2020-21 ny mets thread

[SWC75]

Lindor's offensive stats have been trending down for the past three years. He was great his first four years. I wonder?

Francisco Lindor Stats | Baseball-Reference.com

Also, he's 0 for 1 in steals after being 22 of 27 in 2019.

 

[sutomcat]

Also, he's 0 for 1 in steals after being 22 of 27 in 2019.

Was watching a bit of a Yankees game this weekend.

I believe one of their announcers said the Yankees were second last in MLB in steals. The only team with fewer SBs was the Mets.

The Mets have 3. For the season. Their entire team. The Yankees have 5.

The Mets are also last in MLB in home runs so far. I thought this team would hit a ton of them. Perhaps it will happen some day.

What a weird season.

 

[SWC75]

Was watching a bit of a Yankees game this weekend.

I believe one of their announcers said the Yankees were second last in MLB in steals. The only team with fewer SBs was the Mets.

The Mets have 3. For the season. Their entire team. The Yankees have 5.

The Mets are also last in MLB in home runs so far. I thought this team would hit a ton of them. Perhaps it will happen some day.

What a weird season.

And we're tied for first with no power and no speed!

MLB Standings - 2024 season - ESPN

Visit ESPN for the complete 2024 MLB season standings. Includes league, conference and division standings for regular season and playoffs.

www.espn.com

 

[SWC75]

The Syracuse Mets tomorrow will play their first game since 9/3/19.

Remember 9/3/19???

Syracuse Mets end season with heartbreaking 14-13 loss to Scranton/Wilkes-Barre RailRiders in one-game playoff (milb.com)

New York Mets at Washington Nationals Box Score, September 3, 2019 | Baseball-Reference.com

 

[OrangeFoo]

hopefull Diaz back issue is just a one time thing.. should have taken him out after 1 batter the way he looked.

Did he have a back issue or was it a soccer "injury" where the dude is only "hurt" after he got schooled?

Diaz was hitting 100mph pretty regularly both against Hoskins and the guys before him. His control was completely non-existent. I think it's quite the coincidence that he happened to be hurt after giving up what seemed to be a game tying HR.

Worst trade in Mets history so far and that's saying a lot.

 

[sutomcat]

Did he have a back issue or was it a soccer "injury" where the dude is only "hurt" after he got schooled?

Diaz was hitting 100mph pretty regularly both against Hoskins and the guys before him. His control was completely non-existent. I think it's quite the coincidence that he happened to be hurt after giving up what seemed to be a game tying HR.

Worst trade in Mets history so far and that's saying a lot.

I think they had a meeting on the mound during the inning when things started to go sour where Diaz said his back was tight but he felt he could pitch through it and wanted to stay in the game.

I wish Rojas would not pitch his closer in games like this. Diaz has a history of pitching poorly with a big lead and I would rather have him 100% for the next game, when it might be close and you actually need a closer to end the game.

 

[SWC75]

Did he have a back issue or was it a soccer "injury" where the dude is only "hurt" after he got schooled?

Diaz was hitting 100mph pretty regularly both against Hoskins and the guys before him. His control was completely non-existent. I think it's quite the coincidence that he happened to be hurt after giving up what seemed to be a game tying HR.

Worst trade in Mets history so far and that's saying a lot.

Both Cano and Diaz have been disappointments, although they have had some good moments, too. Cano played 156 games for the Mets and hit .275 with 37 doubles and 23 home runs, better numbers than people realize. he's suspended for the 2021 season. I haven't found anything saying that he couldn't be a Met in 2022, so he may not be done. Diaz has blown 11 saves but made 35 of them. He's not done.

Jay Bruce played 47 games for the Mariners, batting .212 and moved on to the Phillies and Yankees and has announced his retirement. Anthony Swarzak pitched 15 games for Seattle, going 2-2 with 3 blown saves. He went onto the braves, the D-Backs and signed a minor league contract with the Phillies. Gerson Bautista pitched in 8 games, a total of 9 innings in 2019 with an 0-1 record for Seattle in 2019 and hasn't bene in the majors since. Justin Dunn has done pretty well in limited action for the Mariners, starting 18 games with a 5-1 record despite a 4.04 ERA. The key player for Seattle was Jarred Kelenic, who has done well in the minors, hitting .273 with 29 homers and 35 steals in 173 games. people who say it was a lousy deal for the Mets are primarily talking about him. But he has yet to play a major league game yet.

Trade sending Robinson Cano, Edwin Diaz to New York Mets from Seattle Mariners now official (espn.com)

This may someday become a bad trade but so far the Mets have gotten more out of it than Seattle has.

 

[sutomcat]

Both Cano and Diaz have been disappointments, although they have had some good moments, too. Cano played 156 games for the Mets and hit .275 with 37 doubles and 23 home runs, better numbers than people realize. he's suspended for the 2021 season. I haven't found anything saying that he couldn't be a Met in 2022, so he may not be done. Diaz has blown 11 saves but made 35 of them. He's not done.

Jay Bruce played 47 games for the Mariners, batting .212 and moved on to the Phillies and Yankees and has announced his retirement. Anthony Swarzak pitched 15 games for Seattle, going 2-2 with 3 blown saves. He went onto the braves, the D-Backs and signed a minor league contract with the Phillies. Gerson Bautista pitched in 8 games, a total of 9 innings in 2019 with an 0-1 record for Seattle in 2019 and hasn't bene in the majors since. Justin Dunn has done pretty well in limited action for the Mariners, starting 18 games with a 5-1 record despite a 4.04 ERA. The key player for Seattle was Jarred Kelenic, who has done well in the minors, hitting .273 with 29 homers and 35 steals in 173 games. people who say it was a lousy deal for the Mets are primarily talking about him. But he has yet to play a major league game yet.

Trade sending Robinson Cano, Edwin Diaz to New York Mets from Seattle Mariners now official (espn.com)

This may someday become a bad trade but so far the Mets have gotten more out of it than Seattle has.

You are ignoring the enormous impact on payroll the Mets have had to deal with taking on the worst contract in baseball with Cano.

Anyone taking that awful contract for a player with his background with drugs, his injury history and his age, should get a lot in return.

Cano had negative value. No one in baseball wanted any part of that contract except the team whose GM used to be the player's agent.

Worst trade in baseball history. By an enormous amount. And Brody tried in include McNeil in the deal too. What an idiot he was.

 

[SWC75]

You are ignoring the enormous impact on payroll the Mets have had to deal with taking on the worst contract in baseball with Cano.

Anyone taking that awful contract for a player with his background with drugs, his injury history and his age, should get a lot in return.

Cano had negative value. No one in baseball wanted any part of that contract except the team whose GM used to be the player's agent.

Worst trade in baseball history. By an enormous amount. And Brody tried in include McNeil in the deal too. What an idiot he was.

You are correct that I was focusing on on-the-field contributions, not the payroll. Cano's contract was created by the Mariners and will be up after the 2023 season. $240 million over 10 years is not unheard of, although the length of it at his age (31 at the time), was silly. But I don't see how that makes this "the worst trade in baseball history by an enormous amount".

 

[sutomcat]

You are correct that I was focusing on on-the-field contributions, not the payroll. Cano's contract was created by the Mariners and will be up after the 2023 season. $240 million over 10 years is not unheard of, although the length of it at his age (31 at the time), was silly. But I don't see how that makes this "the worst trade in baseball history by an enormous amount".

I don't want to argue about this further. You are a great poster and I am glad you are a Met fan too. Go Mets!

 

[donniesyracuse]

You are correct that I was focusing on on-the-field contributions, not the payroll. Cano's contract was created by the Mariners and will be up after the 2023 season. $240 million over 10 years is not unheard of, although the length of it at his age (31 at the time), was silly. But I don't see how that makes this "the worst trade in baseball history by an enormous amount".

Yeah, when people talk about "worst trades," it's usually a scenario where a team gives up multiple future stars for a failing veteran. There is also Babe Ruth.

 

[SWC75]

Yeah, when people talk about "worst trades," it's usually a scenario where a team gives up multiple future stars for a failing veteran. There is also Babe Ruth.

The Babe's contract was sold for money.

The Met's worse trade was Nolan Ryan for Jim Fregosi. But nobody thought so at the time. That's the point. You've got to see how it shakes out. This trade may turn out to be bad, but it hasn't yet.

 

[OrangeFoo]

The Babe's contract was sold for money.

The Met's worse trade was Nolan Ryan for Jim Fregosi. But nobody thought so at the time. That's the point. You've got to see how it shakes out. This trade may turn out to be bad, but it hasn't yet.

I'll give you one area the trade has been bad... one of the main reason Mets missed the playoffs in 2019 was blown saves. However the Mets had so much money tied up in Diaz they weren't willing to go out and get another closer. Also if you'll recall... Cano wasn't great in 2019 either and he forced McNeil out of position, who forced Davis out of position, who forced Dom out out position and so on and so forth. All to fit in an aging, PED driven batter who is wildly overpaid.

Cano's contract will also hurt the Mets next year as they try to upgrade different positions but will have that albatross to deal with. They will have a LOT less room below the salary cap next year.

 

[upperdeck]

I'll give you one area the trade has been bad... one of the main reason Mets missed the playoffs in 2019 was blown saves. However the Mets had so much money tied up in Diaz they weren't willing to go out and get another closer. Also if you'll recall... Cano wasn't great in 2019 either and he forced McNeil out of position, who forced Davis out of position, who forced Dom out out position and so on and so forth. All to fit in an aging, PED driven batter who is wildly overpaid.

Cano's contract will also hurt the Mets next year as they try to upgrade different positions but will have that albatross to deal with. They will have a LOT less room below the salary cap next year.

mets didnt have any money in Diaz.. he made 600K thats barely above league Min. the 5 Mill last yr was still Ok even 7 mill this yr isnt bad.. They have control until 2023 season.

 

[SWC75]

I'll give you one area the trade has been bad... one of the main reason Mets missed the playoffs in 2019 was blown saves. However the Mets had so much money tied up in Diaz they weren't willing to go out and get another closer. Also if you'll recall... Cano wasn't great in 2019 either and he forced McNeil out of position, who forced Davis out of position, who forced Dom out out position and so on and so forth. All to fit in an aging, PED driven batter who is wildly overpaid.

Cano's contract will also hurt the Mets next year as they try to upgrade different positions but will have that albatross to deal with. They will have a LOT less room below the salary cap next year.

Those are considerations. I wouldn't be surprised if this turns out to be a bad trade. I'm just pointing out that Seattle hasn't seen their positive results quite yet.

Playing with some numbers: Cano had driven in 69 runs for the Mets and also scored 69 runs. Subtract his 23 home runs and he's produced 115 runs. Edwin Diaz has given up 46 runs so that's +69 runs for the Mets.

Jay Bruce drove in 28 runs for Seattle and scored 27, hitting 14 homers. That's 41 runs produced. Jarred Kelenic has none so far. Anthony Swarzak gave up 11 runs in his brief stint with Seattle. So did Gerson Bautista. Justin Dunn has given up 34 runs. 41-11-11-34 = -15 runs for the Mariners.

So by that measure the Mets have had the better of the trade so far. I suspect that's going to change and may change rapidly when Kelenic comes up. It just hasn't happened yet.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Good news everyone... Diaz says he feels "much better" today. I'm sure that cross country flight from Philly to STL really helped his sore back out.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Those are considerations. I wouldn't be surprised if this turns out to be a bad trade. I'm just pointing out that Seattle hasn't seen their positive results quite yet.

Playing with some numbers: Cano had driven in 69 runs for the Mets and also scored 69 runs. Subtract his 23 home runs and he's produced 115 runs. Edwin Diaz has given up 46 runs so that's +69 runs for the Mets.

Jay Bruce drove in 28 runs for Seattle and scored 27, hitting 14 homers. That's 41 runs produced. Jarred Kelenic has none so far. Anthony Swarzak gave up 11 runs in his brief stint with Seattle. So did Gerson Bautista. Justin Dunn has given up 34 runs. 41-11-11-34 = -15 runs for the Mariners.

So by that measure the Mets have had the better of the trade so far. I suspect that's going to change and may change rapidly when Kelenic comes up. It just hasn't happened yet.

Another way of looking at it... according to baseball prospectus in 2019 Diaz had a 1.2 WARP and Cano had a 0 WARP. For reference, WARP For an average player is 2. So in 2019, between Diaz and Cano we had two players, in total, have less impact than one MLB average player. Or to put it a different way, one player off the street would have been better than having both of them and that could have pushed the Mets over the hump to make the playoffs.

 

[SWC75]

Another way of looking at it... according to baseball prospectus in 2019 Diaz had a 1.2 WARP and Cano had a 0 WARP. For reference, WARP For an average player is 2. So in 2019, between Diaz and Cano we had two players, in total, have less impact than one MLB average player. Or to put it a different way, one player off the street would have been better than having both of them and that could have pushed the Mets over the hump to make the playoffs.

I think it means that if we'd have average players in those sports, (not someone off the street), we'd have made the playoffs. FWIW.

 

[Briancuse]

Did he have a back issue or was it a soccer "injury" where the dude is only "hurt" after he got schooled?

Diaz was hitting 100mph pretty regularly both against Hoskins and the guys before him. His control was completely non-existent. I think it's quite the coincidence that he happened to be hurt after giving up what seemed to be a game tying HR.

Worst trade in Mets history so far and that's saying a lot.

Rumor is they made it up to give familia more time.

 

[OrangeFoo]

I think it means that if we'd have average players in those sports, (not someone off the street), we'd have made the playoffs. FWIW.

Fine... I was exaggerating for effect. I think technically warp means replacement player right? A replacement player could come from the street. Not that it really matters.

The point is the Mets would have been better off with of lot of other players vs the two players the Mets got back in that trade

 

[upperdeck]

Fine... I was exaggerating for effect. I think technically warp means replacement player right? A replacement player could come from the street. Not that it really matters.

The point is the Mets would have been better off with of lot of other players vs the two players the Mets got back in that trade

but given the Mets recent history they also could have put 2 worse players out there.

 

[OrangeFoo]

but given the Mets recent history they also could have put 2 worse players out there.

Sure but we are talking about generic replacement players and ignoring curses like the billy goat curse, the curse of babe ruth, and more recently the curse of the wilponzis

 

[JeremyCuse]

Mets fire Chili Davis and Tom Slater

 

[OrangeFoo]

Mets fire Chili Davis and Tom Slater

Hugh Quattlebaum? That’s gotta be a made up name right?

 

[JeremyCuse]

Hugh Quattlebaum? That’s gotta be a made up name right?

Wasn't that a character from Total Recall?