Bring on the Dazzler | Page 7 | Syracusefan.com

Bring on the Dazzler

Acesn8s said:
Just honestly curious when you are paying a coach millions of dollars a year to win football games, what do you want the athletic director to base job performance on? We don’t have to Alabama or Ohio State but can we be a middle of the road ACC team for god sakes. He isn’t doing anything spectacular on or off the field to justify his salary. I really hope I eat my words but I don’t see 2 more wins on the schedule and especially not 3.
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You’re paying a guy to build a program that can win consistently His first three years it appeared that was happening, no? 2019 was a duck and he should own that. 2020 was weird as hell and I’m not sure how to decipher any of the results fairly.

2021 - his seat was/is warm and rightly so. So far, I’m amped with where we’re headed. Good D, great RB, great running game, young and exciting QB.

If you look at just winning %, you can just decide he’s not building a program that can win consistently. But it won’t have context. And the next guy might run into the same stuff. It also erases all of the moves post 2018 that seem to be yielding fruit in 2021.
 
Crusty said:
I really don't think that is in concert with big time college football. W-L record is the first measure of success and without it the rest is just rationalization. Nuance means a subtle difference. Dino's record is not nuanced - it is an antonym for nuance.

Taking care of players and not putting a stink on the univeristy and winning are not mutually exclusive.
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I think you have to ask do you want to be like some of the “big time” programs? FSU is a poster child for all the “big time” headaches that come from booster meddling, hiring and firing too quickly, etc.

I do agree W-L record is the first measure - I just think the context around the record matters a great deal. Did the star QB get hurt? Did you play an unusually difficult schedule? Did you play an unusually easy schedule? We’re we (the athletic dept) providing the support necessary to win in the ACC?

I’d also look at things like “was 2016 a success” in a broader context, for example (installed system, beat ranked team, learned about ED, Ish, etc)

As mentioned earlier in the thread, HCs in the ACC who has won 10 games and beaten a top 2 team is like 2 coaches (maybe 3) long. Clawson has been steadier without the lows and highs - and maybe we want/orefer
 
TheCusian said:
I think you have to ask do you want to be like some of the “big time” programs? FSU is a poster child for all the “big time” headaches that come from booster meddling, hiring and firing too quickly, etc.

I do agree W-L record is the first measure - I just think the context around the record matters a great deal. Did the star QB get hurt? Did you play an unusually difficult schedule? Did you play an unusually easy schedule? We’re we (the athletic dept) providing the support necessary to win in the ACC?

I’d also look at things like “was 2016 a success” in a broader context, for example (installed system, beat ranked team, learned about ED, Ish, etc)

As mentioned earlier in the thread, HCs in the ACC who has won 10 games and beaten a top 2 team is like 2 coaches (maybe 3) long. Clawson has been steadier without the lows and highs - and maybe we want/orefer
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Also, if you've been a sh%tty program for ever like us, you don't do yourself any favors by turning the HC spot into a revolving door. No one decent who understands the challenges of this job will come here if they think they're getting 4 years max. Dino might not be the guy but how we treat him will matter to the next coach.
 
supp said:
Also, if you've been a sh%tty program forever like us, you don't do yourself any favors by turning the HC spot into a revolving door. No one decent who understands the challenges of this job will come here if they think they're getting 4 years max. Dino might not be the guy but how we treat him will matter to the next coach.
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That’s exactly why 2020 gets an asterisk. I’m confident HC and high level candidates would want to be treated that way.
 
721Comstock said:
Yeah, those $125 checks really add up. :rolleyes:
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I don’t know him personally but, If you only pay $125 a season after tickets parking memorabilia, food, booze, hotels travel well good on you, I figure with every dollar I spend that’s tied to Syracuse football each year easily covers 10 grand give or take on a given year since 1997. And I know people who spend much much more, and they want to see Dino in a bowl game or fired so your eye roll mehhh
 
Acesn8s said:
I don’t know him personally but, If you only pay $125 a season after tickets parking memorabilia, food, booze, hotels travel well good on you, I figure with every dollar I spend that’s tied to Syracuse football each year easily covers 10 grand give or take on a given year since 1997. And I know people who spend much much more, and they want to see Dino in a bowl game or fired so your eye roll mehhh
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40 years of this for me
 
TheCusian said:
You’re paying a guy to build a program that can win consistently His first three years it appeared that was happening, no? 2019 was a duck and he should own that. 2020 was weird as hell and I’m not sure how to decipher any of the results fairly.

2021 - his seat was/is warm and rightly so. So far, I’m amped with where we’re headed. Good D, great RB, great running game, young and exciting QB.

If you look at just winning %, you can just decide he’s not building a program that can win consistently. But it won’t have context. And the next guy might run into the same stuff. It also erases all of the moves post 2018 that seem to be yielding fruit in 2021.
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My biggest problem with that take is this, take his 27 wins and look who he has beaten constantly the worst of the worst. He has 3 really good wins IMO other then that he by any measure has failed. He wins 3 games the rest of the year I say keep him, 2 I won’t like it but it if they keep him it is what it is, less then that you have to fire him the day the season ends.
 
Dazzler wouldn‘t even make my initial list on a coach to hire. He’s mediocre to the core and is too old school. I want Dino to succeed, but if he doesn’t you better find a great up and coming coach who can flat out recruit. We all thought Scott Frost was going to be that guy and he’s struggling at Nebraska and continues to lose close games. There is no perfect solution. You have to decide if you think we can continue to get better or change coaches with a chance that he might be worse than what we have. A new five year plan is not something I will sign up for again.
 
OburgOrange said:
40 years of this for me
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Like x’s 1000, listen I spend the money because I want to, hell I’m going to call tech in two weeks even given my feelings toward Dino as of now but I don’t care what anybody spends if it’s $150 a season or 50 grand a season when the dome is half empty most of the time every penny counts, winning gets people in the stands that’s it.
 
Acesn8s said:
Like x’s 1000, listen I spend the money because I want to, hell I’m going to call tech in two weeks even given my feelings toward Dino as of now but I don’t care what anybody spends if it’s $150 a season or 50 grand a season when the dome is half empty most of the time every penny counts, winning gets people in the stands that’s it.
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Va tech
 
Acesn8s said:
My biggest problem with that take is this, take his 27 wins and look who he has beaten constantly the worst of the worst. He has 3 really good wins IMO other then that he by any measure has failed. He wins 3 games the rest of the year I say keep him, 2 I won’t like it but it if they keep him it is what it is, less then that you have to fire him the day the season ends.
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I don’t think that’s unfair and does provide better context. I don’t think “any other measure he’s failed” is correct.

- No major scandals
- We’re getting non-punters drafted again
- We’ve been really competitive 2 out of the last 4 years (at Clemson in 2018, Wake and Liberty this year, etc)
- I’ve seen enough this year to believe he could build a program without the Baylor system
- made good hires (even after making a mistake or two - maybe this evens out?)
 
supp said:
Also, if you've been a sh%tty program for ever like us, you don't do yourself any favors by turning the HC spot into a revolving door. No one decent who understands the challenges of this job will come here if they think they're getting 4 years max. Dino might not be the guy but how we treat him will matter to the next coach.
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I think we have treated Dino exceptionally well.
 
cusefan88 said:
Addazio is just as bad a decision maker as Dino. If they go in a different direction I would prefer Sean Lewis or Joe Moorhead.
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As bad? He got to bowl games 6 years out of 7. I'd say that is better. Addazio was not a good clock manager. Overall, he was a better decision maker. Not a bad FB coach. He needs help with good OC pass game type. His strength is running the ball...very good RB's, very good O Line.

Part of his clock management problems were more he did not have any strong passing game. If you have 2 minutes left and opponent has timeouts and you try to run ball...well, the D will always stack the box. Then if you really can't throw well and get incompletes at end to stop clock, that does not usually end well.
 
TheCusian said:
You’re paying a guy to build a program that can win consistently His first three years it appeared that was happening, no? 2019 was a duck and he should own that. 2020 was weird as hell and I’m not sure how to decipher any of the results fairly.

2021 - his seat was/is warm and rightly so. So far, I’m amped with where we’re headed. Good D, great RB, great running game, young and exciting QB.

If you look at just winning %, you can just decide he’s not building a program that can win consistently. But it won’t have context. And the next guy might run into the same stuff. It also erases all of the moves post 2018 that seem to be yielding fruit in 2021.
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In college FB, your record is the context. Wins or losses are all the context you need. He better win. Anything less than 3 wins in ACC is failure.
 
Evan Miller said:
In college FB, your record is the context. Wins or losses are all the context you need. He better win. Anything less than 3 wins in ACC is failure.
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This year, maybe. But if they lose all their ACC games on the last play of the game, a) that would be weird as hell and b) that’s proof the things are better than 2019-2020 and prob enough.

(Context is always important, IMO. Best HC in the MAC is no Saban for the most blatant example)
 
TheCusian said:
This year, maybe. But if they lose all their ACC games on the last play of the game, a) that would be weird as hell and b) that’s proof the things are better than 2019-2020 and prob enough.

(Context is always important, IMO. Best HC in the MAC is no Saban for the most blatant example)
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If you lose all games at end...this is not progress. It usually indicates a coaching problem. Poor decision making, poor clock management, poor play calling, poor in game adjustments.

This is college FB. Not horseshoes. Coming close does not matter. I would not like to go 0-8 in ACC and in my year end performance review argue how close we came to winning some games. I doubt that argument would be very well received by most AD's.
 
Evan Miller said:
If you lose all games at end...this is not progress. It usually indicates a coaching problem. Poor decision making, poor clock management, poor play calling, poor in game adjustments.

This is college FB. Not horseshoes. Coming close does not matter. I would not like to go 0-8 in ACC and in my year end performance review argue how close we came to winning some games. I doubt that argument would be very well received by most AD's.
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Lol. Coming close does matter. If you do a lot of stuff well, but just fall short - thats better than losing by 40 when you don’t do anything well.

Some AD’s don’t think this black and white. Crazy boosters do, fans do - people who understand the sport, they see progress and understand how hard it is to even be close enough to lose by 3 in OT
 
TheCusian said:
Meathead .500 HC formerly of BC
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Gotcha. Well he’s a Northeast guy and coached under Urban Meyer so he definitely has an impressive resume. I could see him taking it, it would be a step up from Colorado State.
 
supp said:
Yeah, I'm thinking this is Dino's 1986. Not sure if next year will be 1987 but it's lining up for something big. We'll see if he's up to the challenge. If not, THEN you think about who's next.
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We thought the same thing coming into Tommy's first year as starter. We had a ton of starters coming back on that team.
 
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