ACC has too many good basketball players to rely on just the zone

[OrangeFoo]

I dont think that is the point of his post. The Big East may have had better elite NBA talent but the ACC overall has better players 1-12 on rosters than the Big East did and instead of being athletes (which the NBA loves) the ACC is filled with ND type teams who have play stall ball and shoot the 3 ball well.

We can out-athlete anyone in the country pretty much every year. So when you come at us with athletes and suspect shooting, good luck. When you come at us with high bball iq, 3 point shooting and a stall ball game plan with a decent bench, its like playing ND every night with lower-tier, middle of the pack ACC teams, whereas we could just run those middle of the pack, lower-tier teams out of the gym in the Big East.

Thank you. This is exactly what I was trying to say.

 

[zhanjuzi]

Its not that hard to figure out. Teams pack the defense In and let us shoot jump shots. Our nba pg from last year couldn't really shoot jumpers either. All of our players are most dangerous when driving the lane and not so terrifying as outside shooters. Our best offense in recent memory had wes and andy stretching defenses. As of now, we are terribly predictable on offense.

Except when Cooney is on which opens up everything.

 

[SBU72]

I sincerely doubt that tha ACC has better basketball players top to bottom. Heck they aren't scoringg any better than the BE did. And what does them supposedly having better b-ball players have to do with SU having trouble scoring? Having a team who can't shoot jump shots is what is hurting. CJ hasn't hit a 10 ft jump shot in 2 games. Ennis hasn't done much better' nor anybody else. When you can't make open shots, it makes hit hard to win.

 

[ImperialOrange]

Except when Cooney is on which opens up everything.

Teams blanket Cooney regardless. It's still 4 in the lane + 1 on Cooney. We need someone else to hit from outside.

 

[longislandcuse]

I sincerely doubt that tha ACC has better basketball players top to bottom. Heck they aren't scoringg any better than the BE did. And what does them supposedly having better b-ball players have to do with SU having trouble scoring? Having a team who can't shoot jump shots is what is hurting. CJ hasn't hit a 10 ft jump shot in 2 games. Ennis hasn't done much better' nor anybody else. When you can't make open shots, it makes hit hard to win.

ACC has a ton of teams that are rated high in defensive efficiency as well as a bunch of team who play amongst the slowest paces in CBB. Combine good defense with a slow pace and that contributes to the low scoring.

We were pretty high in offensive efficiency per possession until we started playing like a bunch of 8 year olds on Saturday morning trying to put the ball in the basket.

 

[Jack Hall]

Over the past few years we have come to rely on the zone to not only shutdown other teams but also to compensate for our increasingly poor offensive teams by getting us easy buckets off of turnovers and missed three pointers. One huge difference I've noticed about ACC teams is that overall the conference has much better basketball players then the BE... the BE had much better athletes but not basketball players.

For better or for worse when we are playing the zone we are plat on the percentages that means we are relying on other teams to miss some open shots. Unfortunately the ACC has enough good ball players where they generally hit enough shots and make just enough good plays and play disciplined enough to keep it close against us. Now if we had a halfway decent offense this wouldn't be a problem but because our O is so bad every game becomes a tight one because the other team is not just going to miss those open shots or make those dumb plays we could rely on our former BE brethren to do. Those dumb plays and missed shots were the difference between close games and comfortable 10 point plus wins.

This is not a panic post saying the sky is falling or trash the zone post this is just an observation that might explain why we have had so many close calls this year. We are going to need to start recruiting players who can score and play basketball again and not just rely on our D to carry us. I suspect that the ACC will catch on to how to play against the zone pretty quickly and once they do we will need to be able to play offense again.

Its not the zone its the slowdown. Both our opponents and us (i think because we have a short bench and JB is trying to save the starters) are stalling in halfcourt and waiting to shoot w less than 5-10 secs left in shot clock. Fewer possessions equal closer games. To me thats the price of a bench that is banged up (Baye) and JB doesnt fully trust (Gbinje and Roberson). No worries we played low scoring, grind it out games last yr in the tourney and made FF. Same w BET, we got to finals playing slow down but then against ul things got up tempo and they won comfortably in the end. That might have shaped JBs thinking for this season?

 

[SoBeCuse]

In CBB if you don't have 3 point shooting, your offense is going to struggle. It looks like we're fixing that with upcoming recruiting classes as well as BJJ coming up through the ranks.

It is interesting how UNC has righted their ship. They suck at threes and FT's (not last night) and are playing well.

 

[SoBeCuse]

As SWC pointed out in that terrific 'Fixing The Offense' thread our OFPP has been steadily declining. The defense has been fine. NCSU didn't even hold the ball that long and we still couldn't get over 60 points. Michigan didn't hold the ball that long last year in the Tourney and we couldn't get much going. Mostly ISO ball and a typical charge/chrashing into a defender tunnel vision at the end sealing the fate. Maybe it is all about hitting open spots in certain spaces on the floor with Boeheim's offense but when the team can't shoot well then there has to be better ways of creating better opportunities near the rim I would think. I don't know that much in terms of X's and O's so maybe this can't be fixed other than getting Cooney better looks and Ennis not dribbling and stalling with the ball so long before things get going. The tempo needs to be increased somehow or we're playing with fire vs teams who milk the clock.

 

[TheCurtain]

The zone is living off last year's reputation. The top of this year's zone is swiss cheese. The backline does a good job of denying baskets when people try to attack the rim but that doesn't stop kickouts for open 3s. A team with 6 wins scored 42 pts in 16 minutes because our guards suck at zone principles. The slow tempo makes that stat even more putrid.

Offense is just as much of an issue, but let's take off the blinders about the zone this year.

 

[Knicks411]

We still rank higher in offensive efficiency than defensive efficiency, though it's just one spot. We've dropped like 10 spots over the last 2 games, which have been terrible efforts. Prior to that the offense was fnatastic. Hopefully it's just as simple as shots that normally fall not going in.

 

[rstone7727]

My point was that for the last few years we have relied on our D which relies on other teams missing shots and not executing to win us games and our offense has sucked.

Good defense does not rely on other teams missing shots, it forces them to miss shots. Further, the ACC players are not as good as we faced in the BE. Next year maybe. Sorry but you sound like you are new to CBB...?

 

[Madbiker]

Over the past few years we have come to rely on the zone to not only shutdown other teams but also to compensate for our increasingly poor offensive teams by getting us easy buckets off of turnovers and missed three pointers. One huge difference I've noticed about ACC teams is that overall the conference has much better basketball players then the BE... the BE had much better athletes but not basketball players.

For better or for worse when we are playing the zone we are plat on the percentages that means we are relying on other teams to miss some open shots. Unfortunately the ACC has enough good ball players where they generally hit enough shots and make just enough good plays and play disciplined enough to keep it close against us. Now if we had a halfway decent offense this wouldn't be a problem but because our O is so bad every game becomes a tight one because the other team is not just going to miss those open shots or make those dumb plays we could rely on our former BE brethren to do. Those dumb plays and missed shots were the difference between close games and comfortable 10 point plus wins.

This is not a panic post saying the sky is falling or trash the zone post this is just an observation that might explain why we have had so many close calls this year. We are going to need to start recruiting players who can score and play basketball again and not just rely on our D to carry us. I suspect that the ACC will catch on to how to play against the zone pretty quickly and once they do we will need to be able to play offense again.

Do you have any stats that back up your assertion that the ACC teams shoot better than Big East teams? Because I doubt the stats would show much of a difference overall.

 

[TinyManInside]

What this team could use more than anything is a James Southerland-type off the bench. A 6-8 guy who can provide the threat to shoot over defenses.

The weak link in the offense is really having only a single reliable three point threat. If Cooney is missing then there is no one else to help stretch the defense.

 

[pulaski74]

As SWC pointed out in that terrific 'Fixing The Offense' thread our OFPP has been steadily declining. The defense has been fine. NCSU didn't even hold the ball that long and we still couldn't get over 60 points. Michigan didn't hold the ball that long last year in the Tourney and we couldn't get much going. Mostly ISO ball and a typical charge/chrashing into a defender tunnel vision at the end sealing the fate. Maybe it is all about hitting open spots in certain spaces on the floor with Boeheim's offense but when the team can't shoot well then there has to be better ways of creating better opportunities near the rim I would think. I don't know that much in terms of X's and O's so maybe this can't be fixed other than getting Cooney better looks and Ennis not dribbling and stalling with the ball so long before things get going. The tempo needs to be increased somehow or we're playing with fire vs teams who milk the clock.

First let me say I have been an orange fan for many years, and love tyler ennis, but I think u nailed it on him there, have been very frustrated w/ pulling ball out when su has #s on d rebounds, never seen this. Is that just his style? Is it coming from jb? I don't know. hoping su beats duke tommorrow

 

[TheCurtain]

Maybe the better question is... Can this fan base cope with another season of stall ball if Ennis returns? Maturity is nice but is he an ideal fit especially being such a liability on D?

 

[TheCusian]

Maybe the better question is... Can this fan base cope with another season of stall ball if Ennis returns? Maturity is nice but is he an ideal fit especially being such a liability on D?

I'd be ecstatic to start 25-1 with National Championship aspirations. So, yeah.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

Maybe the better question is... Can this fan base cope with another season of stall ball if Ennis returns? Maturity is nice but is he an ideal fit especially being such a liability on D?

You're kidding me right? This post is beyond idiotic...

 

[TheCusian]

I knew with our first loss someone would post the "it's time to play man" post. It's a February tradition! I want cake!