JUDAH'S BACK

[IthacaMatt]

Red’s toughest job is finding minutes for everyone. This will be his hardest job. Wanting minutes and earning minutes are two different things. There will be talent not playing next year. How Red handles this will determine how successful this team is. Thirteen players are not going to play. Lucky to have 9-10. Good luck.

People will HAVE to play hard on defense. And they will hopefully NEED to be subbed out regularly to get a blow.

 

[IthacaMatt]

It really is unbelievable

Well, it did honestly look like a shrtshow when Weitsman was chased off and then we lost Jesse, who seemingly wanted to be here. Sure, his dad pushed his decision, but it was like seeing your team be left out of conference realignment. So, let's not sugar-coat it. People and programs have been put in place (rather quickly, too!), but it looked bleak there for a while.

 

[007]

Right. Look at how Villanova plays [which I think will prove to be a similar template on offense to what we see from Red -- time will tell, but that's my expectation].

A lead guard. Two bigger wings [guard, forward -- whatever]. A versatile forward who plays inside / outside, and can shoot. A big to rebound / defend / score inside a little.

We have the right components to play this style.

Lead guard - Mintz.
Two bigger wings - JJ / Westry.
Versatile inside / outside forward - Williams.
Dunker / defender - Brown / McLeod / Hima [depending upon matchups, lots of fouls to use].

But I agree that positions are being rendered obsolete in modern basketball, outside of PG. And even that distiniction, JJ and Westry will both be relied upon to handle against pressure, distribute the rock, and make plays off of the bounce, so...

Good points RF.

As you know, I have always been a huge believer in the need to have a true PG. But now that you can fill the roster with versatile playmakers, that need becomes less critical but still important. We will have that covered both ways - a true PG and versatility.

I'm REALLY looking forward to this style of play, even though I know there will be growing pains and a learning curve for the staff and the players.

 

[Orangezoo]

People will HAVE to play hard on defense. And they will hopefully NEED to be subbed out regularly to get a blow.

When you have a leader like Judah will be and guys who are out there to get to work this is going to drive everyone to push hard. Starling and Westry won't be coming in to mess around. It's about getting to work and getting results. You've got that in Quadir too. That intensity spreads and no one wants to be the guy dogging it on their teammates.

 

[Jasoncuse]

Yeah, Benny going an average of 2/5 from 3 in a typical game is more what we’d like to see from him.

Last year he was kinda like CJ Fair that one season, where he didn’t shoot a ton of 3’s, but made nearly half of them.
That was his Jr year, btw
30/64 = ~47%.

C.J. Fair

Syracuse University basketball profile for C.J. Fair, player for the Orange from 2011-2014.

www.orangehoops.org

We don’t want him just camping out at the 3pt line looking for catch & shoot opportunities -
That’s not maximizing his size or skillset.

Until the Pitt garbage time game, Benny was only 10-35 on the season. With that game and the Wake games propping up his season %, he shot under 30% in all the other games combined. I'm not sure anybody should expect him to shoot close to 40% from 3 for the year if his volume creeps up to 4-5 attempts per game. I would expect maybe 100 total attempts on the year, and hope he can hit 35ish.

 

[Niastri]

No offense, but I do not want Benny averaging 8 three point attempts per game under any circumstances. And there's no chance he shoots 40% at that volume. Girard never even averaged 8 three point attempts. I think the only guys in recent memory that have were Buddy and Andrew White.

As a team, we shot only 17.1 threes a game last year, far and away last in the ACC. In comparison, Pitt shot 25.1 to have the most attempts in the league.

Girard shot only 7.2 threes a game because he couldn't get open. The same guys locking Girard down can't get high enough to contest Williams. 8 might be a stretch, I agree, but for a couple things:

Last season, Syracuse was 142nd in possessions per game, with 70.8. The leaders in pace were over 77. That's almost 10% more shots to go around. Top 30 in pace would have been 74 possessions. The faster pace Red plans will give help give Williams more attempts.

Our starting lineup might have only one guy dedicated to shooting. Williams will be the beneficiary of three excellent penetrating guards who also pass well. This means more open threes. The team will look to get him the ball in catch and shoot situations if he can hit them at an elite rate.

One last thing, Williams took a lot of long two pointers last year... I'm hoping he takes a step back and shoots from three a little more often next season.

 

[Trueblue25]

Well, it did honestly look like a shrtshow when Weitsman was chased off and then we lost Jesse, who seemingly wanted to be here. Sure, his dad pushed his decision, but it was like seeing your team be left out of conference realignment. So, let's not sugar-coat it. People and programs have been put in place (rather quickly, too!), but it looked bleak there for a while.

One side beat the other in the race to control the narrative on that split, which Jesse’s departure made opportune. Thats just my opinion.

But I do know that Cuse has a deeper Nil chest to pull from than our media or some have been led to believe.

 

[SWC75]

I think the lack of proven three point shooters means that we've got to play more aggressive defense and beat the other team down the court. I think we're in position to do that - if we can get defensive rebounds.

 

[Orangezoo]

It's funny today... yesterday we drove ourselves insane waiting. Last night we got drunk on the excitement. Today we are hungover with the creeping doubt as though the excitement was just orange colored beer goggles.

 

[SUFan44]

Williams is a plus athlete. Bell is a plus athlete. Brown might not be quite on their level, but he's an ACC caliber athlete. Taylor / Copeland are athletic, too. If Carey ultimately projects at PF, he's athletic as well.

Not sure that I see athleticism as a problem the way you do.

Now, scoring consistency? Certainly question marks throughout the forward unit on that basis.

Williams I agree with. That's one.

I have disagreed with the "Bell plus athlete" narrative for quite some time. I don't see it and don't understand how that has been the standard line on him.

Taylor, I don't think he's an elite athlete that we've been used to at the forward position. Plus I think his best position is at guard. Copeland I also view as a guard.

Carey hasn't played - until he plays, he's not in my equation.

In terms of playable forwards, we have:

1 plus athlete (Williams)
1 decent athlete (Bell)
1 average athlete (Brown)

Not exactly Grant/Fair/Southerland or even Roberts/Nichols.

I'll close by saying I don't think this precludes us from winning. I also think Westry will be the '3' in our system and we'll play a lot of three guard sets, which means we might only need one of the forwards to play at any given time.

A lot to be excited about, but forward and center are certainly unsettled in my eyes -- with potential to be perfectly fine if not better.

 

[50YRsofCuse]

Judah's back and also his arms and his legs! But I love his head the most. He realized he'd be better off maximizing his skills before asking to be judged by the NBA, or he could get lost in the waves of talent that enter pro ball every year.

As for SU, the dream of starting four guys who, as recruits were rated in the top 50 means that the raw talent level of this team is the best it's been since we were a Top 5 program a decade ago.

The thing is, that might not even be our best line-up. Judah had started to hit from outside last year but was 30% for the year. So was JJ Starling. Chance Westry has the size to play the '3' but was 0 for 14 from three. Benny Williams was a laudable 39.6% on just 48 attempts in 30 games. IN this line-up he'd be the power forward and Red will want him playing closer to the basket. A team's power forward is rarely their #1 outside shooter. And he did this as a fourth option. We're looking for someone who warranted special defensive attention and could pull the defense away from the basket so that all these guys who can score off the dribble can have room to maneuver. For that reason, Chris Bell and Justin Taylor have to be our 3's and we have to go with the hot hand there, unless Judah, JJ or Chance develop into credible outside threats.

I think the real loser is Quadir Copeland, whose combination of amazing passing skills but a poor outside shot is poorly served at the '3'. He was brought here to be a point guard and he might have been one - maybe our best one - without Mintz. He can help us if we are playing pressure defense but he's not going to get a chance to do much else.

I don’t think that you can count Quadir out. He and Westry have similar skills as well as size. Would not be surprised in seeing Quadir being a part of the regular 4 man guard rotation,

 

[SWC75]

I don’t think that you can count Quadir out. He and Westry have similar skills as well as size. Would not be surprised in seeing Quadir being a part of the regular 4 man guard rotation,

Wouldn't that make it a 5-man rotation, (Mintz, Starling, Westry Cuffe and Copeland), unless Westry's at the '3'?

 

[SWC75]

Williams I agree with. That's one.

I have disagreed with the "Bell plus athlete" narrative for quite some time. I don't see it and don't understand how that has been the standard line on him.

Taylor, I don't think he's an elite athlete that we've been used to at the forward position. Plus I think his best position is at guard. Copeland I also view as a guard.

Carey hasn't played - until he plays, he's not in my equation.

In terms of playable forwards, we have:

1 plus athlete (Williams)
1 decent athlete (Bell)
1 average athlete (Brown)

Not exactly Grant/Fair/Southerland or even Roberts/Nichols.

I'll close by saying I don't think this precludes us from winning. I also think Westry will be the '3' in our system and we'll play a lot of three guard sets, which means we might only need one of the forwards to play at any given time.

A lot to be excited about, but forward and center are certainly unsettled in my eyes -- with potential to be perfectly fine if not better.

Assuming no one abandons ship, this will be a very deep team with many players who can play multiple positions. There will be a lot of competition for spots and a lot of combinations Red can use. Hopefully, he'll use all of them to keep them interested and get the most out of every player.

 

[Orangezoo]

Wouldn't that make it a 5-man rotation, (Mintz, Starling, Westry Cuffe and Copeland), unless Westry's at the '3'?

Not to mention we shouldn't end up shocked if you see an occasional 4G lineup with QC as 4th guard and running 7-4 in the middle. Purdue did a good bit of that at times...if QC and Westry rebound well especially.

No more rules to playing traditional lineups

 

[dollarbill44]

Red’s toughest job is finding minutes for everyone. This will be his hardest job. Wanting minutes and earning minutes are two different things. There will be talent not playing next year. How Red handles this will determine how successful this team is. Thirteen players are not going to play. Lucky to have 9-10. Good luck.

That depends on the pace of play. If we go all out for long stretches, you can sub liberally to keep everyone fresh all game long.

 

[50YRsofCuse]

Wouldn't that make it a 5-man rotation, (Mintz, Starling, Westry Cuffe and Copeland), unless Westry's at the '3'?

Cuffe is the wild card. We are not sure what he has to show. If he does show scoring potential, he will be in the mix. Believe that Judah, Chance and Quadir are your best ball handlers and passers. Believe that 2 of them will be on the count at all times.

Good thing that Red is playing a positionless team strategy ?? that way we can field a 3 or 4 guard lineup at times where forwards are not effective.

we need to take advantage of the speed and athleticism that the players on the team have. Run, score, defense, press, steal, run, score.

I may be dreaming but they have the depth and the horses to do this.

 

[Orangezoo]

Cuffe is the wild card. We are not sure what he has to show. If he does show scoring potential, he will be in the mix. Believe that Judah, Chance and Quadir are your best ball handlers and passers. Believe that 2 of them will be on the count at all times.

Good thing that Red is playing a positionless team strategy ?? that way we can field a 3 or 4 guard lineup at times where forwards are not effective.

we need to take advantage of the speed and athleticism that the players on the team have. Run, score, defense, press, steal, run, score.

I may be dreaming but they have the depth and the horses to do this.

One of things with pressing is that I hope it's 3/4 court and slowly falls back vs full court and stretched. You watch Andersons press at St Johns and the issue is like what we would see with trunk monkey in that if it doesn't properly stop the ball early it's way to stretched and often an easy bucket the other way.

 

[shandeezy7]

As a team, we shot only 17.1 threes a game last year, far and away last in the ACC. In comparison, Pitt shot 25.1 to have the most attempts in the league.

Girard shot only 7.2 threes a game because he couldn't get open. The same guys locking Girard down can't get high enough to contest Williams. 8 might be a stretch, I agree, but for a couple things:

Last season, Syracuse was 142nd in possessions per game, with 70.8. The leaders in pace were over 77. That's almost 10% more shots to go around. Top 30 in pace would have been 74 possessions. The faster pace Red plans will give help give Williams more attempts.

Our starting lineup might have only one guy dedicated to shooting. Williams will be the beneficiary of three excellent penetrating guards who also pass well. This means more open threes. The team will look to get him the ball in catch and shoot situations if he can hit them at an elite rate.

One last thing, Williams took a lot of long two pointers last year... I'm hoping he takes a step back and shoots from three a little more often next season.

We shot so few threes because we had no one to take them. I could see some improvement from Benny at the 3 point line, but 40% on high volume is just too high expectation for him. As was said before, if he could shoot around 35% on around 100-125 attempts, I think that would be great for him. He can score in other ways. I'd love to see him be more aggressive slashing and cutting. He's a guy that should be crushing backdoor lobs and the like.

 

[RF2044]

Williams I agree with. That's one.

I have disagreed with the "Bell plus athlete" narrative for quite some time. I don't see it and don't understand how that has been the standard line on him.

Taylor, I don't think he's an elite athlete that we've been used to at the forward position. Plus I think his best position is at guard. Copeland I also view as a guard.

Carey hasn't played - until he plays, he's not in my equation.

In terms of playable forwards, we have:

1 plus athlete (Williams)
1 decent athlete (Bell)
1 average athlete (Brown)

Not exactly Grant/Fair/Southerland or even Roberts/Nichols.

I'll close by saying I don't think this precludes us from winning. I also think Westry will be the '3' in our system and we'll play a lot of three guard sets, which means we might only need one of the forwards to play at any given time.

A lot to be excited about, but forward and center are certainly unsettled in my eyes -- with potential to be perfectly fine if not better.

Agree that we're somewhat unproven at forward, disagree with your assessment of Bell and Brown.

But I agree that the way Bell plays doesn't optimize his plus athleticism.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Well, it did honestly look like a shrtshow when Weitsman was chased off and then we lost Jesse, who seemingly wanted to be here. Sure, his dad pushed his decision, but it was like seeing your team be left out of conference realignment. So, let's not sugar-coat it. People and programs have been put in place (rather quickly, too!), but it looked bleak there for a while.

Because a PR war was waged that wasn’t anything remotely close to the truth. It’s why I’ve been hammering some posters/writers since.

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

I think only Mintz averages over 30 and the minutes thing simply won’t be an issue. This is a young team a couple guys inevitably won’t be at the required level and will be exposed early with the brutal schedule and the rotation will shrink.

 

[50YRsofCuse]

One of things with pressing is that I hope it's 3/4 court and slowly falls back vs full court and stretched. You watch Andersons press at St Johns and the issue is like what we would see with trunk monkey in that if it doesn't properly stop the ball early it's way to stretched and often an easy bucket the other way.

You have a point but it truly matters how the press is effective and what 5 players are running it. For example, with a big man like McLoud, Mounir and maybe Patterson as an anchor, you can help prevent that situation.

No matter what, the proof is in the pudding. It all depends on what strategy Red deploys and how it is executed. it seemed like the team had a hard time inbounding the ball a couple of years ago.

I also believe any press can be broken.

 

[OrangePA]

Great news!

 

[kirbivore]

I hope Judah gets this level pop when he gets introduced in Game 1

 

[kirbivore]

Great news, kids just got very excited to hear. He's an easy kid to like. Experience to go with his passion is good

Led by that dork Brent Axe.