Here is what I know (2nd hand - somewhat long)

[sutomcat]

Here is what I know (2nd hand good inside source). Plans for a practice facility was proposed 1st year HCDM was hired - this has been on the table for 4 years now. TGD is also a football first AD. The resistance to upgrade football facilities comes from the Board of Trustees many of whom are basketball homies and still can't believe football drives the bus. The football upgrades needed exceed $20 million. HCDM is extremely frustrated with the university administration.

Secondly Trustees are sticker shocked about how much they need to pay HCDM almost twice as much now to keep him - $2.5 million a year versus the $1.25 million they are paying him now. Long term negotiations broke down because HCDM wants a commitment from the SU for salary, facilities and contract. Trustees acting like Congress and can't agree on what to do - this whole thing will come down to the wire - this week probably - as SU Trustees are on their own "cliff" right now. They can't believe that the football coach will need to be paid so much more than their beloved JB.

We will see if SU Trustees comes through this week - source believes its not really HCDM or TGD as being the problem - the ball is currently in the chancellor & trustees court right now. All HCDM wants is to be paid a "competitive wage" like what Charlie Strong gets and he will stay. HCDM wants this now since we will going to ACC next year - money will be coming - and he feels the practice facility is necessary to remain competitive on the recruiting front and win more recruiting battles. Unfortunately, the "Melo" center is being used against us as our recruits are being told we are basketball first school - just look at practice facilities!

Honestly, I would not stay in my job if I didn't believe I was fully supported by my superiors, not given the tools to succeed and have opportunities to go elsewhere. I still think this job is HCDM's dream job but it seems he is really frustrated with SUs leadership meaning trustees. It is a real possibility that we lose HCDM this week if the trustees don't act and act soon.

What happens over the next 10 days will largely determine the future of Syracuse football for the next 10, 20 even 30 years.

The university needs to make a decision. Does it want to invest next to nothing in facilities and coaches, cash its checks from the ACC, make football a reliable cash cow with a low ceiling for additional earnings and live with playing home games in a near empty Dome/being a perennial doormat in football?

Or do they want to have a consistent winning program, a near full Dome, go to bowl games most every year and compete for conference and national championships?

IMHO, you can't go halfway on this. You either consciously decide not to try/become the Rutgers of the ACC or you go all in and try to be the best.

UL just had the same decision. They extended Strong for big dollars. UC just had a similar decision. They hired a big name and committed to making major infrastructure improvements.

It is more though than just extending DM's contract and giving him a sizable raise. If the decision is to go all in, the university needs to commit the money coming in from the move to the ACC to the athletic department. I think all DM is asking for is a commitment to allow football to be self sustaining.

The university had an excellent program that was a cash cow back in the Mac and early/mid Coach P eras. They chose to milk the profits and not invest them back into the program and soon the milk was gone.

The same thing happened with Schwartzwalder and the football program in the late 1950s/1960s. We had a great program, made a lot of money and didn't invest it in keeping the program competitive.

Is the university short sighted enough to drive the program to ruin a third time in 50 years?

We might as well know where things stand before we play a game in the ACC.

Those in power, please be forward thinking and aware of the past. Make the smart decision. All DM is asking is to invest the money the football program will be making in the football program. The good a successful football program does in terms of visibility, admissions, ability to raise funds, etc. is well documented. And the more the team wins, the more money comes in from bowl games, TV, gate revenues, concessions, seat licensing, merchandise licensing, etc.

This should be a no brainer...

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Bottom lines. The women's lax program is #1, but running in the red at a higher rate than is tolerable. I'm just using this as an example.

My understanding is that there are 4-5 programs on the hill that are losing money at a much greater rate than under Jake.

If you only go to the well to pay mhoops, lax and fb,it's an easy sell.

But don't you think that the more successful the athletic programs are from top to bottom, the better it is for the University. Anything that raises the profile of the school should help attract more quality students. No one wants to lose money, but isn't this a case where spending money should help generate additional income through tuition and donations.

 

[GoCuse44]

I could not agree more !!!!

Does Nancy have much leverage since she is leaving in 2014? How long before AD Gross leaves SU if the trustees don't make a commitment to Marrone and the football program?

 

[Fjoinkay]

The leadership at SU needs to accept reality even if they dislike reality. SU has positioned itself very well with a solid coach who played at SU and who gets SU and who bleeds Orange. The ACC chose SU over several other schools most likely with the belief that SU was willing to compete in the modern age of college athletics. SU is in a fortunate position compared to many other schools especially schools SU is leaving behind in the BE. The time is now to make the proper investments, and from what I can see no one is a bigger fan of SU football than JB. I'm pretty sure he gets it.

 

[SyracuseMiami]

What do we as Alumni and program donors need to do to affect thus with the BOT? Who do we need to contact and how do we get through to them. I've seen this type of thing in business and bad decision or not accepting the reality of the situation can have lasting negative impacts. Time for this BOT to commit the University to this sport.

Here is what I know (2nd hand good inside source). Plans for a practice facility was proposed 1st year HCDM was hired - this has been on the table for 4 years now. TGD is also a football first AD. The resistance to upgrade football facilities comes from the Board of Trustees many of whom are basketball homies and still can't believe football drives the bus. The football upgrades needed exceed $20 million. HCDM is extremely frustrated with the university administration.

Secondly Trustees are sticker shocked about how much they need to pay HCDM almost twice as much now to keep him - $2.5 million a year versus the $1.25 million they are paying him now. Long term negotiations broke down because HCDM wants a commitment from the SU for salary, facilities and contract. Trustees acting like Congress and can't agree on what to do - this whole thing will come down to the wire - this week probably - as SU Trustees are on their own "cliff" right now. They can't believe that the football coach will need to be paid so much more than their beloved JB.

We will see if SU Trustees comes through this week - source believes its not really HCDM or TGD as being the problem - the ball is currently in the chancellor & trustees court right now. All HCDM wants is to be paid a "competitive wage" like what Charlie Strong gets and he will stay. HCDM wants this now since we will going to ACC next year - money will be coming - and he feels the practice facility is necessary to remain competitive on the recruiting front and win more recruiting battles. Unfortunately, the "Melo" center is being used against us as our recruits are being told we are basketball first school - just look at practice facilities!

Honestly, I would not stay in my job if I didn't believe I was fully supported by my superiors, not given the tools to succeed and have opportunities to go elsewhere. I still think this job is HCDM's dream job but it seems he is really frustrated with SUs leadership meaning trustees. It is a real possibility that we lose HCDM this week if the trustees don't act and act soon.

 

[rrlbees]

Does the BOT really decide completely on facilities? At private schools, its usually donors who pay for the lions share. At state schools it is a lot of state money. They are pointing at the Melo center? How much did SU itself really pay to get the Melo center built?

Does Oregon have what it has because of the University of Oregon? Anyone ever hear of Burton at UConn?

The football facility went to the back burner because donations towards it weren't enough.

When SU moves to South Campus will SU be footing the bill?

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[orangenirvana]

Thanks chakka.

It's not the fan support (or lack thereof)...it's the stupid administration.

I don't blame Marrone one bit for leaving. Sad. Hope we all enjoyed that bowl win. Might be the last for a while.

 

[GoCuse44]

What do we as Alumni and program donors need to do to affect thus with the BOT? Who do we need to contact and how do we get through to them. I've seen this type of thing in business and bad decision or not accepting the reality of the situation can have lasting negative impacts. Time for this BOT to commit the University to this sport.

I would greatly appreciate an email address so I can express my displeasure to the BOT. My wife and I are pathfinder donors to the university but if the BOT is not going to support the football team then its time for us to consider other options in terms of donations.

 

[JJReddawg]

I would greatly appreciate an email address so I can express my displeasure to the BOT. My wife and I are pathfinder donors to the university but if the BOT is not going to support the football team then its time for us to consider other options in terms of donations.

https://trustees.syr.edu/Public/_la...f00&View=cf5e913a-5d1d-4aba-ba4b-c412b1c34ed1

 

[OttosBestFriend]

My understanding is that there are 4-5 programs on the hill that are losing money at a much greater rate than under Jake.

How are overall athletic department donations compared to "under Jake" ???

How does the future of incoming revenue (TV/Conference affiliation, etc.) look compared to "Under Jake" ??

How is the product on the field (all sports) compared to "Under Jake" ??

Everyone "wants their cake...", but you often can't have it both ways.

Either you spend money on sports or you decide it's not worth it and simply become Emory, NYU, etc...

And the FACT is, a more prominent athletic football program attracts more applicants to the University which, in turn, allows admissions to be more selective which, as a result, can raise SU's overall ranking.

Every year 'Cuse hoops makes the Final 4, there's a spike in admissions. And I know for a fact that undefeated '87-88 football team led to an admissions spike if only because I was in that following freshman class - the largest ever at the time.

One that led to fall '89 frosh like myself living in converted lounges all over campus.

Good football makes for a better school - whether the BOT wants to believe it or not.

 

[GoCuse44]

I e-mailed AD Gross to advise him that as a pathfinder donor to the university I am disappointed with the Board of Trustees (BOT) lack of support of the football program and the actions of the BOT (with regards to the football program) will impact our decision whether we should make charitable contributions to the university. Not sure if it will do much good but maybe a flood of emails regarding this matter may convince the BOT to invest in the SU football program. Send an e-mail to to show your support of the football program.

 

[chakka3421]

Does the BOT really decide completely on facilities? At private schools, its usually donors who pay for the lions share. At state schools it is a lot of state money. They are pointing at the Melo center? How much did SU itself really pay to get the Melo center built?

Does Oregon have what it has because of the University of Oregon? Anyone ever hear of Burton at UConn?

The football facility went to the back burner because donations towards it weren't enough.

When SU moves to South Campus will SU be footing the bill?

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Ah ha Bees - I think you correctly identified the problem. Since the SU Athletic department does not have the money to expand facilities, where must they go to get approval - BoT. The other choice is to wait until the ACC money comes in, save enough of it, the build the facilities 3-4 years down the road.

My (limited) understanding is that HCDM wants it built now, not 4-5 years from now, so that he can compete now on recruiting while we are on the upswing - look EBO choice is between Clemson and SU - who has the better facilities - Clemson wins hands down.

 

[Millhouse]

How are overall athletic department donations compared to "under Jake" ???

How does the future of incoming revenue (TV/Conference affiliation, etc.) look compared to "Under Jake" ??

How is the product on the field (all sports) compared to "Under Jake" ??

Everyone "wants their cake...", but you often can't have it both ways.

Either you spend money on sports or you decide it's not worth it and simply become Emory, NYU, etc...

And the FACT is, a more prominent athletic football program attracts more applicants to the University which, in turn, allows admissions to be more selective which, as a result, can raise SU's overall ranking.

Every year 'Cuse hoops makes the Final 4, there's a spike in admissions. And I know for a fact that undefeated '87-88 football team led to an admissions spike if only because I was in that following freshman class - the largest ever at the time.

One that led to fall '89 frosh like myself living in converted lounges all over campus.

Good football makes for a better school - whether the BOT wants to believe it or not.

That clown Cantor created her own spike in admissions by admitting anyone who applies. Sports related admissions spikes are moot, unfortunately, she already filled all the seats with students that used to get rejected

 

[SURules]

If the BOT doesn't make the commitment that the ACC expects, then we maybe the Temple of the ops BigEast as we might not be in the ACC very long. Welcome MAC for all sports. Either the school is committed or it isn't continually building the Athletic Dept. / football or it isn't. Welcome MAC possibly if they don't invest.

 

[SURules]

I just typed that on the iPhone LOL. After reading it again, I should have waited for a real key board

 

[rrlbees]

Ah ha Bees - I think you correctly identified the problem. Since the SU Athletic department does not have the money to expand facilities, where must they go to get approval - BoT. The other choice is to wait until the ACC money comes in, save enough of it, the build the facilities 3-4 years down the road.

My (limited) understanding is that HCDM wants it built now, not 4-5 years from now, so that he can compete now on recruiting while we are on the upswing - look EBO choice is between Clemson and SU - who has the better facilities - Clemson wins hands down.

How many schools spend their own money they don't have to build facilities?

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[CuseLegacy]

I e-mailed AD Gross to advise him that as a pathfinder donor to the university I am disappointed with the Board of Trustees (BOT) lack of support of the football program and the actions of the BOT (with regards to the football program) will impact our decision whether we should make charitable contributions to the university. Not sure if it will do much good but maybe a flood of emails regarding this matter may convince the BOT to invest in the SU football program. Send an e-mail to to show your support of the football program.

https://trustees.syr.edu/Public/SitePages/office/orourke.aspx

You might try e-mailing Lil O'Rourke and ask her to forward on your concerns. She is the Secretary to the BOT and an SU alum.

 

[rrlbees]

If the BOT doesn't make the commitment that the ACC expects, then we maybe the Temple of the ops BigEast as we might not be in the ACC very long. Welcome MAC for all sports. Either the school is committed or it isn't continually building the Athletic Dept. / football or it isn't. Welcome MAC possibly if they don't invest.

Did people miss the thread about school budgets and expenditures? We stood pretty good compared to our peers in the BE and ACC.

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[chakka3421]

How many schools spend their own money they don't have to build facilities?

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At this point in the game, SUTomcat is right. What happens over the next 10 days will determine where we are as a football program over the next 10 years. Your point is moot given the circumstances.

 

[rrlbees]

I e-mailed AD Gross to advise him that as a pathfinder donor to the university I am disappointed with the Board of Trustees (BOT) lack of support of the football program and the actions of the BOT (with regards to the football program) will impact our decision whether we should make charitable contributions to the university. Not sure if it will do much good but maybe a flood of emails regarding this matter may convince the BOT to invest in the SU football program. Send an e-mail to to show your support of the football program.

I don't believe the problem is the BOT but the fact there aren't enough of you and other type donors.

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[chakka3421]

https://trustees.syr.edu/Public/SitePages/office/orourke.aspx

You might try e-mailing Lil O'Rourke and ask her to forward on your concerns. She is the Secretary to the BOT and an SU alum.

I don't think TGD is at the heart of the problem - if I hear anything more I will update, my source has suddenly gone silent.

 

[chakka3421]

I don't believe the problem is the BOT but the fact there aren't enough of you and other type donors.

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I simply don't agree - look at all of the new construction going on at the campus. And yet, we cannot allocate money to build a practice football facility. It doesn't add up in my book.

 

[orangenauburn]

The university is flush with cash - however it is allocated elsewhere and not directed for athletics

 

[Scooch]

I don't believe the problem is the BOT but the fact there aren't enough of you and other type donors.

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Do we have a single BIG-time donor to the football program? Like the kind of Burton-esque sugar daddy UConn has? It's always been baffling to me that SU has such a slew of fantastically wealthy alums who have donated lots of money to the school for academic purposes (think David Falk) and yet we haven't been able to convince one to throw multi-millions at the football program.

That being said, if there is indeed a leverage play at work by Marrone and Gross then that's great. Honestly I think a huge failing of P and Jake was not doing something similar back in the 90s. Maybe it wouldn't have worked, but they were company men who just let the admin suck all the money out of their program without putting up a public fight.

 

[GoSU96]

Did people miss the thread about school budgets and expenditures? We stood pretty good compared to our peers in the BE and ACC.

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That's what makes some of this surprising. The athletic department is up a great deal in revenues even before the ACC dollars. That's why I assumed that people saying that the extension was in place were correct.

I'm not even sure that Marrone would require to see the dollars committed today, just a real plan that is worked to get the facilities in place.

And I sure he wants a commitment on staff salaries as well.

On the other hand don't discount the amount he's been hurt by some of the things that have happened here that have had him thinking about going back to the NFL for awhile.