Has this ever worked?

[PhatOrange]

It seems like ADJW is the CEO and Dino is C level manager.

The only thing JW did was open the checkbook. Babers is the one who went out and got these guys.

 

[All4SU]

I'm just throwing it out there. He went from hiring his in-law as QB coach to this. Something has changed. There's nothing wrong with it, whatever works works.

Sometimes things don’t work. The reality is, with or without Wildhack, both of these coaches could have looked elsewhere. Dino was able to sell/communicate the opportunity/vision to them. Now it’s obvious that JW probably had to open a checkbook. But regardless, they are putting their chips in with Babers. That doesn’t just happen accidentally. Good for Dino for sacrificing a little of his own ego to work with JW to recognize that changes could be made, and then making the very best out of the situation.

 

[orangeinohio]

I thought Dino was already pretty hands-off during the game except for big decisions.

Didn’t he make subtle Monday morning complaints about Gilbert’s performance during this season?

 

[orangecuse]

It seems like ADJW is the CEO and Dino is C level manager.

I'm just throwing it out there. He went from hiring his in-law as QB coach to this. Something has changed. There's nothing wrong with it, whatever works works.

I share considerably with this line of thinking.

In business, anyone who's in a hiring position, especially at the higher/highest levels, knows that success is a direct parallel to the quality of one's hires. If they're failing, or not fitting the bill, etc., it will generally have an adverse effect relative to particular and overall/broader achievements/successes. On the flip side, if those you've assembled and are responsible for are successful, you'll also reap in those benefits.

I honestly haven't any idea how Dino was labelled an "offensive guru" when he arrived here as he himself doesn't seemingly possess these traits due to his 6 year track record at SU. Moreover, as you mentioned, he also lacked judgement and showed very little prowess in his hiring decisions.

Hopefully, in this do or die season ahead, these hires (which very well may've likely been along the line of a broader team/AD effort, etc.) succeed. Far more than anything, for the sake of Syracuse University Football and its future.

 

[007]

It seems like ADJW is the CEO and Dino is C level manager.

Not true and not even close.

The only thing JW did was open the checkbook. Babers is the one who went out and got these guys.

My understanding is that Dino has, and always had, complete autonomy in the hiring and the day-to-day operations of the program.

JW is so much more than the keeper of the checkbook gate. What we've seen transpire since the end of the Pitt game is JW's vision of what needed to happen. Dino is responsible for changing the "who" to make that happen. Dino has skin in the game in terms of his employment and his personal finances (i'm not talking about his salary or his compensation).

JW has identified obstacles to success for the program and has been working to reduce those obstacles for the past few years. The big donors (and the University) are investing heavily in John's vision of the program and in his ability to lead.

 

[orangepassion]

Hopefully it also frees him up to be more hands-on in recruiting. He came here with a reputation as a dynamite recruiter.

He did?

 

[orlandoorange]

Not true and not even close.


My understanding is that Dino has, and always had, complete autonomy in the hiring and the day-to-day operations of the program.

JW is so much more than the keeper of the checkbook gate. What we've seen transpire since the end of the Pitt game is JW's vision of what needed to happen. Dino is responsible for changing the "who" to make that happen. Dino has skin in the game in terms of his employment and his personal finances (i'm not talking about his salary or his compensation).

JW has identified obstacles to success for the program and has been working to reduce those obstacles for the past few years. The big donors (and the University) are investing heavily in John's vision of the program and in his ability to lead.

Call it what you like, but it sounds as though you just said the same thing I did.

I don't care who gets credit for what, who has what title. It sure looks like ADJW is guiding the program. Based on my knowledge of what a CEO does, that seems to match. Just win baby!

 

[007]

Call it what you like, but it sounds as though you just said the same thing I did.

I don't care who gets credit for what, who has what title. It sure looks like ADJW is guiding the program. Based on my knowledge of what a CEO does, that seems to match. Just win baby!

What about the part where you said "Dino is a C level manager?"

 

[TheCusian]

Call it what you like, but it sounds as though you just said the same thing I did.

I don't care who gets credit for what, who has what title. It sure looks like ADJW is guiding the program. Based on my knowledge of what a CEO does, that seems to match. Just win baby!

It’s almost as if the AD and HC are working together in the best interests of the football program

 

[orlandoorange]

What about the part where you said "Dino is a C level manager?"

His department would be the football division. He has full operational control until he needs help. Nothing wrong with that. There are a very, very few Nick Sabans out there. IMO this is a great approach. Regardless of who called who to get these guys, I think more of ADJW now than I had previously.

I don't know jack about football. I like watching it and I like watching it when SU is playing in December or January even more.

 

[baggerbob]

Sometimes things don’t work. The reality is, with or without Wildhack, both of these coaches could have looked elsewhere. Dino was able to sell/communicate the opportunity/vision to them. Now it’s obvious that JW probably had to open a checkbook. But regardless, they are putting their chips in with Babers. That doesn’t just happen accidentally. Good for Dino for sacrificing a little of his own ego to work with JW to recognize that changes could be made, and then making the very best out of the situation.

Bronco wanted his two guys to get a good job, so he apparently contacted Dino. He must have been contemplating retirement for some time.
Dino being respected by others coaches has worked out well for us. We have finally got a solid staff with experience, and youth.
Players in the portal should want to come and work with these coaches, they have the record of getting players to the NFL.
On defense and offense, they have guys they have coached who made it.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Call it what you like, but it sounds as though you just said the same thing I did.

I don't care who gets credit for what, who has what title. It sure looks like ADJW is guiding the program. Based on my knowledge of what a CEO does, that seems to match. Just win baby!

You can be a CEO of a group without being the CEO of the entire company… Dino is the equivalent of a director/VP at many companies. At that level the leader has p and l accountability and is responsible for hiring. The main job of that leader is to establish a vision for his group that is aligned with the expectations of his managers and ensure that his immediate reports are executing on the plan. A good leader absolutely gives all credit to his team while taking all the blame in public. In private it’s up to the leader to ensure that he/she is addressing performance issues with any one group.

My concern with Dino continues to be that there is no overall vision for the program… He came in with orange is the new fast on offense and a bend but don’t break D that tried to get turnovers. He was okay with his D spending a lot of time on the field and trading 3s for 7s because his offense would score 7 more often than not and do it quickly.

What is the vision today? We play grind it out and we try to possess the ball. The D is a bit more of an attacking style that tries to force the other team to pass where our excellent secondary can take over. Is this Dino’s new vision or is this what we are doing because we don’t have the talent? I am worried that Dino is hiring talented coaches without establishing a vision… all the talent in the world doesn’t matter without a cohesive vision.

 

[DoctorBombay]

You can be a CEO of a group without being the CEO of the entire company… Dino is the equivalent of a director/VP at many companies. At that level the leader has p and l accountability and is responsible for hiring. The main job of that leader is to establish a vision for his group that is aligned with the expectations of his managers and ensure that his immediate reports are executing on the plan. A good leader absolutely gives all credit to his team while taking all the blame in public. In private it’s up to the leader to ensure that he/she is addressing performance issues with any one group.

My concern with Dino continues to be that there is no overall vision for the program… He came in with orange is the new fast on offense and a bend but don’t break D that tried to get turnovers. He was okay with his D spending a lot of time on the field and trading 3s for 7s because his offense would score 7 more often than not and do it quickly.

What is the vision today? We play grind it out and we try to possess the ball. The D is a bit more of an attacking style that tries to force the other team to pass where our excellent secondary can take over. Is this Dino’s new vision or is this what we are doing because we don’t have the talent? I am worried that Dino is hiring talented coaches without establishing a vision… all the talent in the world doesn’t matter without a cohesive vision.

Dino had a vision for what he wanted when he came to SU, but I’m most impressed by his willingness to shift gears. The 3-3-5 was an acknowledgment his vision on defense wasn’t coming through, and moving to an Anae/Beck offense seems to suggest the same thing on O.
And it may not be “OITNF” but UVA ran a very brisk offense with a lot of innovative schemes.
His openness to changing gears about his own philosophies indicates plenty of growth and, dare I say, vision from HCDB.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Not doubting the coaching moves that have been made the past two years. Essentially, we've rebuilt the staff from top to bottom. The signs are positive on the defensive side. Hopefully the same on the offensive side. What I'm wondering though is if there was ever a situation like this where a HC in trouble is thrown a lifeline at this stage in their tenure and remakes his staff and his o and d philosophies back to success? Coach Mac started out pretty mediocre before hooking up with DeLeone and installing the freeze option 4-5 years in. Can't think of other examples. Maybe because head coaches usually don't make it this far in neutral without getting fired.

Frank Beamer at one point had a DC save him. I should remember his name, everybody knows him ... Bud Foster.

 

[Newhouser]

Bronco wanted his two guys to get a good job, so he apparently contacted Dino. He must have been contemplating retirement for some time.
Dino being respected by others coaches has worked out well for us. We have finally got a solid staff with experience, and youth.
Players in the portal should want to come and work with these coaches, they have the record of getting players to the NFL.
On defense and offense, they have guys they have coached who made it.

So if Bronco doesn't reach out do we go after these guys?

 

[money3189]

Call it what you like, but it sounds as though you just said the same thing I did.

I don't care who gets credit for what, who has what title. It sure looks like ADJW is guiding the program. Based on my knowledge of what a CEO does, that seems to match. Just win baby!

Guiding the program in what way? JW doesnt know the intricacies of football. He knows he has to support the HC and give him the tools he needs to run a productive program.

 

[money3189]

What is the vision today? We play grind it out and we try to possess the ball. The D is a bit more of an attacking style that tries to force the other team to pass where our excellent secondary can take over. Is this Dino’s new vision or is this what we are doing because we don’t have the talent? I am worried that Dino is hiring talented coaches without establishing a vision… all the talent in the world doesn’t matter without a cohesive vision.

He had a vision. Had some success but it wasnt sustainable. He made some tweaks. He now has a new vision. Thats why he made these hires.

 

[orlandoorange]

Guiding the program in what way? JW doesnt know the intricacies of football. He knows he has to support the HC and give him the tools he needs to run a productive program.

Dunno, just an uneducated guess. We've had pretty significant staff changes in the past 2 years.

If I had a company and the guy that is responsible to run one of the groups was underperforming, I'd likely have a talk with him about fixing things, what my expectations are, and how soon I'd like to see them met. In my book that would be guiding the program.

 

[OrangeFoo]

He had a vision. Had some success but it wasnt sustainable. He made some tweaks. He now has a new vision. Thats why he made these hires.

But what is the new vision?

 

[money3189]

Dunno, just an uneducated guess. We've had pretty significant staff changes in the past 2 years.

If I had a company and the guy that is responsible to run one of the groups was underperforming, I'd likely have a talk with him about fixing things, what my expectations are, and how soon I'd like to see them met. In my book that would be guiding the program.

Staff changes were needed in the attempt to win more games. Pretty standard thing to do when things arent working. JW wasn't involved in selecting coaches or schemes. He is focusing on supporting and funding all the sports at SU. Thats his expertise. Dino's expertise is football. Managing a staff with the players and schemes he desires. Talking with him? Yes every AD talks to their coaches about the good, the bad and ways to improve.

 

[TheCusian]

So if Bronco doesn't reach out do we go after these guys?

Does it matter? This is how hiring in CFB (and in the real world) works.

 

[money3189]

But what is the new vision?

I think the changes he's made are obvious to everyone but every coach has a vision. Whether or not it comes to fruition is yet to be determined.

 

[TheCusian]

But what is the new vision?

You want better branding?

 

[orlandoorange]

I think the changes he's made are obvious to everyone but every coach has a vision. Whether or not it comes to fruition is yet to be determined.

Thats the question. It's okay to say he's a CEO coach. That doesn't mean he's effective as one. I haven't seen any indicators he will be. I was really hoping the ADJW had a stronger hand on the wheel.

These seems like great hires, I'll hope he can get things figured out

 

[money3189]

Thats the question. It's okay to say he's a CEO coach. That doesn't mean he's effective as one. I haven't seen any indicators he will be. I was really hoping the ADJW had a stronger hand on the wheel.

These seems like great hires, I'll hope he can get things figured out

He's been a CEO coach though. Most coaches are. The coordinators and position coaches do the coaching . Some head coaches coordinator but not many. Some provide more input than others on gameday planning and scripting of plays. ADJW is not a football guy. He never played the sport. He was a espn programmer for 30 years.