Clemson Postgame | Page 10 | Syracusefan.com

Clemson Postgame

But what about how great Red did getting 20 wins with a cast of outfits last year???

Come on guys. For those who threw that in the face of those who were a bit skeptical with Red, what do you say now exactly?

Talk about a narrative that just grew on this board out of peoples a---

20 wins nowadays is comparable to an NFL running back hitting the 1000 yard mark in a 17 game season, nowhere near the feat it once was. Moreover, which many here ignore, one of those 20 wins last season came against an inferior D2 opponent...but yea! :rolleyes:
 
Why?

That makes no sense. If Straughn is the new GM / POBO type, let him hire his own HC. If he thinks Straughn is key, keep him on board.

We need to get out of this outdated thinking. If Kline is good, keep him and he hires his own guy. If he isn't, he's gone too.

Part of Kline's job should absolutely be to have a list of HCs he has in mind if Red doesn't work out.
I don't think you understand the role of a general manager in college sports. They are hired by and work for the head coach. They are at a level below the Director of Basketball Operations and all Assistant Coaches. They are honestly a glorified Recruiting Coordinator tasked with figuring out the NIL landscape. Very different than a professional sport general manager.
 
NET is not all about margin. And no, teams don't do that.
I mean I understand the official NCAA position is NET doesn't use margin, but isn't the efficiency measurement the difference of points for v points against? Maybe I'm wrong, but I think of that as basically being margin. Hasn't the talk been the last couple years that the Big 12 had good NET because they blew out bad teams, and Syracuse's NET last year was awful in the non-con because we didn't blow teams out, and we got blown out by good teams? It factors in other things of course too, but seems to me margin has a big effect.
 
I don't think you understand the role of a general manager in college sports. They are hired by and work for the head coach. They are at a level below the Director of Basketball Operations and all Assistant Coaches. They are honestly a glorified Recruiting Coordinator tasked with figuring out the NIL landscape. Very different than a professional sport general manager.

You think Alex Kline stopped working for the Knicks to just do the bidding for a dead man walking head coach (whether its this year or next)?

You think that that paradigm can't shift?

Again, just because something was done one way, doesn't mean it has to stay that way.

You think a guy with Kline's kind of drive is cool just being an errand boy?

I don't. And if he is, get rid of him, too.
 
I don't think you understand the role of a general manager in college sports. They are hired by and work for the head coach. They are at a level below the Director of Basketball Operations and all Assistant Coaches. They are honestly a glorified Recruiting Coordinator tasked with figuring out the NIL landscape. Very different than a professional sport general manager.
For now. Check out what Stanford is doing with Andrew Luck. I also trust Klines basketball acumen better than anyone else in the AD.
 
You think Alex Kline stopped working for the Knicks to just do the bidding for a dead man walking head coach (whether its this year or next)?

You think that that paradigm can't shift?

Again, just because something was done one way, doesn't mean it has to stay that way.

You think a guy with Kline's kind of drive is cool just being an errand boy?

I don't. And if he is, get rid of him, too.
Would he leave a scouts job in the NBA to take a newly developed position in an ACC program with potential for further growth? Absolutely. More money, more responsibility, more authority. You act like he moved from an Asst GM in the NBA, he didn't. A person with the responsibility you think the GM has is about 7 steps higher on the org chart.
 
I'm really glad to see my response had an impact on your thinking.

I imagine your post here is sarcasm. Otherwise, there's really not much to say relative to anyone who commences a conversation, post, etc. with "just an absolute clown post" and expect one to be influenced/persuaded by the author of such.
 
I don't know any of these people but I see no signs of anything resembling analytics watching the dumbest shots over and over and over
The guy I am referring to got here in August. I don’t disagree we don’t run any modern offense and we are stuck in the ISO stone ages.
 
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I don't think you understand the role of a general manager in college sports. They are hired by and work for the head coach. They are at a level below the Director of Basketball Operations and all Assistant Coaches. They are honestly a glorified Recruiting Coordinator tasked with figuring out the NIL landscape. Very different than a professional sport general manager.
But at Stanford, the whole football leadership (coaching) works for Andrew Luck, right?
(I know basketball - and even each school - is different)


and it's described here how Stanford made it different:

 
I mean I understand the official NCAA position is NET doesn't use margin, but isn't the efficiency measurement the difference of points for v points against? Maybe I'm wrong, but I think of that as basically being margin. Hasn't the talk been the last couple years that the Big 12 had good NET because they blew out bad teams, and Syracuse's NET last year was awful in the non-con because we didn't blow teams out, and we got blown out by good teams? It factors in other things of course too, but seems to me margin has a big effect.
It can have an effect, but it's more about how teams perform against each other on a per possession basis relative to the league. Basically, if every opponent against Clemson loses by a couple of baskets, but those opponents blow out other teams, then it's probably that Clemson is a good team and would blow out their opponents' opponents. The biggest thing with NET is how teams relate to each other more than MOV. It normalizes a lot of noise that happens by playing the games. There are always those games where a team just has a good night or an awful one (like SU vs DePaul)

If MOV was so important, Clemson would have kept scoring to the bitter end - they didn't. Because a better ranking would mean more for them than Moore hucking up a three. Plus, in reality, it doesn't move that much game to game. The efficiency rankings move slower than game to game because they try to minimize the weird outlier games.
 
Louisville makes the move to bring in a PROVEN head coach and they immediately turned it around in one damn year to the point they’re ranked, second in the league and talking about what seed they’re going to get. Why the hell can’t Wildhack see all of this and make a damn move. My apathy has turned back into anger at the thought of putting up with this pathetic bs for another year when we have examples of places like Louisville and how quickly they fixed their program.

We shoulda hired Pitino as a transition HC- someone who'd re-lay the foundation JB built and THEN hand it off to someone else. He was tanned, rested, and ready till St Johns picked him up.
But of course, the amen choir in the fan base started cluck-clucking, catching vapors because such a vile character was beneath the stature of our beloved bball program & institution.
Yeah...right. JMHO
 
We shoulda hired Pitino as a transition HC- someone who'd re-lay the foundation JB built and THEN hand it off to someone else. He was tanned, rested, and ready till St Johns picked him up.
But of course, the amen choir in the fan base started cluck-clucking, catching vapors because such a vile character was beneath the stature of our beloved bball program & institution.
Yeah...right. JMHO
Well he wasnt tanned and rested, he was working at Iona but yes , there was an amen choir which I dont understand since SU is not a religious school but they try to project this stuffy wine and cheese, Ivy league, east coast elitist school which isnt doing them any favors.
 
Well he wasnt tanned and rested, he was working at Iona but yes , there was an amen choir which I dont understand since SU is not a religious school but they try to project this stuffy wine and cheese, Ivy league, east coast elitist school which isnt doing them any favors.
rick pitino was too old and too expensive IMo. but i do imagine he would have filled some seats here .
his brand does seem to be better suited to larger venues. a short term lease could have made sense.
 
so i guess "class" is something that those without it aren't classy enuf to realize they ain't got any .
 
... Someone has to explain to me why Majstorovic gets so much playing time. No points. 1 shot. 3 rebounds. No assists. A

I didn't see any of the game, but saw that stat line. Why 21 minutes for 0 points, 3 rebounds, 3 turnovers. Only 2 fouls for a change. He tries hard, but really is a non factor offensively and defensively. Why so much playing time is a really good question.
 
rick pitino was too old and too expensive IMo. but i do imagine he would have filled some seats here .
his brand does seem to be better suited to larger venues. a short term lease could have made sense.
He is old but he hasn't forgotten how to coach.. just watch St John's, their movement on offense and watch their d. If you don't hustle for pitino ur backside is on the bench the next dead ball same with missing a box out.. I'd love to see cuse play like pitino has the Johnnie's playing!!
 
rick pitino was too old and too expensive IMo. but i do imagine he would have filled some seats here .
his brand does seem to be better suited to larger venues. a short term lease could have made sense.
agreed, I think his success at SJU just rubs salt in the wound for SU's decision to go internal when they needed to go external.

Uconn was about to go on their first title run, SJU hires Pitino, Gtwon poached Cooley. Some old regional rivals were ascending and others made investments and upgrades, while SU blinked and thought playing it safe was best. BOT didnt take into consideration the landscape in CBB around them and thought we were still in 2012 and the assistant they promoted was in demand outside of SU (Red wasnt, unlike Hopkins, who was in demand). Through 51 games, I think it has backfired.
 
Well he wasnt tanned and rested, he was working at Iona but yes , there was an amen choir which I dont understand since SU is not a religious school but they try to project this stuffy wine and cheese, Ivy league, east coast elitist school which isnt doing them any favors.
Not weighing in on whether or not Pitino was the right move for us, but the notion that morality and ethics are exclusive to the “religious” is ridiculous.
 
I really don't understand how people can keep getting angry over and over again? Anybody that has watched this team this year knows who they are and what they are capable of. Beating Clemson last night shouldn't have been expected by anyone and losing shouldn't be a cause to get angry all over again. So unexpected that they actually covered the spread despite never being in the game after my wife got home (20-19 went to 36-23 by the time she stopped talking, didn't appreciate me pointing it out).
Disappointed? Absolutely. Further disappointed because my disappointments used to come after losing to top 10 teams. But I can't get angry unless they lose to teams like BC, Miami or Virginia. We're not good and are not going to be good. Red's not going anywhere, he'll get at least a year with White and Anthony and nothing short of going winless the rest of the season will likely change that.
Yeah, there are games to be angry about but last night was simply par for the course. I think that's the problem though.
 
Dino was fired mid season for less. Dino inherited a 3 win program and left Fran a 6 win program. It was stuck in neutral and I supported his termination; but Red has not earned anything. He was handed the job because he was "next."

Firing him might excite the fan base a little at least. Give us some hope.

2 years is a short leash and shouldn't happen unless the dumpster is on fire.

It was on fire for Louisville and Payne, but you still want to make the move end of season if you are 2 years in.

I see very little hope in how Red is coaching the team this year and how the team is performing. The dumpster is smoking. It may be engulfed in flames after the next run of games. The blowouts against middle-pack or better teams is really bad.

Plus that one Louisville fan that posted that we need to do the conference a favor and fire our "Kenny Payne" and the follow-up posts he made where he basically said how we were playing, what we weren't doing, what we appeared to lack from coaching... it was all red flags they know well from Kenny Payne.

Honestly, that has stuck with me. They have seen these signals before and know from recent, first-hand experience.
 
There is simply no way all the players on this team are individually as bad as they look collectively. If the school wants to field a team that plays basketball, it needs to hire a new coach because the current coach and ataff continue to demonstrate they have no idea what they are doing. When Louisville had Payne, I kept wondering how can they be that bad. Now I know, and it is simply an embarrassment.

Rant over.
 
I don't think you understand the role of a general manager in college sports. They are hired by and work for the head coach. They are at a level below the Director of Basketball Operations and all Assistant Coaches. They are honestly a glorified Recruiting Coordinator tasked with figuring out the NIL landscape. Very different than a professional sport general manager.

Maybe not. Maybe he was hired directly by the AD.
 
I didn't see any of the game, but saw that stat line. Why 21 minutes for 0 points, 3 rebounds, 3 turnovers. Only 2 fouls for a change. He tries hard, but really is a non factor offensively and defensively. Why so much playing time is a really good question.

Petar is our 3rd best defender out of 10 guys, according to his DBPR rating. He's our 2nd highest rated player in +/- and he is our 2nd highest rated player in Adjusted Team Efficiency Margin.

The advanced stats indicate that he is doing the kind of little things that help us win. Y'know, a glue guy.
 

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