Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion

[KellySyracuse]

This Moonbeam deal has me thinking that McMahon and the county may have already identified a buyer for that parcel. Why else would they agree to it?

 

[shandeezy7]

This Moonbeam deal has me thinking that McMahon and the county may have already identified a buyer for that parcel. Why else would they agree to it?

Man I hope so. Seems like a lot of risk to take on if they haven't.

 

[maxxyz]

On the surface the deal is hilarious. The county is owed 10 mil in back taxes, but will pay moonbeam 3.5 mil. The county will then do the work to sell it and share the proceeds with moonbeam.

Seems like quite a risk to be taking at a time with potential decreases in available funds for the county and town. The county getting a say in the selected awardee could work out, but honestly given the other development in the area what do they expect to happen with this property.

I truly wonder why in the world he did this. Shoppingtown as a commercial property has almost no value as it is not designed in a way that works in contemporary business models. The only value is the land, and it will cost $10M to demo the site to build something useful.

McMahon must have some deal cooked up. Can we vote him out as well?

 

[PartTimeFan]

I truly wonder why in the world he did this. Shoppingtown as a commercial property has almost no value as it is not designed in a way that works in contemporary business models. The only value is the land, and it will cost $10M to demo the site to build something useful.

McMahon must have some deal cooked up. Can we vote him out as well?

New stadium!

 

[KellySyracuse]

that's a lot of acreage in a prime spot, close to 481. The Fayetteville/Dewitt/Manlius residents will throw a nutty for anything that increases traffic in that area

 

[KellySyracuse]

Also want to mention, anyone in the North Syracuse area the local VFW is putting together a holiday basket for a local resident family in need, gift cards, new toys/clothing etc. If you're interested PM me and I will forward you the info of the person putting it together.

I'm not on facebook but if you are you can see their page here:

VFW 7290

VFW 7290, North Syracuse, New York. 448 likes · 18 talking about this · 901 were here. VFW #7290, 105 Maxwell Ave, North Syracuse, New York 13212

www.facebook.com

 

[OttoMets]

that's a lot of acreage in a prime spot, close to 481. The Fayetteville/Dewitt/Manlius residents will throw a nutty for anything that increases traffic in that area

I think NIMBYism will be a big concern. But that is a prime parcel. If I were a developer, that'd be one of my most coveted spots in the county. It's been upzoned, if only a little; there's a ton of land with varied but buildable topography; and it's got direct sight-lines to what will be I-81 in a few years.

The previous landlord screwed the pooch by letting Macy's, Dick's, and some other big retailers (and Regal?) slip away, but there's room for a decent retail development, a hotel, and a couple types of housing there. Damn shame the shortsighted library people packed up and moved.

 

[KellySyracuse]

I think NIMBYism will be a big concern. But that is a prime parcel. If I were a developer, that'd be one of my most coveted spots in the county. It's been upzoned, if only a little; there's a ton of land with varied but buildable topography; and it's got direct sight-lines to what will be I-81 in a few years.

The previous landlord screwed the pooch by letting Macy's, Dick's, and some other big retailers (and Regal?) slip away, but there's room for a decent retail development, a hotel, and a couple types of housing there. Damn shame the shortsighted library people packed up and moved.

right and the more I think about it the county has something lined up and Moonbeam was more than happy to get out of it with cash in hand.

 

[OttoMets]

right and the more I think about it the county has something lined up and Moonbeam was more than happy to get out of it with cash in hand.

I am awfully skeptical, given the current climate. I just think the county wanted them out and finally reached a mutually-agreeable number. But it'll be interesting to see it shake out, though. (Very glad it's not my problem to solve.)

 

[KellySyracuse]

I am awfully skeptical, given the current climate. I just think the county wanted them out and finally reached a mutually-agreeable number. But it'll be interesting to see it shake out, though. (Very glad it's not my problem to solve.)

My guess is that it's not going to be retail or any type of development that relies on in person shopping/dining. I'd bet it's another distribution center site for a different ecommerce corp. Amazon has the site in Liverpool so they wouldn't need it. Maybe Alibaba? Although Amazon is now selling pharmaceuticals, and not the over the counter stuff.

 

[OttoMets]

My guess is that it's not going to be retail or any type of development that relies on in person shopping/dining. I'd bet it's another distribution center site for a different ecommerce corp. Amazon has the site in Liverpool so they wouldn't need it. Maybe Alibaba? Although Amazon is now selling pharmaceuticals, and not the over the counter stuff.

I think the folks in the neighborhood immediately southeast would go through the roof over a light industrial proposal (I'm not even sure if the new zoning permits it). Granted, they'd probably go through the roof over any proposal up to and including a Whole Foods, but I do think a distribution center would probably be a non-starter. And keep in mind that Benderson bought the former Macy's building, so they'll have some say in ensuring any development is compatible with their future plans for the property.

It's true that we're over-retailed in a time where we're shedding a lot of brick and mortar retail. And some major players have put big bets on distribution centers in traditional mall settings. But I can't help but think that our goofy retail pendulum will likely swing back from this weird plaza fad right around the time a) Shoppingtown redevelopment plans get permitted and financed, and b) all those ex-Shoppingtown tenants on the boulevard come off their initial lease terms and are ready for a developer to finance new and exciting spaces for them. Throw in a theatre operator, a mid-sized hotel, a grocery store, a senior living facility, and some detached housing and there's your new downtown DeWitt.

 

[KellySyracuse]

I think the folks in the neighborhood immediately southeast would go through the roof over a light industrial proposal (I'm not even sure if the new zoning permits it). Granted, they'd probably go through the roof over any proposal up to and including a Whole Foods, but I do think a distribution center would probably be a non-starter. And keep in mind that Benderson bought the former Macy's building, so they'll have some say in ensuring any development is compatible with their future plans for the property.

It's true that we're over-retailed in a time where we're shedding a lot of brick and mortar retail. And some major players have put big bets on distribution centers in traditional mall settings. But I can't help but think that our goofy retail pendulum will likely swing back from this weird plaza fad right around the time a) Shoppingtown redevelopment plans get permitted and financed, and b) all those ex-Shoppingtown tenants on the boulevard come off their initial lease terms and are ready for a developer to finance new and exciting spaces for them. Throw in a theatre operator, a mid-sized hotel, a grocery store, a senior living facility, and some detached housing and there's your new downtown DeWitt.

so from your post I can see it being built as a mini city center. Senior living center that gives them the ability to live in their space without having to drive anywhere for entertainment, food, retail. That actually sounds like a great idea.

 

[OttoMets]

so from your post I can see it being built as a mini city center. Senior living center that gives them the ability to live in their space without having to drive anywhere for entertainment, food, retail. That actually sounds like a great idea.

It's what I would do...which means it's destined to go very differently. But something like that would be huge for DeWitt.

 

[shandeezy7]

I think the folks in the neighborhood immediately southeast would go through the roof over a light industrial proposal (I'm not even sure if the new zoning permits it). Granted, they'd probably go through the roof over any proposal up to and including a Whole Foods, but I do think a distribution center would probably be a non-starter. And keep in mind that Benderson bought the former Macy's building, so they'll have some say in ensuring any development is compatible with their future plans for the property.

It's true that we're over-retailed in a time where we're shedding a lot of brick and mortar retail. And some major players have put big bets on distribution centers in traditional mall settings. But I can't help but think that our goofy retail pendulum will likely swing back from this weird plaza fad right around the time a) Shoppingtown redevelopment plans get permitted and financed, and b) all those ex-Shoppingtown tenants on the boulevard come off their initial lease terms and are ready for a developer to finance new and exciting spaces for them. Throw in a theatre operator, a mid-sized hotel, a grocery store, a senior living facility, and some detached housing and there's your new downtown DeWitt.

Yeah there's no way it will be a distribution center. The neighborhood/town would never allow that, and it wouldn't be a good use of that space anyway. It's almost certainly going to be some type of "lifestyle center"/mixed use development, possibly with a new-to-this-area major retailer (like Ikea).

 

[KellySyracuse]

Yeah there's no way it will be a distribution center. The neighborhood/town would never allow that, and it wouldn't be a good use of that space anyway. It's almost certainly going to be some type of "lifestyle center"/mixed use development, possibly with a new-to-this-area major retailer (like Ikea).

I don't know about Ikea though, the traffic draw for them would be enormous from all directions. While I think it's great, Uncle Burt living on Lindon Drive would lose his mind.

 

[shandeezy7]

I don't know about Ikea though, the traffic draw for them would be enormous from all directions. While I think it's great, Uncle Burt living on Lindon Drive would lose his mind.

Yeah the NIMBY's are gonna NIMBY, but it's been a major shopping center for literally decades.

 

[Cheriehoop]

I think NIMBYism will be a big concern. But that is a prime parcel. If I were a developer, that'd be one of my most coveted spots in the county. It's been upzoned, if only a little; there's a ton of land with varied but buildable topography; and it's got direct sight-lines to what will be I-81 in a few years.

The previous landlord screwed the pooch by letting Macy's, Dick's, and some other big retailers (and Regal?) slip away, but there's room for a decent retail development, a hotel, and a couple types of housing there. Damn shame the shortsighted library people packed up and moved.

Right down on the same side of Erie Blvd and only about a block or 2 west of the Shoppingtown property there is a relatively new huge strip mall that is bursting at the seams that is a parking lot and traffic nightmare. Makes me wonder what the lease $ were at Shoppingtown that made this gigantic squished in strip mall choose that location.

 

[SWC75]

Flashback: Looking back to the opening of Shoppingtown Mall

ShoppingTown Mall, the first CNY suburban shopping center, opened in March 1954.

www.syracuse.com

 

[KellySyracuse]

Right down on the same side of Erie Blvd and only about a block or 2 west of the Shoppingtown property there is a relatively new huge strip mall that is bursting at the seams that is a parking lot and traffic nightmare. Makes me wonder what the lease $ were at Shoppingtown that made this gigantic squished in strip mall choose that location.

And yet Kmart couldn't make it there either which makes me think it's more about where people want to actually go. Shoppingtown would be a great place to have a Top Golf

 

[Cheriehoop]

And yet Kmart couldn't make it there either which makes me think it's more about where people want to actually go. Shoppingtown would be a great place to have a Top Golf

In our climate, the return of strip malls is confusing to me. It’s a return to the ’50’s again when strip malls or downtown were the only options. Why would someone prefer to drive to separate shops or walk outside to multiple stores in a strip mall? I can understand maybe in other climate areas but in the northeast?

 

[KellySyracuse]

In our climate, the return of strip malls is confusing to me. It’s a return to the ’50’s again when strip malls or downtown were the only options. Why would someone prefer to drive to separate shops or walk outside to multiple stores in a strip mall? I can understand maybe in other climate areas but in the northeast?

right, I really do think it's about where people perceive they want to go. JC Penney and Sears are for old people, Target and Old Navy are the new Kmart and Grants.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

And yet Kmart couldn't make it there either which makes me think it's more about where people want to actually go. Shoppingtown would be a great place to have a Top Golf

Kmart couldn't make it anywhere.

 

[721Comstock]

Kmart sucks.

FIFY.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

FIFY.

15 minutes to Wapner.

 

[maxxyz]

In our climate, the return of strip malls is confusing to me. It’s a return to the ’50’s again when strip malls or downtown were the only options. Why would someone prefer to drive to separate shops or walk outside to multiple stores in a strip mall? I can understand maybe in other climate areas but in the northeast?

It costs lots of money to have all the indoor space of the hallways, and that cost is paid for by the tenants. Over the last two decades the retail stores decided that they couldn’t afford that cost and compete against online outlets.

It also eliminates having to police those hallways, and has simplified loss prevention.