Hate To Be That Guy, But...

[PhatOrange]

Ok, i will bite, but are we looking for contributors or impact players? I agree whole heartedly that camp offers carry more weight as I trust the in person evaluation ability of our staff. That said, i see how some, including me would like other P5 staffs having the same thoughts. I get it.

We’ll get both types. He repeats over and over “the under belly of the team” for a reason.

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

The Benson kid is the only real reach right now. He barely has any mid-major offers, which isn't great coming out of a highly recruited area (cuselegacy needs to refine her definition). The productivity point made-above is interesting though. The class still isn't strong yet, but Nunn has a good offer list, Jackson has some good offers and seems a great system fit, Rondi's film isn't great, but I wouldn't argue with Rutgers and Temple offers for a defensive player, Red is a raw prospect from an under recruited area, ditto the Canadian kid. The one I'm on the fence about is Cole. Spattering of major offers from weaker programs. Recruiting hot bed. Really liked his film, but at his size, i still have visions of Carl Jones looking like he was going to poop himself every time a BC running back swept towards him.

We are never going to pull classes like Clemson, FSU, Miami, etc. But you can only put 11 kids on the field at a time. The key is to stack classes with a mix of high-end talent, really solid players, and hope some folks develop. Need to get 11 guys out there who by the time they hit the field, are the equivalent of 4-5 star types.

 

[gbo]

Dabo: "You're not going to last very long if you're making evaluations from a 7-on-7 tape" - FootballScoop

Then Dabo used 5-11, 195lb Tampa Bay Bucs wide receiver Adam Humphries as an example. Coming out of high school, Humphries was a two-star corner out of South Carolina and had just 1 offer – Clemson. At Clemson, Humphries made the move to wide receiver and ended up starting 27 games, appeared in 53 games total, and caught just three touchdowns. At Clemson’s Pro Day, he ran a 4.53 and later signed a free agent deal with the Bucs. Last year he carved out a pivotal role and finished the year with 61 receptions for 631 yards as a productive NFL wide receiver.

“That’s why the Adam Humphries of the world are playing in the NFL, because they get overlooked by the combine stuff and recruiting rankings and all that. At the end of the day you’ve got to be a football player. So I look way more into that – what type of player are they? Sometimes guys have a lot of measurables but they’re not very good football players. Some people don’t have very good measurables, but they’re very good football players.”

“At the end of the day, it’s one thing to catch that ball over the middle when the guy is out there with a t-shirt on, it’s another thing when he has some pads on. It’s a different mindset.”


Some wise words from Dabo. Now don't @ me gbo

I would never

 

[SoBristol]

Lesson #1. Never believe everything posters post on a fan forum.
I don't recall seeing any statements from the coaching staff that there would be less scholarships this year or that they were being "more selective"...whatever that means. The coaches are going to evaluate and offer the prospects they think best fit the system, have good academics and can qualify and will help the team win. And I agree, why don't we wait and see how this class fills out and finishes.

Good points, though fans who follow recruiting aren't going to wait until the class fills out and finishes. Have to expect that fans will (early and often) compare our recruiting success against our regional rivals.

As to class size, the coaching staff will rarely make predictions. Depends on number of graduating seniors, plus the amount of attrition. Can do the math, and predict attrition -- but coaches don't do that in June.

For what it is worth, Dino said "selective" in Seneca Falls -- also commenting that his roster has improved, and he wants to continue to land better prospects to improve his team. Isn't that what we hope Dino is striving to do?

 

[shu 49]

I feel Dino and Dave know what they want out of a kid. Some of these kids are under the radar kids and will need time to develop but we have that now. For instance, Benson isn’t a Pierce type kid with exceptional abilities at receiving but he sure as hell can block his ars off and loves contact. I love them dudes. Reminds me of a Josh Pace comparison but in Football. Glue guy that does crap we need done but isn’t pretty. With the Lb we got, u can’t teach height. Both of these guys flashed as they say at camp with all coaches there so I’m trusting them and they have proved knowledgeable. Does it hurt our star rating, yeah but I’m ok with that. Would I rather have four and five star guys, sure when we start winning. Maybe these guys are targeted for special teams. We don’t know and won’t for a few years.

 

[CuseLegacy]

The Benson kid is the only real reach right now. He barely has any mid-major offers, which isn't great coming out of a highly recruited area (cuselegacy needs to refine her definition). The productivity point made-above is interesting though. The class still isn't strong yet, but Nunn has a good offer list, Jackson has some good offers and seems a great system fit, Rondi's film isn't great, but I wouldn't argue with Rutgers and Temple offers for a defensive player, Red is a raw prospect from an under recruited area, ditto the Canadian kid. The one I'm on the fence about is Cole. Spattering of major offers from weaker programs. Recruiting hot bed. Really liked his film, but at his size, i still have visions of Carl Jones looking like he was going to poop himself every time a BC running back swept towards him.

We are never going to pull classes like Clemson, FSU, Miami, etc. But you can only put 11 kids on the field at a time. The key is to stack classes with a mix of high-end talent, really solid players, and hope some folks develop. Need to get 11 guys out there who by the time they hit the field, are the equivalent of 4-5 star types.

I agree I need to edit Bensons' offers. Mid Major and Very smart kid schools.

 

[SmilinBob]

I completely trust the staffs evaluation skills until they prove otherwise.

 

[CuseLegacy]

The Dead Period has started. Any commitments for the next four weeks will have to be from kids who have already camped or visited SU.

I see lake time in my future.

 

[PhatOrange]

Rondi's film isn't great, but I wouldn't argue with Rutgers and Temple offers for a defensive player

Sort of thought the same on Rondi. I put a certain amount of stock into Ash thinking the kid can play DLine in the Big10. Their fans would think the same if they got a WR from New York that Babers offered early to.

 

[PhatOrange]

By the way, what do our peer group schools look like?

 

[Trueblue25]

Ok, i will bite, but are we looking for contributors or impact players? I agree whole heartedly that camp offers carry more weight as I trust the in person evaluation ability of our staff. That said, i see how some, including me would like other P5 staffs having the same thoughts. I get it.

Need contrinutors three deep just as much as we need impact players. Our impact players bot hurt last year and we went from looking like a 7 win team to being a 4 win team.

 

[Trueblue25]

We need blocking tight ends and special teams guys as well as exceptional highlight reel tight ends.

Dino’s trying to build depth more similar to nfl teams. Have the blocker tight ends and the catching tight ends.

 

[721Comstock]

I agree I need to edit Bensons' offers. Mid Major and Very smart kid schools.

Plus the kid is tall, and VERY fast for his size, in addition to being very smart.

I'm sure the staff thinks they can coach him up over the next 1-2 years, and then he may become a solid contributor.
But if not - big, tall, fast guys are also needed on ST's.

 

[Trueblue25]

By the way, what do our peer group schools look like?

Id say at the moment its Maryland, Pitt, ISU, Indiana, Rutgers, Bc, South Florida, Kentucky, Wake .


What I expect it to be by 2019/2020 is NC St, Minnesota, WVU, UNC, Purdue, vandy, louisville, Iowa, Northwestern, KSU, etc.

 

[PhatOrange]

Id say at the moment its Maryland, Pitt, ISU, Indiana, Rutgers, Bc, South Florida, Kentucky, Wake .


What I expect it to be by 2019/2020 is NC St, Minnesota, WVU, UNC, Purdue, vandy, louisville, Iowa, Northwestern, KSU, etc.

What I meant, is throw away the stars,I’d be curious to go through the lists of their commit offers.

 

[Alsacs]

In Dino I trust.
Have zero worries about recruiting.

 

[Trueblue25]

Patiently waiting on the Blissett and Hubbard recruitments

 

[RF2044]

The OP is hardly an alarmist, and I think the intent behind this thread are a "fair" set of questions to pose.

Here's the way I see it.

Jackson is a stud recruit. Nunn has truly elite / blue chip offers.

The Canadian LB and TE are both camp kids that aren't highly rated. Might that change now that they are on the recruiting service radar screens? Possibly -- maybe they'll end up being three star recruits after being evaluated, maybe not. But they both appear to be above average athletes, and I'm confident when our staff makes camp offers -- they must have liked what they've seen from both of these prospects. So while I don't think either [as of right now] is going to move the needle with respect to our recruiting ranking, I do like the speed / athleticism of both of these guys.

We've had good luck with Florida defensive backs. Cole is slight of build, but I trust Monroe's eye for talent. He has P5 offers, too, so maybe he'll eventually get rated higher. You can never have enough dbacks with speed.

That leaves the two linemen. Here's my perspective -- a team like Syracuse is never going to recruit either OL or DT on par with the elite programs. Might we pull a guy here and there? Sure -- but even when Babers rights the ship, we're going to have to look at system fits in both trenches. That isn't necessarily a bad thing. Guys like Froumy, Red, and even a guy who's seen the field like Servais fit the profile Babers and staff are looking for. Tall, athletic, versatile, in shape, and capable of playing at a fast pace. If they continue to pull guys on the OL like the ones they've been bringing in, and if Red fits that mold, then I'm 100% fine with it.

Ditto Rondi. Seems like a bigger DE with some athleticism that we'll grow into a DT who then will have above average speed / athleticism for the position. Schools like Ohio State get NFL sized guys who check all of the boxes. We're almost never going to land recruits like that -- so instead we have to get athletic guys we can cultivate into quality DT -- kind of like Slayton or Bromley. Please note, I'm not suggesting that Rondi's talent is on par with either of those two, just that I see him as following that same formula.

Here's what I expect over the next few years. We get back to a bowl game this year, and that starts the ball rolling. It will no longer be faith without evidence, and our staff has turned the roster over, improved our size / speed, and has brought in QBs that will help keep our offense playing at a high level. The coaching staff will finally be able to sell something positive on the recruiting trail -- the on-field performance and video game like offensive stats -- and we're going to see an uptick with our recruiting at the offensive skilled positions. We're going to start landing more big play skilled talent. After some more success, we're going to start landing larger [in terms of physical stature] big play skilled talent. I also think that we're recruiting LBs that are athletic and have better size than what we're accustomed to. And the defensive backfield is loading up on athletes.

But on both sides of the ball, I don't expect us to ever consistently pull 4- or 5-star linemen. I think we're going to continue to identify guys who fit our system, and some [many?] of those guys will tend to be lower rated. If people point to how we're recruiting OL and DTs as the indicator of whether recruiting is going well or not, then they are probably going to be perpetually underwhelmed.

 

[RMH44]

Plus the kid is tall, and VERY fast for his size, in addition to being very smart.

I'm sure the staff thinks they can coach him up over the next 1-2 years, and then he may become a solid contributor.
But if not - big, tall, fast guys are also needed on ST's.

Benson might have a bunch of P5 offers once his season starts. You don't find many players (including Pierce) with that kind of size and speed combination. If he has good hands and is coachable our biggest problem might be holding onto him through signing day/

 

[cuse309]

...we were initially told that the reason for the general lack of early commits was b/c we had fewer available scholies this cycle and that we were being much more selective as a result.

We've now had several commits in the last couple of weeks. I don't in any way mean to be negative about those who have committed, always appreciate it when someone commits to the 'Cuse.

But the recruits we've signed don't scream 'super selective' to me. And we HAVE offered a lot of top-notch targets.

I'm ready to be proven wrong (again). And I DO trust Dino. But our class so far at least suggests that perhaps we've regrouped a bit when it comes to our targets. Not trying to be negative, but I'd like to get a sense from those more knowledgeable than me as to how they see our recruiting so far this cycle.

 

[CuseLegacy]

I can promise y'all that I will never be "that guy".

 

[sdhall01]

Benson might have a bunch of P5 offers once his season starts. You don't find many players (including Pierce) with that kind of size and speed combination. If he has good hands and is coachable our biggest problem might be holding onto him through signing day/

Exactly! Look, DeVito was a 2* without many big offers until after the elite 11. Trill was a low 3* until the middle of the last season. I’m not worried about these unranked kids. I’m especially not worried about unranked kids with these measurables.

 

[Symphony Steve]

OK, OK, I'll be proud to wear that tag if/when I ever get together with you for a tailgate.

 

[Ish88888]

I feel Dino and Dave know what they want out of a kid. Some of these kids are under the radar kids and will need time to develop but we have that now. For instance, Benson isn’t a Pierce type kid with exceptional abilities at receiving but he sure as hell can block his ars off and loves contact. I love them dudes. Reminds me of a Josh Pace comparison but in Football. Glue guy that does crap we need done but isn’t pretty. With the Lb we got, u can’t teach height. Both of these guys flashed as they say at camp with all coaches there so I’m trusting them and they have proved knowledgeable. Does it hurt our star rating, yeah but I’m ok with that. Would I rather have four and five star guys, sure when we start winning. Maybe these guys are targeted for special teams. We don’t know and won’t for a few years.

I don't think you can draft guys for special teams. Well, you can, but you will be out of a job quickly. Kids that play specials are your young highly recruited kids that need a kick in the ass to show their team commitment and that they are a fb player. Or, yes, thet are the marginal kid position wise that can work his tail off and show something.

I like Benson as an athlete and he is a nice safe recruit once you have your guys. Just not sure where he projects. Actually his best shot might be to hold his wgt and play wr, inside or hell even outside if he truly has hands. Do love his athletic ability and height. Then again, what do we have to go on? He caught 8 balls last year. Not being a wise guy but these schollies are valuable and we have less for 2019. Yea, the staff can bulk him to 250 but gaining 30+ lbs doe
snt guarantee maintenance of speed and athetic ability and hell, are we that hell bent on a big old school dual skill TE?

 

[shu 49]

I don’t mean a lot but I was told in Marrone era they will target a few. I’m not even sure that was what they thought about them. Just my uneducated guess. I hope we stay picky but I trust these guys. They seem to know talent.