Diagne

[FrancoPizza]

And I should add, we would have been better off if they checked Melo's transcript more closely.

We'd be better off in the present, probably, yes. But Melo does not tarnish my memory of that regular season. The greatest regular season ever, I might add. We either should have sat his ass on the bench with the first signs of trouble or played him all the way through. In hindsight we should have rode that hand all the way to a title bout with Kentucky, and maybe we win the whole thing. What was the NCAA going to do? Ban us for 2 years? We wouldn't have made the tourney last year, and we may not make it this year either. Strip us of a 2012 title? Who the cares - let the NCAA declare whatever they want post-mortem, that doesn't erase happy memories.

 

[AZOrange]

Yes.

where was this confirmed. Never saw that

 

[Full_Rebar]

I keep bringing this and I apologize. But if the NCAA takes the time to look into Diagne's academic record in Senegal, why wouldn't SU take the time to do the same?

I bet you they do going forward with athletes in similar situations.

How do we know they didn't look? In some situations, I don't think the school can accurately predict what the NCAA will determine unless the courses/school is already in the NCAA database.

There is a reason why a lot of top hoops guys end up at the same HS/Preps and it's not all about the coaching or national tv exposure. Those schools have a track record of knowing what meets the core requirements, so there isn't as much guesswork.

 

[Briancuse]

the Ncaa

 

[Brooky03]

How did the NCAA *** up this kid? Every college athlete has to take a core set of college prep courses for initial eligibility. Not every kid makes it. This is like the Blair thread where in the end, he missed by 5 courses. Not one or two but five. If Diagne is going to JUCO, then he missed by at least 2 and will need a JUCO degree to play D1 ball.

I have a question about the JUCO degree thing... Why?

Why is a JUCO degree required in order to play DI, instead of just going to JUCO for a year and completing 10+ college courses? If a normal student goes to a community college, they certainly don't have to wait until they graduate with some BS associates degree in order to get accepted to a real college. They could go for a semester and then bounce.

Is it really a requirement that they have to stay 2 years at JUCO?

 

[orangefan13]

Coleman is going to have a Wes Johnson like year I expect 4-5 threes per game on average.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I have a question about the JUCO degree thing... Why?

Why is a JUCO degree required in order to play DI, instead of just going to JUCO for a year and completing 10+ college courses? If a normal student goes to a community college, they certainly don't have to wait until they graduate with some BS associates degree in order to get accepted to a real college. They could go for a semester and then bounce.

Is it really a requirement that they have to stay 2 years at JUCO?

A normal student doesn't have to follow NCAA requirements.

If you want the scholarship, you have to have the grades.

 

[LoudHouse]

How did the NCAA *** up this kid? Every college athlete has to take a core set of college prep courses for initial eligibility. Not every kid makes it. This is like the Blair thread where in the end, he missed by 5 courses. Not one or two but five. If Diagne is going to JUCO, then he missed by at least 2 and will need a JUCO degree to play D1 ball.

He took every course he was required to, and passed them all. He also had all qualifiying scores. I asked Mike Waters about it and he said that info came directly from SU. It has NOTHING to do with his coursework. It has everything to do with the year he spent in Senegal, which the NCAA is somehow discounting. That's the information we still don't have access to, why that year magically didn't count. It was nothing like Blair, who by the way, took and passed all his courses. The NCAA just didn't like the fact that some of them were online courses, which seems ridiculous in today's technology age.

 

[FrancoPizza]

who ever said from Syracuse that Chino was offered to get Bryant? That was just an opinion.

It's a theory that's been tossed around because, frankly, it's scary to think they would have offered Chino straight up. The board insiders say there was no package deal, and I'm sure that's accurate, but it definitely casts some doubt about the staff's scouting abilities.

 

[SaltLakeOrange]

How did the NCAA *** up this kid? Every college athlete has to take a core set of college prep courses for initial eligibility. Not every kid makes it. This is like the Blair thread where in the end, he missed by 5 courses. Not one or two but five. If Diagne is going to JUCO, then he missed by at least 2 and will need a JUCO degree to play D1 ball.

Seems absurd that he can graduate HS with a sufficient GPA and with sufficient test scores and still not be eligible? Is the NCAA saying that the Senegalese HS curricula is not sufficient for entrance into a US University????????? Asinine.

 

[tee1222]

Coleman is going to have a Wes Johnson like year I expect 4-5 threes per game on average.

Seems legit

 

[Brooky03]

A normal student doesn't have to follow NCAA requirements.

If you want the scholarship, you have to have the grades.

I'm just curious why the NCAA has made it a requirement.

 

[Brooky03]

Is there any possiblity Diagne could enroll as a normal student next year (assuming he meets SU's admissions requirements), walk-on to the team and earn a scholarship the next year? Or does the NCAA clearinghouse lord over walk-ons too, though it shouldn't?

Student loans are no fun, but he'd most likely get a lot of aid, and it's likely he'll play pro ball somewhere after school; so he'd have the money to pay it back. Again, if he could make it into SU solely on academics. We all know SU's admissions requirements aren't exactly the toughest.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I'm just curious why the NCAA has made it a requirement.

14.5.4.2.2 Eligibility for Financial Aid and Practice.
A transfer student from a two-year college who was not a qualifier (per Bylaw 14.3.1.1) is eligible for institutional financial aid and practice the first academic year in residence only if the student:
(a) Has graduated from the two-year college;
(b) Has completed satisfactorily a minimum of 48 semester or 72 quarter hours of transferable-degree
credit acceptable toward any baccalaureate degree program at the certifying institution, including six
semester or eight quarter hours of transferable English credit, three semester or four quarter hours
of transferable math credit and three semester or four quarter hours of transferable natural/physical
science credit;
(c) Has attended a two-year college as a full-time student for at least three semesters or four quarters
(excluding summer terms); and
(d) Has achieved a minimum cumulative grade-point average of 2.000 (see Bylaw 14.5.4.5.3.2).

 

[Brooky03]

14.5.4.2.2 Eligibility for Financial Aid and Practice.
A transfer student from a two-year college who was not a qualifier (per Bylaw 14.3.1.1) is eligible for institutional financial aid and practice the first academic year in residence only if the student:
(a) Has graduated from the two-year college;
(b) Has completed satisfactorily a minimum of 48 semester or 72 quarter hours of transferable-degree
credit acceptable toward any baccalaureate degree program at the certifying institution, including six
semester or eight quarter hours of transferable English credit, three semester or four quarter hours
of transferable math credit and three semester or four quarter hours of transferable natural/physical
science credit;
(c) Has attended a two-year college as a full-time student for at least three semesters or four quarters
(excluding summer terms); and
(d) Has achieved a minimum cumulative grade-point average of 2.000 (see Bylaw 14.5.4.5.3.2).

I got this part. Again, I was just wondering the reasoning behind it. Doesn't seem to make sense, which I guess I should expect at this point.

 

[im4cuse]

How did the NCAA *** up this kid? Every college athlete has to take a core set of college prep courses for initial eligibility. Not every kid makes it. This is like the Blair thread where in the end, he missed by 5 courses. Not one or two but five. If Diagne is going to JUCO, then he missed by at least 2 and will need a JUCO degree to play D1 ball.

thank you. This is not a "slight" miss. He's way off. He's not coming here, ever. And if it were close, we/he'd be lawyered up to appeal the NCAA. My point is that SU has an "investment" in getting these kids eligible to enroll. Do some due diligence -- more than "well he's being recruited by others so he must be eligible". Avoid the "August surprise", with no options left. And pulling it would hurt with no recruits -- they care about other things as we know (Bryant is at the same school that famously pulled scholly for kid who ended up here, as you recall).

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I got this part. Again, I was just wondering the reasoning behind it. Doesn't seem to make sense, which I guess I should expect at this point.

If a kid coasted through HS and didn't get the grades, the NCAA doesn't want him to coast through 1-2 semesters at a JUCO.

If you want to play a Div 1 sport, the NCAA wants you to take this whole classroom thing seriously.

To answer your other question, I believe that even walk-ons have to be eligible under NCAA guidelines.

 

[Brooky03]

If a kid coasted through HS and didn't get the grades, the NCAA doesn't want him to coast through 1-2 semesters at a JUCO.

If you want to play a Div 1 sport, the NCAA wants you to take this whole classroom thing seriously.

To answer your other question, I believe that even walk-ons have to be eligible under NCAA guidelines.

Right, but it doesn't appear that we're talking about a situation in which a kid coasted through high school and didn't get the grades. Maybe you know the specifics, but it sounds like we're talking about some Senegal high school equivalent coursework that isn't up to NCAA standards (as if they have any way to measure that).

So the NCAA is saying it doesn't give a damn if he had straight A's and a perfect SAT score; that's totally irrelevant to them. They're saying he essentially didn't take X number of courses. So why would he not be allowed to just take the equivalent of those courses in junior college and be done with it? (Rhetorical question)

This would be a very simple thing to add since this seems to be a somewhat common issue. The NCAA would just need to have 2 courses of action depending on the reason a player was deemed academically ineligible. One course of action for the stupid athletes who couldn't get satisfactory grades and one course of action for the not stupid athletes who took the courses their high school told them to take.

 

[LoudHouse]

thank you. This is not a "slight" miss. He's way off. He's not coming here, ever. And if it were close, we/he'd be lawyered up to appeal the NCAA. My point is that SU has an "investment" in getting these kids eligible to enroll. Do some due diligence -- more than "well he's being recruited by others so he must be eligible". Avoid the "August surprise", with no options left. And pulling it would hurt with no recruits -- they care about other things as we know (Bryant is at the same school that famously pulled scholly for kid who ended up here, as you recall).

And once again, according to everything anyone saw, he was eligibile. His coursework at high school met requirements. His test scores met requirements. It wasn't until less than 2 months ago that anything even started being mentioned about this, so please explain what more "due diligence" you think SU could have done?

And sorry, but you're dead wrong if you think pulling a scholarship will have no effect on other recruits. If you're talking about Ron Patterson at Indiana, his scholarship wasn't pulled. He didn't qualify academically at Indiana. Here's an article to prove it.

http://www.insidethehall.com/2012/08/15/source-ron-patterson-will-not-attend-indiana-this-year/

 

[dasher]

It's a theory that's been tossed around because, frankly, it's scary to think they would have offered Chino straight up. The board insiders say there was no package deal, and I'm sure that's accurate, but it definitely casts some doubt about the staff's scouting abilities.

Really? They took a shot at a guy with size. Almost every program does that.

 

[im4cuse]

And once again, according to everything anyone saw, he was eligibile. His coursework at high school met requirements. His test scores met requirements. It wasn't until less than 2 months ago that anything even started being mentioned about this, so please explain what more "due diligence" you think SU could have done?

And sorry, but you're dead wrong if you think pulling a scholarship will have no effect on other recruits. If you're talking about Ron Patterson at Indiana, his scholarship wasn't pulled. He didn't qualify academically at Indiana. Here's an article to prove it.

http://www.insidethehall.com/2012/08/15/source-ron-patterson-will-not-attend-indiana-this-year/

 

[im4cuse]

His coursework at high school met requirements. His test scores met requirements. It wasn't until less than 2 months ago that anything even started being mentioned about this,

sorry but you don't know this -- assuming a fact not in evidence. I don't know it either, but my point, for the last time, is that an elite program, in this critical year of need, does not miss this badly. Again, HE'S NOT EVEN CLOSE otherwise we'd be threatening a legal action to permit his enrollment. But hey, we can agree to disagree.

 

[rrlbees]

He took every course he was required to, and passed them all. He also had all qualifiying scores. I asked Mike Waters about it and he said that info came directly from SU. It has NOTHING to do with his coursework. It has everything to do with the year he spent in Senegal, which the NCAA is somehow discounting. That's the information we still don't have access to, why that year magically didn't count. It was nothing like Blair, who by the way, took and passed all his courses. The NCAA just didn't like the fact that some of them were online courses, which seems ridiculous in today's technology age.

So you claim you can go to the NCAA website and say he took all the courses listed? I'm betting if the NCAA isn't counting some or all the courses he took in the Senegal that some of them didn't meet the requirements for a specific course.

 

[rrlbees]

Seems absurd that he can graduate HS with a sufficient GPA and with sufficient test scores and still not be eligible? Is the NCAA saying that the Senegalese HS curricula is not sufficient for entrance into a US University????????? Asinine.

Graduating HS means nothing. I know plenty of kids that just graduated HS that wouldn't come close to being eligible.

 

[Sgt Cuse]

It's a theory that's been tossed around because, frankly, it's scary to think they would have offered Chino straight up. The board insiders say there was no package deal, and I'm sure that's accurate, but it definitely casts some doubt about the staff's scouting abilities.

You do realize Chino wasn't recruited to be a star. He had some other decent schools after him. SU had 13 schollies at the time.

From all accounts Chino is a good student, a good teammate, and a good kid. And SU finds itself in a spot. Seems like a good thing SU has Chino or a bad situation would be worse.

Who did you want the staff to get instead of Chino? And remember at the time SU had both Rak and DC2.