Here is what I know (2nd hand - somewhat long)

[Scooch]

That's what makes some of this surprising. The athletic department is up a great deal in revenues even before the ACC dollars. That's why I assumed that people saying that the extension was in place were correct.

I'm not even sure that Marrone would require to see the dollars committed today, just a real plan that is worked to get the facilities in place.

And I sure he wants a commitment on staff salaries as well.

On the other hand don't discount the amount he's been hurt by some of the things that have happened here that have had him thinking about going back to the NFL for awhile.

Is the "hurt" the fanbase stuff, or the $$$ stuff?

One thing I'd be VERY worried about if I were an NFL team considering Marrone for HC gig... the guy wears his stress on his sleeve. He looked and acted absolutely miserable at the ends of the 2010 and 2011 seasons. And that's in Syracuse, which from a pressure standpoint is a relatively easy place to coach. I'd really hate to see how he reacts to being 2-7 in season #2 in Cleveland.

 

[GoCuse44]

I e-mailed AD Gross to advise him that as a pathfinder donor to the university I am disappointed with the Board of Trustees (BOT) lack of support of the football program and the actions of the BOT (with regards to the football program) will impact our decision whether we should make charitable contributions to the university. Not sure if it will do much good but maybe a flood of emails regarding this matter may convince the BOT to invest in the SU football program. Send an e-mail to to show your support of the football program.

Here is the reply I received to my e-mail about the BOT which included the initial post to start this discussion: "This is simply not true."

 

[Scooch]

Here is the reply I received to my e-mail about the BOT which included the initial post to start this discussion: "This is simply not true."

Smoke! Fire!

 

[HarrisonJBounel]

I didn't go through the whole thread, and I'm sure this idea isn't new, but if we need $20 million or so for a practice facility, it would be nice to get a large commitment (say $2mm-$3mm) from Donovan McNabb, and give him the naming rights, similar to Melo and the bball facility.

 

[rrlbees]

I simply don't agree - look at all of the new construction going on at the campus. And yet, we cannot allocate money to build a practice football facility. It doesn't add up in my book.

That's not how things work. Again, show me a school that uses all of their own money to build facilities. Colleges are academic institutions and school monies from academic donors and student fees, tuition etc go to academics. Athletic departments are pretty much designed to be self sufficient.

Now if there is a small shortfall, then yea I can see a school footing the bill but schools don't usually toss out tens of millions of dollars to build a sports facility.

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[chakka3421]

Here is the reply I received to my e-mail about the BOT which included the initial post to start this discussion: "This is simply not true."

What else can they say? But remember I am not on the BoT (and my info is second hand) either but see "actions" speak LOUDER than words. The proposal for a new practice facility has been on the table for the last 4 years with no commitment that it will ever be built.

Maybe they can answer that question and put their money where their mouth is.

 

[rrlbees]

Do we have a single BIG-time donor to the football program? Like the kind of Burton-esque sugar daddy UConn has? It's always been baffling to me that SU has such a slew of fantastically wealthy alums who have donated lots of money to the school for academic purposes (think David Falk) and yet we haven't been able to convince one to throw multi-millions at the football program.

That being said, if there is indeed a leverage play at work by Marrone and Gross then that's great. Honestly I think a huge failing of P and Jake was not doing something similar back in the 90s. Maybe it wouldn't have worked, but they were company men who just let the admin suck all the money out of their program without putting up a public fight.

You just said it. Huge academic supporters like Falk. That's academic money to be used for academics, not diverted to athletics.

Where Jake and P screwed up wasn't by not making demands but for allowing the school to play games with the athletic revenues.

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[oldpinepoint]

I have not seen the budget for the university or athletics but a couple of thoughts. If the athletic department is cash flow positive then what is being done with the excess funds? Are they going Back into the University GF? Second you have increased revenues from the ACC TV contract that will only add to the additional cash flow. What is their plan, 3 and 5 years. IMO the athletic department should be self sustaining and all profits or excess cash flow should plowed back into the department.

As far the fan base, they need to support the FB team, and i think they will with winning. Syracuse has always been a fair weather town.

 

[Orangello]

DM is spot on here. We all know that the University has not made the significant investments in FB that are necessary to compete with the Jone's. The time to make the statement is right now, when the program is on the right track and we are transitioning from the BE to the Big Boy Table. This also tells me very clearly that this issue is hurting us in recruiting and may in fact be the single largest obstacle this staff believes it faces in reeling in the 4 and 5 stars.

Having said all of that, make the dang comittment and then start a capital campaign to raise at least 50-65% of the funds needed.

 

[Orangepace]

I have not seen the budget for the university or athletics but a couple of thoughts. If the athletic department is cash flow positive then what is being done with the excess funds? Are they going Back into the University GF? Second you have increased revenues from the ACC TV contract that will only add to the additional cash flow. What is their plan, 3 and 5 years. IMO the athletic department should be self sustaining and all profits or excess cash flow should plowed back into the department.

As far the fan base, they need to support the FB team, and i think they will with winning. Syracuse has always been a fair weather town.

If the excess are to be reinvested, financing for construction of a football facility could be had relatively easy and cheap. Assuming A&E is only through concept stages, these two paths could run parallel and construction could easily begin on a practice facility in late summer.

 

[GoCuse44]

What else can they say? But remember I am not on the BoT (and my info is second hand) either but see "actions" speak LOUDER than words. The proposal for a new practice facility has been on the table for the last 4 years with no commitment that it will ever be built.

Maybe they can answer that question and put their money where their mouth is.

I am not doubting what your source told you but I thought it was only fair give both sides of the story.

I wish the new year started off on a more positive note with the commitment of EO as opposed to talk of the coach leaving for the NFL and BOT not supporting the football program.

 

[rrlbees]

DM is spot on here. We all know that the University has not made the significant investments in FB that are necessary to compete with the Jone's.

To keep up with the Jone's you need a Jones.

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[oldpinepoint]

To keep up with the Jone's you need a Jones.

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Its nice to have large donors but its not necessary.

 

[HarrisonJBounel]

Here is what I know (2nd hand good inside source). Plans for a practice facility was proposed 1st year HCDM was hired - this has been on the table for 4 years now. TGD is also a football first AD. The resistance to upgrade football facilities comes from the Board of Trustees many of whom are basketball homies and still can't believe football drives the bus. The football upgrades needed exceed $20 million. HCDM is extremely frustrated with the university administration.

Secondly Trustees are sticker shocked about how much they need to pay HCDM almost twice as much now to keep him - $2.5 million a year versus the $1.25 million they are paying him now. Long term negotiations broke down because HCDM wants a commitment from the SU for salary, facilities and contract. Trustees acting like Congress and can't agree on what to do - this whole thing will come down to the wire - this week probably - as SU Trustees are on their own "cliff" right now. They can't believe that the football coach will need to be paid so much more than their beloved JB.

We will see if SU Trustees comes through this week - source believes its not really HCDM or TGD as being the problem - the ball is currently in the chancellor & trustees court right now. All HCDM wants is to be paid a "competitive wage" like what Charlie Strong gets and he will stay. HCDM wants this now since we will going to ACC next year - money will be coming - and he feels the practice facility is necessary to remain competitive on the recruiting front and win more recruiting battles. Unfortunately, the "Melo" center is being used against us as our recruits are being told we are basketball first school - just look at practice facilities!

Honestly, I would not stay in my job if I didn't believe I was fully supported by my superiors, not given the tools to succeed and have opportunities to go elsewhere. I still think this job is HCDM's dream job but it seems he is really frustrated with SUs leadership meaning trustees. It is a real possibility that we lose HCDM this week if the trustees don't act and act soon.

Your source may be right, but I would find this difficult to believe in light of the fact that the BOT presumably reviewed and approved the move to the ACC, and were fully aware of the relative revenue impacts of both basketball and football.

 

[OburgOrange]

To keep up with the Jone's you need a Jones.

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Time to step up Bees!

 

[oldpinepoint]

Your source may be right, but I would find this difficult to believe in light of the fact that the BOT presumably reviewed and approved the move to the ACC, and were fully aware of the relative revenue impacts of both basketball and football.

Depends on how the university system is set up. They might see the excess $$$ and want to milk it dry and move the money to a different part of the university.

 

[rrlbees]

What else can they say? But remember I am not on the BoT (and my info is second hand) either but see "actions" speak LOUDER than words. The proposal for a new practice facility has been on the table for the last 4 years with no commitment that it will ever be built.

Maybe they can answer that question and put their money where their mouth is.

Again, the facility was put on the back burner because there was not enough funding obtained.

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[kingottoiii]

I have not seen the budget for the university or athletics but a couple of thoughts. If the athletic department is cash flow positive then what is being done with the excess funds? Are they going Back into the University GF? Second you have increased revenues from the ACC TV contract that will only add to the additional cash flow. What is their plan, 3 and 5 years. IMO the athletic department should be self sustaining and all profits or excess cash flow should plowed back into the department.

As far the fan base, they need to support the FB team, and i think they will with winning. Syracuse has always been a fair weather town.

Just to play devils advocate there is no guarantee that the ACC money will be around for longer than next year. I think the ACC sticks together and the chances of the ACC being gutted are slim, but that could play a part in spending future money now. If the AD borrowed money now to build the FB facility we would easily be able to pay it off in 5 years. But wouldn't it be irresponsible to spend the next 5 years money now not knowing if the money will be coming in past 2013?

 

[Orangepace]

I am not doubting what your source told you but I thought it was only fair give both sides of the story.

I wish the new year started off on a more positive note with the commitment of EO as opposed to talk of the coach leaving for the NFL and BOT not supporting the football program.

There has to be something serious happening behind the scenes though.. HCDM has been quiet about a lot of things. Why wouldn't he have asked the NFL execs to keep it quiet considering the number of recruits in the process of committing this week, Ebo, Laray, etc..

This NFL thing must have legs or he'd make a public statement this morning. He hasn't setup a press conference and as such I ascertain he must not have what he wants currently to get his job done here, be it salary or facility related. I hope that this is a leverage play, because I fear the alternative.

 

[rrlbees]

Time to step up Bees!

Lol.

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[oldpinepoint]

Again, the facility was put on the back burner because there was not enough funding obtained.

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Is it SU policy to wait until 100% of the construction cost is in hand before they build anything. I mean just finance the ing thing. It isnt rocket science.

 

[HarrisonJBounel]

Just to play devils advocate there is no guarantee that the ACC money will be around for longer than next year. I think the ACC sticks together and the chances of the ACC being gutted are slim, but that could play a part in spending future money now. If the AD borrowed money now to build the FB facility we would easily be able to pay it off in 5 years. But wouldn't it be irresponsible to spend the next 5 years money now not knowing if the money will be coming in past 2013?

Are you saying that SU may be out of the ACC within one year?

 

[supp]

I have a hard time believing a salary bump to $2.5 million is an issue here. After all, the BOT was willing to pay Edsall and Holtz something approaching that right from the get-go. Slow-playing facilities upgrades, I could go along with but if Marrone is getting fidgety I doubt BOT intransigence is the only reason.

 

[oldpinepoint]

Just to play devils advocate there is no guarantee that the ACC money will be around for longer than next year. I think the ACC sticks together and the chances of the ACC being gutted are slim, but that could play a part in spending future money now. If the AD borrowed money now to build the FB facility we would easily be able to pay it off in 5 years. But wouldn't it be irresponsible to spend the next 5 years money now not knowing if the money will be coming in past 2013?

You make a very good point and im sure that is a consideration. But if SUA is indeed making a profit i would imagine they have been saving the $$$$ for a rainy deal. If its the university policy to move the excess funds to the GF then that is just dumb and short sighted.

 

[supp]

Is it SU policy to wait until 100% of the construction cost is in hand before they build anything. I mean just finance the ******* thing. It isnt rocket science.

No, usually no university waits for all the funding to roll in to begin construction on major facility upgrades. But it may be that they have already taken on too much debt to start this project before they get a major naming gift. And you can't just point to the other construction on campus and say that they're neglecting football. The fact is that we don't have someone stepping up with a major gift for the indoor facility like we do for the law school addition, etc.