Fire Autry

[kingtidge]

Agreed.

Plus, he's an alum, with long-standing ties to the program as both a player and a coach. There is no need to embarrass him with a mid-season termination.

Also, this season's story is still being written. IMO only -- but the Hofstra loss offsets the Tennessee win, both in terms of NET value and in terms of fan perception. Getting to the NCAA tournament -- the line of demarcation that is the minimum threshold demanded by the AD this year -- is going to be that much harder. But it is still possible. What if we somehow knock off a Duke or Louisville? I know, I know... Lloyd Christmas.

But we should know fairly quickly. Our elite defense has really tapered off. Was hoping that would carry us to 12+ conference wins. Now, I'm not so sure.

Hope springs eternal, but unless we somehow solve our free throw woes overnight, I don't see how this happens.

We're going to lose more games because we're one of the worst shooting free throw teams in the country... as we should.

...and now the script is out on us... switch to zone and baffle our playground offense to a standstill.

If close at game's end, foul us and watch us clank bricks as we lose the battle to tread water. Other coaches will scout us and gameplan for this.

But who knows?? Stranger things have happened, I suppose...

 

[RF2044]

Hope springs eternal, but unless we somehow solve our free throw woes overnight, I don't see how this happens.

We're going to lose more gsmes because we're on of the worst shooting free throw teams in the country... as we should.

...and now the script is out on us... switch to zone and baffle our playground offense to a standstill.

If close at game's end, foul us and watch us clank bricks as we lose the battle to tread water. Other coaches will scout us and gameplan for this.

But who knows?? Stranger things have happened, I suppose...

Oh, I agree across the board -- hence, my "Lloyd Christmas... you're saying there's a chance..." reference.

I'm just pointing out that the season is not over on December 15th. But red flags abound, and I have limited confidence in the staff's ability to turn things around.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Oh, I agree across the board -- hence, my "Lloyd Christmas... you're saying there's a chance..." reference.

I'm just pointing out that the season is not over on December 15th. But red flags abound, and I have limited confidence in the staff's ability to turn things around.

I can 100% understand the people that feel like they have a big enough, multi-season sample size to have little hope.

But each season stands alone, and we have +20 chances remaining to get the results we hope for.

It's an uphill climb to those results, but there's a lot of season left, and the talent is better.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I don't know how much clearer I can make it. Syracuse didn't want its HOF coach with numerous BOT and Donor backers in an all out war when he had to be fired vs "retiring".

If JB complains about being fired to the media, it cements his image as a stubborn old man who lost touch with reality. It's a business at the end of the day and most people would see that the University was more than gracious to let him stay as long as he did. Same goes for any donor who decides to pull their money. It's a horrible look if you put your friendship above what's best for the program.

At some point someone just has to stand up to the proverbial bully. It still hasn't happened and here we are still facing the consequences. Don't be surprised if JB still has some input in the next coaching search.

 

[sweetpea]

My concern is that the same people who pressured ADJW to hire Red are STILL THERE. And that includes JB roaming the halls like Moaning Myrtle.

I'm guessing JB isn't roaming the halls so much on this sinking ship.

 

[tbonezone]

JB's arrogance and selfishness are stunning. The textbook for his "leadership" class must be called How to Destroy What You Built & Ensure Your Organization Isn't Successful after You.

yes , by all means as captain it is your sworn duty to save the last bullet for the bottom of the boat.

 

[DilemaCuse]

Let him go scorched earth. What does that really mean? Seriously. Did he have blackmail photos? Genuinely curious what JB could do that was worth hiring an unqualified candidate and prolonging the misery and apathy of the dwindling fan base.

I know, who would have made who look worse? I'd say JB more than BOT unless we had a Sandusky/sherrone moore scandal/coverup that he was going to expose

 

[Fly Rodder]

Maybe not the guy who is underperforming the school's last ten years so far this season.
Maybe the guy who has a team waaaaaaay outperforming his school's last ten years.

 

[LAorange44]

Maybe not the guy who is underperforming the the last ten years so far this season.
Maybe the guy who has a team waaaaaaay outperforming his school's last ten years.

Great chart. Let’s also point out we aren’t on the chart for the top tier of teams over the last 10 years. This chart shows teams ranked 31-60 over the last 10 years. Should tell you a lot about the state of affairs when our highly touted team can’t hang with the ten-year average, arguably the worst 10 year stretch in school history. I challenge anyone to show some Autry positive metrics other than his bank account year-over-year.

 

[RedtheGOB]

Sometimes I feel like I'm taking crazy pills on this thread. Waiting for someone to say we get John Wooden or Coach K.

Way too many guys being thrown out that are not proven or way past their prime.

 

[RedtheGOB]

Great chart. Let’s also point out we aren’t on the chart for the top tier of teams over the last 10 years. This chart shows teams ranked 31-60 over the last 10 years. Should tell you a lot about the state of affairs when our highly touted team can’t hang with the ten-year average, arguably the worst 10 year stretch in school history. I challenge anyone to show some Autry positive metrics other than his bank account year-over-year.

You're not wrong but I have to challenge you on the bank account. He's making what feels like alot of money to most, but also much less than most P5 coaches. My guess is probably in the bottom 25% of P5 coaches. We've been down the path of well midmajors make less and do more, yea plenty do so no need to rehash that.

Reality is that we still pay our coaches much less than other P5 programs, but also our fanbase expects top 25 results. This next hoops hire will show us all if Cuse is seriously going to pay for a coach.

Personally I'm watching if we actually scoop a coach from another P5 program doing well or find a coach that is highly sought after by other high P5 programs and outbid them.

 

[capeorange]

You're not wrong but I have to challenge you on the bank account. He's making what feels like alot of money to most, but also much less than most P5 coaches. My guess is probably in the bottom 25% of P5 coaches. We've been down the path of well midmajors make less and do more, yea plenty do so no need to rehash that.

Reality is that we still pay our coaches much less than other P5 programs, but also our fanbase expects top 25 results. This next hoops hire will show us all if Cuse is seriously going to pay for a coach.

Personally I'm watching if we actually scoop a coach from another P5 program doing well or find a coach that is highly sought after by other high P5 programs and outbid them.

How much is Red getting paid?

 

[23Zone]

How much is Red getting paid?

Way too much for how he has performed

 

[RedtheGOB]

How much is Red getting paid?

1.7M. Likely 3-4 years. Has been the most reported #’s.

For reference Will Wade for NCstate is at 6 years 16 mil. 2.5 mil a year then goes up each year.

Ryan Odom at Virginia 3.25 mil 6 years.

I reference these two teams because we need a coach that can regularly compete and beat these teams in the top quarter of the ACC. Both rookie coaches too.

If Autry got a 50% raise tomorrow he would be making what Wade is and Odom is making almost double.

Just saying let that sink what you expect as fans and what the school is paying for the coach for peer programs.

 

[jdubs30]

1.7M. Likely 3-4 years. Has been the most reported #’s.

For reference Will Wade for NCstate is at 6 years 16 mil. 2.5 mil a year then goes up each year.

Ryan Odom at Virginia 3.25 mil 6 years.

I reference these two teams because we need a coach that can regularly compete and beat these teams in the top quarter of the ACC. Both rookie coaches too.

If Autry got a 50% raise tomorrow he would be making what Wade is and Odom is making almost double.

Just saying let that sink what you expect as fans and what the school is paying for the coach for peer programs.

Not sure how it’s even a comparison.

Will Wade is 252-108 (70%) in his career and has won 5 NCAA tournament games. He’s won 4 regular season conference championships and 2 tournament championships.

Ryan Odom is 231-138(64%) in his career - beat the 1 seed UVA- he’s won 2 regular season conference championships and 2 tournament championships.

Red Autry 39-34 (53%) in his career - he’s won nothing.


This Ryan Odums first year at UVA and he already has them at KenPom #24. Will Wade has NC state at #28 in his first year - they haven finished that high since 2005. Red has us #76 in year 3, which would be our best finish under him.

Theres a reason why they get double what Red gets. And I suspect when we play both teams we will see it play out on the coirt that way too. Theres no comparing Red to those 2.

 

[RedtheGOB]

Not sure how it’s even a comparison.

Will Wade is 252-108 (70%) in his career and has won 5 NCAA tournament games. He’s won 4 regular season conference championships and 2 tournament championships.

Ryan Odom is 231-138(64%) in his career - beat the 1 seed UVA- he’s won 2 regular season conference championships and 2 tournament championships.

Red Autry 39-34 (53%) in his career - he’s won nothing.


This Ryan Odums first year at UVA and he already has them at KenPom #24. Will Wade has NC state at #28 in his first year - they haven finished that high since 2005. Red has us #76 in year 3, which would be our best finish under him.

Theres a reason why they get double what Red gets. And I suspect when we play both teams we will see it play out on the coirt that way too. Theres no comparing Red to those 2.

You’re not understanding my post. You’re proving my point.

I’m talking about what it’s going to take the administration to pay next year and what they’re paying this year.

I’m talking about the disconnect with what fans think we should be and where we’re actually at right now and paying.

 

[Cusefan0307]

You’re not understanding my post. You’re proving my point.

I’m talking about what it’s going of take the administration to pay next year and what they’re paying this year.

I’m talking about the disconnect with what fans think we should be and where we’re actually at right now and paying.

He got the job as a continuity hire. He’s getting paid what he’s paid because he had zero experience. That’s the reason.

 

[sufan59]

he got the job as a continuity hire. He’s getting paid what he’s paid because he had zero experience. that’s the reason.

Yeah not sure what the point people are trying to make. They made a continuity hire to someone with zero experience and likely gave a standard first time P4 head coach contract. It had very little to do with saving a buck, they were likely prepared for a huge extension and still are if Red delivers. This is the first season he’s had the resources to reasonably perform on a high level. Jon Scheyer and Hubert Davis were likely around what Red was getting in there original contracts as first time head coaches. Unlike Red, they had the resources from the very beginning to reasonably perform at a high level. I’m in the camp of understanding that, but still feeling like we underperformed in the first two seasons with what he had, especially last season.

 

[Sbucketball]

1.7M. Likely 3-4 years. Has been the most reported #’s.

If SU told Red he gets the HC job but will be paid the same salary he made as top assistant with an escalator if he performs well, would Red have rejected the job? The answer is no. For a school that likes to scream poor, I don't understand offering 1.7m for him right off the bat. Last year we heard about no treadmills and taking the bus to games.

 

[OrangeCrush22]

He needs to be canned and we need to pony up some cash for a new coach. I’m worried about how much SU is willing to spend on an actually good replacement

 

[Blanko97]

1.7M. Likely 3-4 years. Has been the most reported #’s.

For reference Will Wade for NCstate is at 6 years 16 mil. 2.5 mil a year then goes up each year.

Ryan Odom at Virginia 3.25 mil 6 years.

I reference these two teams because we need a coach that can regularly compete and beat these teams in the top quarter of the ACC. Both rookie coaches too.

If Autry got a 50% raise tomorrow he would be making what Wade is and Odom is making almost double.

Just saying let that sink what you expect as fans and what the school is paying for the coach for peer programs.

According to this article (How much did Syracuse pay football coach Dino Babers after he was fired?), he was making $1.8M his first year with only 10 months of pay. So that is ~$2.2M annualized almost 3 years ago. You could certainly afford a Will Wade.

 

[capeorange]

1.7M. Likely 3-4 years. Has been the most reported #’s.

For reference Will Wade for NCstate is at 6 years 16 mil. 2.5 mil a year then goes up each year.

Ryan Odom at Virginia 3.25 mil 6 years.

I reference these two teams because we need a coach that can regularly compete and beat these teams in the top quarter of the ACC. Both rookie coaches too.

If Autry got a 50% raise tomorrow he would be making what Wade is and Odom is making almost double.

Just saying let that sink what you expect as fans and what the school is paying for the coach for peer programs.

You're including Odom's performance bonuses with his 1.8 million salary. John Schyer has a 1.7 million salary.
Red could have a 10 million performance bonus but SU would never have to pay it. He's over his head and over paid. I don't care if he's working for free, he needs to go.
I would imagine/ hope that the next coach will be paid more than Red because he will be more qualified...hopefully

 

[Brooky03]

If SU told Red he gets the HC job but will be paid the same salary he made as top assistant with an escalator if he performs well, would Red have rejected the job? The answer is no. For a school that likes to scream poor, I don't understand offering 1.7m for him right off the bat. Last year we heard about no treadmills and taking the bus to games.

I don’t know of anybody doing any job anywhere who would accept an offer like you’re suggesting or any company that would offer it.

When you get a promotion with more responsibilities, you get more money.

“Hey work a lot harder, manage more people, make more decisions that can get you fired, and we’ll pay you the same amount you get paid now and can get paid anywhere for the job you’re doing. If you are great, we’ll give you some more” is a really bad sales pitch.

 

[orangefog]

I don’t know of anybody doing any job anywhere who would accept an offer like you’re suggesting or any company that would offer it.

When you get a promotion with more responsibilities, you get more money.

“Hey work a lot harder, manage more people, make more decisions that can get you fired, and we’ll pay you the same amount you get paid now and can get paid anywhere for the job you’re doing. If you are great, we’ll give you some more” is a really bad sales pitch.

Absolutely. You choose someone you have faith in or you don't choose them. You show faith in them by paying them accordingly.

 

[Sbucketball]

I don’t know of anybody doing any job anywhere who would accept an offer like you’re suggesting or any company that would offer it.

When you get a promotion with more responsibilities, you get more money.

“Hey work a lot harder, manage more people, make more decisions that can get you fired, and we’ll pay you the same amount you get paid now and can get paid anywhere for the job you’re doing. If you are great, we’ll give you some more” is a really bad sales pitch.

Most jobs aren't the one we're talking about. Completely different circumstance than 99.9% of jobs. Fine to include a raise - maybe a few hundred grand - but I highly doubt 1.7m was necessary to secure Red's services. This was his dream job at his alma mater and he had no other real options that even compared. No one else was trying to get him. And success would mean a lot of money in the near future. Oh well, not my money, so i really don't care either way. Just interesting to see how leadership handles things, especially if we're going to hear about treadmills and buses.