FSU vs The ACC

[pokercuse08]

All the good teams have been taken

The best argument for the Big 12 being a stronger conference than the ACC is that the Big 12 doesn't have any good teams left and the ACC does. That's a backwards argument.

 

[pokercuse08]

The P2 are at 34 so far by my count... I may be missing a team or two, but I would argue the breakdown is something like this (in rough order of importance):

In Somewhere:
Notre Dame (once forced)
FSU
Clemson
UNC
Virginia
Miami

Probably In:
NC State

Maybe In:
Utah
Louisville
Duke
WVU
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
TCU
Kansas
Oklahoma State
Pitt

In Now But Could Be Out:
Maryland
Rutgers
Northwestern
Vanderbilt

There are a few others that are in now that aren't as good as some of the "maybe in" schools IMO... But by sheer inertia they are probably safe. There are a few others that are out now that I left off that I think should be in, but I think the people making the decisions will be driven by the short-term dollar and not by sustainability.

Anyway if it's 48 schools I think we're pretty safe, if it's 40 I think we're pretty screwed. I think we'll be moving up that list over the next few years, so the longer this takes the better our chances of getting up ahead of NC State in the pecking order.

Regardless, we'll be in the best of the rest conference if we don't make it... whether that's the ACC or Big 12, I'm not sure it really matters. Only difference is the name on the logo because it's gonna be a national hodge podge of left behind former P5ers.

 

[anomander]

If I was Wildhack i would be pushing this graphic to anyone that would liste .

 

[FireballPhil]

First ACC motion will likely be for change of venue from FSU's hometown court. I'm not fully up on Federal diversity rules anymore but if possible removal to Federal court is also an option

Florida St board of trustees. One member notes that she was appointed as a trustee by the governor, DeSantis. Do governors in public universities appoint trustees? Just never knew that.

Trustees | Board of Trustees

Florida State University Board of Trustees is the public body corporate of the university that sets policy for the institution and serves as the institution's legal owner and governing board.

trustees.fsu.edu

now you know why all the hub bub with Disney. They need to finance a buyout.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

The P2 are at 34 so far by my count... I may be missing a team or two, but I would argue the breakdown is something like this (in rough order of importance):

In Somewhere:
Notre Dame (once forced)
FSU
Clemson
UNC
Virginia
Miami

Probably In:
NC State

Maybe In:
Utah
Louisville
Duke
WVU
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
TCU
Kansas
Oklahoma State
Pitt

In Now But Could Be Out:
Maryland
Rutgers
Northwestern
Vanderbilt

There are a few others that are in now that aren't as good as some of the "maybe in" schools IMO... But by sheer inertia they are probably safe. There are a few others that are out now that I left off that I think should be in, but I think the people making the decisions will be driven by the short-term dollar and not by sustainability.

Anyway if it's 48 schools I think we're pretty safe, if it's 40 I think we're pretty screwed. I think we'll be moving up that list over the next few years, so the longer this takes the better our chances of getting up ahead of NC State in the pecking order.

Regardless, we'll be in the best of the rest conference if we don't make it... whether that's the ACC or Big 12, I'm not sure it really matters. Only difference is the name on the logo because it's gonna be a national hodge podge of left behind former P5ers.

3 x 18 = 54

 

[BomberOrange]

Reddit, twitter, any other social media, message boards. I'm sure most of the people don't have true sources, but i'm sure some do. The information isn't coming out of thin air. You know what they say usually when there is smoke there is fire. Our best hope would be for FSU to get shut down by the ACC and we drastically improve our brand over the next 5 years. Also, I don't think many programs in the B12 play lacrosse so that would hurt in other ways.

We could also have very well been in the B10 for a decade now. What i've heard is we were invited to the B10 when we still had our AAU accreditation, however after consulting Boeheim, he preferred the ACC. The next year Rutgers gets the B10 invite. Just think about it. At the time they wanted NY viewers. No way in hell Rutgers gets invited over us. That could possibly forever haunt us.

Reddit and Twitter??? Great sources

Edit: actually I’ll give twitter some credit as there are some real sources there but Reddit is basically an aol chat room for the 2020s.

 

[baggerbob]

The P2 are at 34 so far by my count... I may be missing a team or two, but I would argue the breakdown is something like this (in rough order of importance):

In Somewhere:
Notre Dame (once forced)
FSU
Clemson
UNC
Virginia
Miami

Probably In:
NC State

Maybe In:
Utah
Louisville
Duke
WVU
Virginia Tech
Syracuse
TCU
Kansas
Oklahoma State
Pitt

In Now But Could Be Out:
Maryland
Rutgers
Northwestern
Vanderbilt

There are a few others that are in now that aren't as good as some of the "maybe in" schools IMO... But by sheer inertia they are probably safe. There are a few others that are out now that I left off that I think should be in, but I think the people making the decisions will be driven by the short-term dollar and not by sustainability.

Anyway if it's 48 schools I think we're pretty safe, if it's 40 I think we're pretty screwed. I think we'll be moving up that list over the next few years, so the longer this takes the better our chances of getting up ahead of NC State in the pecking order.

Regardless, we'll be in the best of the rest conference if we don't make it... whether that's the ACC or Big 12, I'm not sure it really matters. Only difference is the name on the logo because it's gonna be a national hodge podge of left behind former P5ers.

They also might end up violating anti-trust
laws if they try to break off. All your sports leagues have to get permission.
They would never get a waiver if it's less then about 70 teams.
They would be tied up in courts for the next 20 years.

 

[pokercuse08]

3 x 18 = 54

I don't see how it ends up being a P3 when there are 40-50 programs that are worth having in the upper echelon of college football and they're spread across four conferences.

 

[JimBoston]

I’d love to see the ACC file suit against the SEC for tampering.

Isn't that what the ACC did with the Big East?

 

[OrangeXtreme]

I don't see how it ends up being a P3 when there are 40-50 programs that are worth having in the upper echelon of college football and they're spread across four conferences.

B1G is already at 18, and the SEC has 16.

A 20 team conference is a scheduling nightmare, and 4 teams would get excluded from the basketball tourney in March.

That leaves 3 x 18 or 4 x 14 to include all the teams you want included.

2 x 24 will never work. That's a hockey league.

 

[JimBoston]

If the Big 12 goes to 20 schools and they are grabbing ACC schools after a theoretical move of schools to the SEC and Big 10, I would think their top schools would be Louisville/Pitt/VT/NC State.

 

[pokercuse08]

They also might end up violating anti-trust
laws if they try to break off. All your sports leagues have to get permission.
They would never get a waiver if it's less then about 70 teams.
They would be tied up in courts for the next 20 years.

I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think this is true. I think only MLB has an anti-trust exemption and I think it mainly applies to the minor league system now. I don't see any legal reason why 40-50 universities couldn't form a new college athletics association and issue their own national championship, although their would likely be some political blowback or saber rattling when some major flagships got left out.

 

[ClkWrkOrange]

Reddit, twitter, any other social media, message boards. I'm sure most of the people don't have true sources, but i'm sure some do. The information isn't coming out of thin air. You know what they say usually when there is smoke there is fire. Our best hope would be for FSU to get shut down by the ACC and we drastically improve our brand over the next 5 years. Also, I don't think many programs in the B12 play lacrosse so that would hurt in other ways.

We could also have very well been in the B10 for a decade now. What i've heard is we were invited to the B10 when we still had our AAU accreditation, however after consulting Boeheim, he preferred the ACC. The next year Rutgers gets the B10 invite. Just think about it. At the time they wanted NY viewers. No way in hell Rutgers gets invited over us. That could possibly forever haunt us.

Everything I've seen is from some Big 12 nutcase shill. They are all over YouTube and Twitter. Every one of them have been Big 12 mouthpieces.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Why didn't anyone sue ESPN? They are the ones who delayed the launch of the ACC Network twice, and who offered a substantially better contract to the other major leagues, and who unilaterally exercised a nine year extension with no price increase for ACC Tier 1 broadcast rights? If I'm the ACC, I implead them for unequal treatment and breach of contract.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think this is true. I think only MLB has an anti-trust exemption and I think it mainly applies to the minor league system now. I don't see any legal reason why 40-50 universities couldn't form a new college athletics association and issue their own national championship, although their would likely be some political blowback or saber rattling when some major flagships got left out.

Labor laws will also come into play soon.

 

[orange79]

If the Big 12 goes to 20 schools and they are grabbing ACC schools after a theoretical move of schools to the SEC and Big 10, I would think their top schools would be Louisville/Pitt/VT/NC State.

If UNC and UVa are "available", no way Louisville, Pitt, VT, and NC State are their first choices.

 

[SURules]

If I was Wildhack i would be pushing this graphic to anyone that would liste .

Where is the mighty UNC on this chart? I thought they were one of the top dogs based upon a few pages back.

 

[Chris02M]

Anyone know anything about Greg Swaim? He's claiming that Clemson, Miami, UNC, NC State, Virginia, and Virginia Tech are about to file suits against the ACC as well. Looks like he's a radio host in Stillwater, OK, so no idea why he'd be getting this story first. Hopefully this is Big 12 propaganda, because we really need a few more years to rebuild the football program before this goes down.

he is closely related to the wvu dude

 

[suorange08]

Well what I mentioned is what happened with Texas and Oklahoma. They will be in the SEC for 2024-25 yet they were owned B12 TV money for 2024-25 as per their GoR. They agreed as part of their exit to forfeit that money to the B12 in lieu of paying the $160M exit fee.

By exiting the conference you forfeit your compensation and they weren't due any revenues by the Big12. What helped OU and UT here is that the Big12's tv partners made them whole for 2024 and the next contract. I think that's a big reason Yormark played nice and let them go early.

It was Houston, because Texas had decided that the SWC died because it had too many small private schools. So Texas preferred Houston to anybody else. And A&M wanted to play in Houston every other year. But A&M's rivalry with Baylor even had name: Battle of the Bravos.

Baylor long has had much more political clout in TX than the number of alums would suggest. So Baylor getting into the Big XII was about more than just 1 TX governor.

It was neither TCU nor Houston. The original plan was only Texas and A&M. Then the LT. Gov (both a Tech and Baylor law grad) worked with other top level officials who were Baylor alums to strong arm Texas and A&M to include Tech and Baylor.

 

[Qbobby]

he is closely related to the wvu dude

Uncle/husband?

 

[orange79]

he is closely related to the wvu dude

Technically, that could be most of West Virginia and parts of Kentucky and Ohio.

 

[GHLF]

Exactly.

An excellent poster whom no longer posts here (handle began with an A and ended in an S) and is an attorney, was as good as anyone on this expansion stuff, etc. IMO. He long opined that the GOR could be challenged in court, and wondered who was going to be the first to do so, especially with the economical risk with so much uncertainty due to a lack of precedent, or any action to date taken, etc.

He also opined that the crown jewels of the ACC clearly are UNC & UVA, and as long as thosedo not get it two schools stayed committed to the ACC, it would survive relatively as we know it. FSU is going to be the guineau pig or pioneer in all of this, however, rest assured both UNC and UVA are probably chomping at the bit...while laying low in the grass ready to pounce at the most opportunistic moment.

Why UVA, I do not get it? Academic prestige?

 

[BomberOrange]

Why UVA, I do not get it? Academic prestige?

States flagship. Obviously they’re not interested in performance as they took Rutgirls

 

[IthacaMatt]

Why UVA, I do not get it? Academic prestige?

Cable footprint.

 

[ClkWrkOrange]

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