Honeymoon Over

[dasher]

I actually think the min is 5 years. It really took Mac longer and he wasn't in one of the two toughest divisions in football. This was hard to take the last three weeks. For all of us. But even though we were 4-8 again, we were better this year. And the recruiting is a bit better as well. It's going to take time. Football isn't basketball where one guy can change everything. I think this guy can get us there. If after 5 years we are still 4-8, then we can talk.

 

[JeffCuse]

I'm still keeping the faith. But...

If he's 4-8 or worse again next year I'm off the bandwagon. I'll even take 5-7 as a sign of progress. 5 years is way too long if we are not seeing at least incremental W-L improvements.

If this team was beating the creampuffs and the middling schools, and losing to the elite schools, then I'd actually be MORE inclined to buy the argument that he is getting the most of what he has and just doesnt quite have the horses. But to beat a team like Clemson, and then fall to teams like MTSU and Wake, and get embarrassed by a meh BC team at home on Senior Day. That speaks to a larger array of issues. Yes injuries are a factor. But some really really shaky coaching decisions are a factor as well. I mean I still want to scream at the failure to call any tiemouts when our D was gassed down the stretch there.

I like Dino, a lot. And I have forced myself to not be overreactive to a disappointing season. I really hope we get to 6 wins next year because then i think he gets his 5+ years to really build this thing up. But he needs to take that next step for me.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

Next year’s bye week will likely be in September, which will probably make it worse. We have no games on Sep 15 and Sep 22, I doubt the ACC will be scheduling league games for us on both weeekends.

I did the math a few weeks ago. BC, Pitt, and Florida State have openings the weekend of September 15. Louisville, Pitt, and UNC are all available the weekend of September 22. I don't think the league will give Cuse a bye in September.

 

[Chip]

I did the math a few weeks ago. BC, Pitt, and Florida State have openings the weekend of September 15. Louisville, Pitt, and UNC are all available the weekend of September 22. I don't think the league will give Cuse a bye in September.

I missed that, good info thanks.

Hopefully we’ll get Pitt or BC early of that group so we don’t have to front load all of our home games.

 

[PhatOrange]

I did the math a few weeks ago. BC, Pitt, and Florida State have openings the weekend of September 15. Louisville, Pitt, and UNC are all available the weekend of September 22. I don't think the league will give Cuse a bye in September.

regarding scheduling. I noticed a few of power teams all had their 1AA games late. A weekend or 2 ago. I think this is something to explore. While I see the advantage of an opening game patsy to act as a warmup I wonder if having the game late is more of a benefit. Not that it acts as a late season bye week but it could enable backups to play, front line kids to heal up more instead of rushing them back in, and fine tuning things that need work. just a thought.

 

[MSOrange]

regarding scheduling. I noticed a few of power teams all had their 1AA games late. A weekend or 2 ago. I think this is something to explore. While I see the advantage of an opening game patsy to act as a warmup I wonder if having the game late is more of a benefit. Not that it acts as a late season bye week but it could enable backups to play, front line kids to heal up more instead of rushing them back in, and fine tuning things that need work. just a thought.

Most SEC teams does this. Not sure how widespread it is among other conferences but I like the idea if we can work it.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Most SEC teams does this. Not sure how widespread it is among other conferences but I like the idea if we can work it.

Most SEC teams play "Southern based" FCS schools.

We play Northeast FCS schools. Not sure we'll find someone with an opening in November.

 

[PhatOrange]

Most SEC teams does this. Not sure how widespread it is among other conferences but I like the idea if we can work it.

and Clemson played the Citadel last weekend. 3 different QBs played. 9 different guys got a carry and 15 different players caught a pass. 31 players in the defensive box score.

Here's an interesting tidbit. They had 72 players on their Citadel participation report and then followed that up with 49 players against South Carolina.

I'm not fact checking our participation report but here is ours from some selected games.

29 - BC
31 - MTSU
43 - Central CT St

Nah we don't have a talent/depth issue. None at all.

 

[NKR1978]

My honeymoon with him is 5 years.

 

[CuseLifer11]

I did the math a few weeks ago. BC, Pitt, and Florida State have openings the weekend of September 15. Louisville, Pitt, and UNC are all available the weekend of September 22. I don't think the league will give Cuse a bye in September.

I would place alot of money on Pitt/FSU Sept 14th (Friday night) and a bye week on the 22nd. That's just how it is.

As for peiple wanting Dino gone... LOLOLOLOLOLOL. Get a grip.

Dungey is a top 10 qb in America. The drop off after him is immense. He is our heart and soul. How has Green Bay done since Rodgers got hurt... or more to the point, how did FSU do when their qb went down (And they have a slew of 4 and 5 star back up qbs)??

 

[SoBristol]

I'm still keeping the faith. But...

If he's 4-8 or worse again next year ...

I like Dino, a lot. And I have forced myself to not be overreactive to a disappointing season. I really hope we get to 6 wins next year because then i think he gets his 5+ years to really build this thing up. But he needs to take that next step for me.

This is the likely consensus. Disappointing, but in October some definite signs of improvement. More important than W/L in year 2: Dino is a great guy and an ideal face for the program and an asset for SU when he can get on ESPN or when he goes on the road to alumni events. He can find help (AET last season, Pierce and Robinson this season) and he can lift normal recruiting with prospects like DeVito and the OL prospects. His offense has some issues but it can be exciting for fans and fits the advantages of the Dome.

That is a lot to like. The wins will come when the two deep is stronger and better. That is basic but it is the truth. More than how 2017 ended, it is about Dino's 2018 class and then the 2019 class.

 

[orangecuse]

and a lot more practices these young kids need to get better!!!

This gets thrown around a lot, but I wonder in the end how much of a 'measurable' difference it truly makes. How many more practices are we talking about, 15? This team has been practicing day in and day out since August. The play on the field over the last 3 weeks has been atrocious, not to mention against the likes of Wake, UL & BC, supposedly our peers. It's likely better for the kids to take a break, and just reset their minds. Get themselves healed mentally, work on their bodies over the winter, etc. and hit the spring practices hard. For me, the reward of a good season is the bowl game, not more practices per se. Just my humble $.02.

 

[gbo]

and Clemson played the Citadel last weekend. 3 different QBs played. 9 different guys got a carry and 15 different players caught a pass. 31 players in the defensive box score.

Here's an interesting tidbit. They had 72 players on their Citadel participation report and then followed that up with 49 players against South Carolina.

I'm not fact checking our participation report but here is ours from some selected games.

Nah we don't have a talent/depth issue. None at all.

29 - BC
31 - MTSU
43 - Central CT St

We played 94 guys against the Citadel, 74 before halftime. Otherwise you are spot on about depth being an issue with Cuse. It will take time for that to be corrected, certainly more than 3 years.

 

[storange]

I would place alot of money on Pitt/FSU Sept 14th (Friday night) and a bye week on the 22nd. That's just how it is.

As for peiple wanting Dino gone... LOLOLOLOLOLOL. Get a grip.

Dungey is a top 10 qb in America. The drop off after him is immense. He is our heart and soul. How has Green Bay done since Rodgers got hurt... or more to the point, how did FSU do when their qb went down (And they have a slew of 4 and 5 star back up qbs)??

Lets clear this up. I didn't call for Dino to be gone.

 

[orangecuse]

We played 94 guys against the Citadel, 74 before halftime. Otherwise you are spot on about depth being an issue with Cuse. It will take time for that to be corrected, certainly more than 3 years.

You are a friendly foe here, however, you know deep down, if you're being 100% transparent, you have to be wondering how did we ever lose to that team. After VT last year, Dabo certainly 'had to know.'

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

Lets clear this up. I didn't call for Dino to be gone.

I don't read every thread/post, but I am not sure anyone has called for that (not sure where cuselifer got that from). The debate has pretty much exclusively been whether to extend Babers at this time or not.

 

[Scooch]

The honeymoon was bound to end for a lot of folks this year due to our ridiculously difficult schedule. I thought we had a very narrow path to a bowl, and it necessitated starting 3-0, splitting NC State/Pitt, and beating both Wake and BC. Needless to say we couldn't walk that tightrope.

Finishing the year on a 5 game losing streak was terribly disappointing, but not exactly unprecedented. It was just back in 2011 when SU was 5-2 and coming off a big prime time win against WVU, and then we proceeded to drop the last five. We followed that up with a very solid 2012 season and I think 2017 --> 2018 can yield a similar story.

The 2018 is much more manageable: we should be able to go at least 3-1 OOC and get UNC at home as our Coastal game. That means needing to find 2 more wins to get bowl eligible, and with NC State/Louisville at home, and Wake/BC/Pitt on the road, our path is not nearly as perilous as it was this season.

I think there are two critical things for the offseason: (1) build depth defensively and figure out how to force turnovers, (2) find an offensive skill position difference maker not named Dungey and figure out how to convert in the red zone.

To me the two most disappointing stats this year were related to those two needs:

(A) Our points per game (76th) was ranked ludicrously far behind our yards per game (23rd). In fact, only one team among the 130 in FBS had a bigger differential between YPG and PPG... UConn (45th in YPG, 102nd in PPG). That's horrendous efficiency and our inability to convert in the red zone was crippling.

(B) We ranked 113th for turnovers gained. 113th. We are not nearly good enough to overcome creating so few turnovers.

I'm still fully on board Team Dino. I truly believe that if he can't be successful here then we may all need to accept that we'll never return to the status we held in the 90s. I do think next year is a crucial one, and that it's a very bad sign if we don't win at least 6.

I'm optimistic though. Dino has a track record of being thoughtful and I expect him to take a hard look at what transpired this season and make many meaningful changes.

 

[Cuseman78]

(B) We ranked 113th for turnovers gained. 113th. We are not nearly good enough to overcome creating so few turnovers.

Good post. On your point on TO's, we didn't have an Interception in conference play. I'm not sure how that's even possible. Only 4 all year, with the last being against LSU. Certainly TO margin is something we need to see improved going into next year.

 

[Millhouse]

I would place alot of money on Pitt/FSU Sept 14th (Friday night) and a bye week on the 22nd. That's just how it is.

As for peiple wanting Dino gone... LOLOLOLOLOLOL. Get a grip.

Dungey is a top 10 qb in America. The drop off after him is immense. He is our heart and soul. How has Green Bay done since Rodgers got hurt... or more to the point, how did FSU do when their qb went down (And they have a slew of 4 and 5 star back up qbs)??

just because mahoney is a walkon that no one recruited for good reason doesn't make dungey top 10 in america

he's 86th in passer rating, he's under 60% completion even though there are a ton of easy screens

his running moves him up but come on

 

[Millhouse]

The honeymoon was bound to end for a lot of folks this year due to our ridiculously difficult schedule. I thought we had a very narrow path to a bowl, and it necessitated starting 3-0, splitting NC State/Pitt, and beating both Wake and BC. Needless to say we couldn't walk that tightrope.

Finishing the year on a 5 game losing streak was terribly disappointing, but not exactly unprecedented. It was just back in 2011 when SU was 5-2 and coming off a big prime time win against WVU, and then we proceeded to drop the last five. We followed that up with a very solid 2012 season and I think 2017 --> 2018 can yield a similar story.

The 2018 is much more manageable: we should be able to go at least 3-1 OOC and get UNC at home as our Coastal game. That means needing to find 2 more wins to get bowl eligible, and with NC State/Louisville at home, and Wake/BC/Pitt on the road, our path is not nearly as perilous as it was this season.

I think there are two critical things for the offseason: (1) build depth defensively and figure out how to force turnovers, (2) find an offensive skill position difference maker not named Dungey and figure out how to convert in the red zone.

To me the two most disappointing stats this year were related to those two needs:

(A) Our points per game (76th) was ranked ludicrously far behind our yards per game (23rd). In fact, only one team among the 130 in FBS had a bigger differential between YPG and PPG... UConn (45th in YPG, 102nd in PPG). That's horrendous efficiency and our inability to convert in the red zone was crippling.

(B) We ranked 113th for turnovers gained. 113th. We are not nearly good enough to overcome creating so few turnovers.

I'm still fully on board Team Dino. I truly believe that if he can't be successful here then we may all need to accept that we'll never return to the status we held in the 90s. I do think next year is a crucial one, and that it's a very bad sign if we don't win at least 6.

I'm optimistic though. Dino has a track record of being thoughtful and I expect him to take a hard look at what transpired this season and make many meaningful changes.

i bet ppg is better correlated to yards per play than yards per game.

i think converting so many fourth downs turned punts into FGs and helped the yards per game but when you're 95th in yards per play, you are going to be bad at scoring TDs

turnovers are mostly luck (or bad luck) but when you're 112th in yards per play defense, that means there are just too many plays that are too easy for opposing offenses. there are just so many plays where there's no chance at a turnover, terrible choices by DEs and safeties = wide open receivers and easy read options

 

[IthacaBarrel]

The honeymoon was bound to end for a lot of folks this year due to our ridiculously difficult schedule. I thought we had a very narrow path to a bowl, and it necessitated starting 3-0, splitting NC State/Pitt, and beating both Wake and BC. Needless to say we couldn't walk that tightrope.

Finishing the year on a 5 game losing streak was terribly disappointing, but not exactly unprecedented. It was just back in 2011 when SU was 5-2 and coming off a big prime time win against WVU, and then we proceeded to drop the last five. We followed that up with a very solid 2012 season and I think 2017 --> 2018 can yield a similar story.

The 2018 is much more manageable: we should be able to go at least 3-1 OOC and get UNC at home as our Coastal game. That means needing to find 2 more wins to get bowl eligible, and with NC State/Louisville at home, and Wake/BC/Pitt on the road, our path is not nearly as perilous as it was this season.

I think there are two critical things for the offseason: (1) build depth defensively and figure out how to force turnovers, (2) find an offensive skill position difference maker not named Dungey and figure out how to convert in the red zone.

To me the two most disappointing stats this year were related to those two needs:

(A) Our points per game (76th) was ranked ludicrously far behind our yards per game (23rd). In fact, only one team among the 130 in FBS had a bigger differential between YPG and PPG... UConn (45th in YPG, 102nd in PPG). That's horrendous efficiency and our inability to convert in the red zone was crippling.

(B) We ranked 113th for turnovers gained. 113th. We are not nearly good enough to overcome creating so few turnovers.

I'm still fully on board Team Dino. I truly believe that if he can't be successful here then we may all need to accept that we'll never return to the status we held in the 90s. I do think next year is a crucial one, and that it's a very bad sign if we don't win at least 6.

I'm optimistic though. Dino has a track record of being thoughtful and I expect him to take a hard look at what transpired this season and make many meaningful changes.

That's the way I look at it as well and why I am willing to hang in with Dino until the bitter end, looking at the chaos of current coaching searches it isn't something as a fan I never look forward to anymore. Marrone had the solid 2nd season but the injuries did us in year 3, struggled early year 4 until Pugh came back and the thing took off. There will be a defining moment of when things start to role, I truly believe that. It's just going to take longer than most had hoped for, maybe 4-5 years, IMO. I truly believe in what Dino is doing but to me the alternative isn't a very good one at all... Wash, rinse, repeat doesn't work.

And again, I am way way way more worried about scoring more points and getting some big plays on a consistent basis than I am the defense. It's the key to winning consistently, I believe. IF Dino doesn't get it done, I will sort of go to the belief that it will take a football genius to ever turn Syracuse around which finding and being able to hire said coach will take an absolute miracle.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

just because mahoney is a walkon that no one recruited for good reason doesn't make dungey top 10 in america

he's 86th in passer rating, he's under 60% completion even though there are a ton of easy screens

his running moves him up but come on

We need a volume passer who can throw well with accuracy and see the field, mobility would be a bonus but as long as he can at least get out of his own way, Ill take the fat pirate or 5-8 Chinese guy

 

[Millhouse]

That's the way I look at it as well and why I am willing to hang in with Dino until the bitter end, looking at the chaos of current coaching searches it isn't something as a fan I never look forward to anymore. Marrone had the solid 2nd season but the injuries did us in year 3, struggled early year 4 until Pugh came back and the thing took off. There will be a defining moment of when things start to role, I truly believe that. It's just going to take longer than most had hoped for, maybe 4-5 years, IMO. I truly believe in what Dino is doing but to me the alternative isn't a very good one at all... Wash, rinse, repeat doesn't work.

And again, I am way way way more worried about scoring more points and getting some big plays on a consistent basis than I am the defense. It's the key to winning consistently, I believe. IF Dino doesn't get it done, I will sort of go to the belief that it will take a football genius to ever turn Syracuse around which finding and being able to hire said coach will take an absolute miracle.

how many coaches could succeed with this roster against the 13th hardest schedule in the country? this team was average and it sucks that NC St and BC are way above average this year

7 losses against teams in the top 36 in SRS

2017 Standings | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

we had the 85th hardest schedule in 2010, the 55th hardest in 2012, and the 41st hardest in 2013

 

[Millhouse]

We need a volume passer who can throw well with accuracy and see the field, mobility would be a bonus but as long as he can at least get out of his own way, Ill take the fat pirate or 5-8 Chinese guy

you can't be 2nd in attempts and 104th in efficiency as a team and expect to score a lot

5/4 td/int ratio, that's like dark ages stats, something from joe ferguson circa 1979

 

[care taker]

We need a volume passer who can throw well with accuracy and see the field, mobility would be a bonus but as long as he can at least get out of his own way, Ill take the fat pirate or 5-8 Chinese guy

Y'all sleeping on TDs athletism