Anyone just hear Tom Izzo say he has to play a lot of people to develop a bench

[STEVEHOLT]

On ESPN.
He said his fanbase is upset he has played too many guys early this season.
Izzo says he needs to play everyone to
develop the players and develop a bench.

He was basically saying the non conference is get to better and developing your player.
He said with covid you need your players ready to play in case you lose anyone for 2 weeks.

That’s just dumb ... it’s smarter to play your starters every possible minute in the second half to ensure a win against perennial powerhouse Dez Bryant University

 

[sufandu]

I wonder if JB plays fewer guys early because he knows we'll need the wins to squeek into the tournament. That in itself is a sad statement. When is the last time Mich St. was on the bubble?

 

[DBCooper]

I wonder if JB plays fewer guys early because he knows we'll need the wins to squeek into the tournament. That in itself is a sad statement. When is the last time Mich St. was on the bubble?

Sad statement or not - it is relevant. We missed the tournament not too long ago in a season where we beat three top ten teams specifically because of our poor out of conference record. The main goal of out of conference games is to win them. Developing a bench is secondary.

 

[sufandu]

Sad statement or not - it is relevant. We missed the tournament not too long ago in a season where we beat three top ten teams specifically because of our poor out of conference record. The main goal of out of conference games is to win them. Developing a bench is secondary.

I don't think the main goal of OOC games is to always win them. Mich St has a history of scheduling tough early season OOC games with the confidence that they'll win their fair share and be good enough in a good conference to make the tournament with a high seed. They don't schedule to make the tournament. The schedule to prepare for it.

I'm guessing you're referring to 2017. We may have missed the tournament despite beating 3 top 10 teams, but it's not as simple as saying it was because of our poor OOC record. We were 10-8 in conference and 19-15 overall. We also lost to a GaTech team that had a losing conference record, a 10-8 VaTech, and really bad Pitt and BC teams. That's just not all that good. We can't just point to the good wins and ignore the losses to bad teams. Had we lost to good teams OOC and finished at the top of the conference by beating the bad teams and 1-2 more mediocre teams, maybe finish 14-4, we make the tournament with plenty of room to spare. The poor OOC record hurts when you're a bubble team being compared to other bubble teams. We need to get good enough to avoid the bubble. A program of our history and stature should not be an annual bubble team. That should be a rare down year.

 

[IthacaMatt]

It seems to. He also has 500 wins more than Hamilton. He is 5-1 vs Izzo.

Not to be a dead horse, but the John Wooden UCLA teams - arguably greatest teams ever - used to press all game long and play a deep bench, much like Rick Pitino has done at all of his stops, to great effect. People can win either way, there can be no argument about that.

But what Boeheim is doing these last several years, is going ever shorter with his early season rotations, because our best talent is not elite anymore. This results in injuries almost every season, and has failed to win 20 games for most of the last several years. He feels he has to do this, because so many of these pre-season games are not "automatic" wins anymore, and he has spent too many seasons on the bubble to not realize that losing too many of these early games in the interest of player development might land you in the NIT,

Playing only 6 or 7 guys in most games is not sustainable all season long; that's the point. Even when he had Derrick Coleman and Billy Owens, he still played the rest of the roster until January. It did ensure player development and consistent results from one season to the next when those guys like Coleman and Owens moved on.

And of course shortening the rotation makes for more cohesive play down the stretch of the season and in the post-season. Coach K does it, and who can argue with his NCAA record? But you just can't do it for the whole damn season. The results are right there for everyone to see.

 

[Alsacs]

Not to be a dead horse, but the John Wooden UCLA teams - arguably greatest teams ever - used to press all game long and play a deep bench, much like Rick Pitino has done at all of his stops, to great effect. People can win either way, there can be no argument about that.

But what Boeheim is doing these last several years, isgoing ever shorter with his ** season rotations, because our best talent is not elite anymore. This results in injuries almost every season, and has failed to win 20 games for most of the last several years. He feels he has to do this, because so many of these pre-season games are not "automatic" wins anymore, and he has spent too many seasons on the bubble to not realize that losing too many of these early games in the interest of player development might land you in the NIT,

Playing only 6 or 7 guys in most games is not sustainable all season long; that's the point. Even when he had Derrick Coleman and Billy Owens, he still played the rest of the roster until January. It did ensure player development and consistent results from one season to the next when those guys like Coleman and Owens moved on.

And of course shortening the rotation makes for more cohesive play down the stretch of the season and in the post-season. Coach K does it, and who can argue with his NCAA record? But you just can't do it for the whole damn season. The results are right there for everyone to see.

We are grinding to be mediocre.
It’s one thing to have a short bench when you have elite starters.
Our starters aren’t elite they are solid.
They also wear down and if they are struggling in an individual game can hurt the team.

The short bench in the nonconference doesn’t help the program long term it just is a short sided win now model that isn’t helping.

The short rotations aren’t making us a top 25 NC contender.

 

[NKR1978]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I always felt like JB played guys early, but not once the real games started.

That was back when we beat teams like Bryant by 30 without breaking a sweat.

 

[syrBossHogg]

I hope one of the centers gets some run and can develop. I think Frank can help replace some of Sidibe's rebounding.

 

[OrangeDW]

Somebody better tell Coach Cooley at Providence.

 

[Alsacs]

Somebody better tell Coach Cooley at Providence.

Does Syracuse aspire to be Michigan State or Providence?

 

[OrangeDW]

Does Syracuse aspire to be Michigan State or Providence?

Does Providence aspire to be Michigan State or Syracuse? We do what we do. We don’t gotta try to be nobody.

 

[Alsacs]

Does Providence aspire to be Michigan State or Syracuse? We do what we do. We don’t gotta try to be nobody.

Syracuse is playing a short rotation to be medicore.
Doesn’t that say our recruiting needs to pick up?
I am sorry but Syracuse shouldn’t be stuck with the starting guards we have for the next 2 years playing the bulk of the minutes.
Our program used to be a top of the conference program with great talent we have become Seton Hall or Providence in the old Big East.

It’s just right in front of our eyes. When was the last time we were ranked in January?
The status quo needs to change. It’s not working.

 

[OrangeDW]

Syracuse is playing a short rotation to be medicore.
Doesn’t that say our recruiting needs to pick up?
I am sorry but Syracuse shouldn’t be stuck with the starting guards we have for the next 2 years playing the bulk of the minutes.
Our program used to be a top of the conference program with great talent we have become Seton Hall or Providence in the old Big East.

It’s just right in front of our eyes. When was the last time we were ranked in January?
The status quo needs to change. It’s not working.

You think we’d be better by playing worse players more?

Looks like we got at least 2 kids off the bench who can play this year though so that’s a step in the right direction. We’re getting there. This is our best team since 15-16 at minimum, IMO.

 

[Alsacs]

You think we’d be better by playing worse players more?

Looks like we got at least 2 kids off the bench who can play this year though so that’s a step in the right direction. We’re getting there. This is our best team since 15-16 at minimum, IMO.

The fact we only have 1 guard on the bench is a problem.
How are so thin every year.

Richmond couldn’t even get off the bench. Our potenial is so low when we have to grind with our starters who aren’t elite every game.

I don’t care if we have a losing season if the future is better.
This year’s team isn’t winning the NC.
This program needs talent if we are going to play 7.

 

[OrangeDW]

The fact we only have 1 guard on the bench is a problem.
How are so thin every year.

Richmond couldn’t even get off the bench. Our potenial is so low when we have to grind with our starters who aren’t elite every game.

I don’t care if we have a losing season if the future is better.
This year’s team isn’t winning the NC.
This program needs talent if we are going to play 7.

With Sidibe we’ve got a nice 7. Richmond will play.

 

[djcon57]

You think we’d be better by playing worse players more?

i think we would be better by playing good players less. Again, there’s a reason why load management is a thing in the NBA these days.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Agree with Izzo, but he also played his lottery pick 18 minutes in their tourney loss to us.

That was incredible

 

[bpo57]

It seems to. He also has 500 wins more than Hamilton. He is 5-1 vs Izzo.

Granted but that one was painful.

 

[NineOneSeven]

With Sidibe we’ve got a nice 7. Richmond will play.

4+ Weeks without him.

I’ll say it again, start a center every game. Change it up game to game if we need to.

 

[OrangeDW]

i think we would be better by playing good players less. Again, there’s a reason why load management is a thing in the NBA these days.

Longer games, 4 times as many regular season games, more travel, etc.

7-8 man rotation is ideal in close games, IMO. I think we’ve got 7-8 who can actually play this year. Some of these recent years, our bench guys all stunk.

 

[Alsacs]

With Sidibe we’ve got a nice 7. Richmond will play.

This year’s “7” aren’t good enough to be a reason to play “7”.

We are replacing Hughes with Griffin.
We are replacing Goodine with Richmond.

How much better does that make us from last year?

 

[OrangeDW]

4+ Weeks without him.

I’ll say it again, start a center every game. Change it up game to game if we need to.

Im with you for the most part. If it’s a small team with 4 guards out there that is zoning us, then I’m good with lots of Marek at the 5.

But otherwise, yeah we’ll need at least one of the centers in the rotation. Maybe 2, depending on how they’re playing.

Intrigued to see Edwards. Liked him last year even if he wasn’t really ready yet. Hoping he’s made a jump.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

i think we would be better by playing good players less. Again, there’s a reason why load management is a thing in the NBA these days.

Because an 82 game regular season followed by potentially 28 playoff games is the same thing as playing a max of 40 college games?

 

[OrangeDW]

This year’s “7” aren’t good enough to be a reason to play “7”.

We are replacing Hughes with Griffin.
We are replacing Goodine with Richmond.

How much better does that make us from last year?

A lot, IMO because the other guys should all be better. 8th should be whatever center is best, and should get more/less time from game to game depending on matchup/foul trouble.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Im with you for the most part. If it’s a small team with 4 guards out there that is zoning us, then I’m good with lots of Marek at the 5.

But otherwise, yeah we’ll need at least one of the centers in the rotation. Maybe 2, depending on how they’re playing.

Intrigued to see Edwards. Liked him last year even if he wasn’t really ready yet. Hoping he’s made a jump.

Well most likely against some of these out of conference teams, they’ll be playing more guard sized players. Again I’m fine playing marek 35 at center if that’s what wins the game but I strongly think we start one of the 3 bigs every game. Give them a few early possessions. What’s the worst that happens, we give up a 3 or an and 1 inside (like last game?)?