marrones top ESPN top 300 recruit?


We reached on far more guys under Marrone. More two star guys. Shafer - every cycle we've gotten better kids.

 

[qdawgg]

You honestly think Marrones staff is as good as this staff at recruiting? I really don't see it.

Dude - do you read what people write. Now I know why so many people get so frustrated trying to have a rationale conversation with you. I write that shafer is the better recruiter and you follow up with "ou honestly think Marrones staff is as good as this staff at recruiting? I really don't see it."

I'm actually starting to think you're actually trolling. I can't see any other rationale explanation.

 

[TheCusian]

You really lose any credibility by making statements like this. No knowledgable poster is claiming Shafer hasn't made strides. You're just making things up to fit your agenda.

Every time you or Anomander say "if Marrone had the IPF and the ACC and renovations he'd have a similar class" I think it's a dig at Shafer. Because he's better with people, his track record is less tattered with arrogance and perfectionism, his staff is younger and has better connections, and they've ramped up recruiting every year.

Marrone was/is a better offensive game planner. But he was not a great recruiter, IMO.

 

[qdawgg]

"Other than Washington" ... And who was Marrones top ESPN top 300 recruit?


We reached on far more guys under Marrone. More two star guys. Shafer - every cycle we've gotten better kids.

You really are trolling. Never did I claim Marrone recruited as well as Shafer, in fact I have said the exact opposite.

Marrone = ESPN top 300????? What part of anything did I say would asking this question be relevant???? Again, at this point you are just trolling.

 

[TheCusian]

Dude - do you read what people write. Now I know why so many people get so frustrated trying to have a rationale conversation with you. I write that shafer is the better recruiter and you follow up with "ou honestly think Marrones staff is as good as this staff at recruiting? I really don't see it." I'm actually starting to think you're actually trolling. I can't see any other rationale explanation.

Sorry - I keep reading how Marrone would have the same results and I think you're saying the IPF and ACC affiliation are THE reason why. Are you saying all things being equal Shafer is a better recruiter? Because if so we can stop talking about it because you've come around to what I've been saying.

I honestly don't care if people get frustrated. I try to play it fairly. I apologize when I'm wrong. I sometimes put my foot in my mouth and am not afraid to admit it.

 

[qdawgg]

Every time you or Anomander say "if Marrone had the IPF and the ACC and renovations he'd have a similar class" I think it's a dig at Shafer. Because he's better with people, his track record is less tattered with arrogance and perfectionism, his staff is younger and has better connections, and they've ramped up recruiting every year.

Marrone was/is a better offensive game planner. But he was not a great recruiter, IMO.

Find where I said anything about the IPF or the ACC. Isn't and hasn't ever been part of my argument.

I'm done. Not going to debate something when your rebuttal has nothing to do with anything I've said, over and over again.

 

[TheCusian]

You really are trolling. Never did I claim Marrone recruited as well as Shafer, in fact I have said the exact opposite. Marrone = ESPN top 300????? What part of anything did I say would asking this question be relevant???? Again, at this point you are just trolling.

I was pointing out that if you're talking about the differences in results between the two staffs you probably shouldn't exclude the biggest get we've gotten in either tenures to do so.

"Other than the steak and shrimp, this place is exactly like McDonalds"

 

[TheCusian]

Find where I said anything about the IPF or the ACC. Isn't and hasn't ever been part of my argument. I'm done. Not going to debate something when your rebuttal has nothing to do with anything I've said, over and over again.

Alright. I'm not sure what you've been arguing then. We basically agree. Both staffs created a family atmosphere, Shafers been a better recruiter.

Good night!

 

[money3189]

Well I have experience with both of them. Sat down with Marrone many times in my office. One time for 3 hours. Did the same with Shaf when they recruited my players and other kids in the area. Marrone was no slouch. I speak from experience. He was smooth and confident business orientated but he was easy to talk to. He knew what to say and when to say it. He had that NFL feel to him and the kids knew he was a NFL guy. It was great when he had practices in Rochester. I gave him ideas about restoring trust in our area and he listened. Despite Marrone's disliking of kissing the toes of these young propsects, he did what he had to do and was starting to understand today's athlete. The class with Trudo and ashton was a really good class when you think about it. We had no success (4-8) and he got some solid commitments. I love Shaf and I think he is better at recruiting. I just think Marrone is not as bad as you guys think. One thing I will tell you guys, no one on the current staff is as good as Wheatley. Wheatley was my guy.

 

[anomander]

There's no way to combat that argument. If Shafer had Sabanon staff with SEC money he'd be a better recruiter too. How about acknowledging the strides we've taken and the hard work this staff has put in? Parents of recruits coming to the board and saying "we went to FL and something about this staff" ... It's okay to look at Marrones numbers and wonder what could have been with better facilities - but saying that's the only difference is being hugely disingenuous.

I specifically said Shafer has elevated recruiting? I just don't think he's elevated it to the point that most people make it out to be. My original point was if Marrone and the staff he had was working with the resources we have today, I think the results would be similar. I mean we just had a top 50 recruiting class. So there has been improvements, just nothing exceptional.

Marrone did manage to piss off half of Jersey to the point of some coaches not allowing him in their schools. So he's got that going for him. Marrone was not a good recruiter and DID hate it. He wasn't gonna kiss anyone's butt, not kids, not parents. He did have some staff that had key connections in certain areas such as Adkins in the south, mainly Georgia, and Anselmo in NYC.

I'm not denying that he didn't like it, and the poor results speak for themselves. I'm just pointing out that he didn't have anything to work with. (No ACC affiliation, D3 facilities until 2012, 10 wins in 4 seasons, etc). It shouldn't be a surprised recruiting was poor.

 

[OrangePA]

Could be. We'll never know.

Didn't he win a recruiter of the year award or something like that while at either GA Tech or GA?

 

[florange44]

If changing the offense was such a dumb idea between 2013 - 2014, isn't Lester doing the exact same thing?

I'm not saying that Lester shouldn't but if it's a dumb idea when the OC everyone hates did it, isn't it a dumb idea now?

As others have said below, McDonald changed it from simple to complicated and the result was the offense went from semi successful to inept. Hopefully, Lester is changing back to simple which should get us to semi successful again (at least).

It's not the change itself that's bad, it's what you change to that could be bad.

Florange44

 

[money3189]

As others have said below, McDonald changed it from simple to complicated and the result was the offense went from semi successful to inept. Hopefully, Lester is changing back to simple which should get us to semi successful again (at least).

It's not the change itself that's bad, it's what you change to that could be bad.

Florange44

And it really is as simple as that

 

[Finwad32]

Didn't he win a recruiter of the year award or something like that while at either GA Tech or GA?

I believe he was named one of the Top 20 recruiters while at Miami by one of TOS.

NEVERMIND... Jumped in late and stuck my foot in my mouth. Wrong guy.