I suppose with a new AD on the horizon you could say that Shafer is on the "hot seat"

[Millhouse]

The fact that he was caught flat-footed isn't a surprise. My guess is he thought he had all the leverage in the world and there was no risk to change, unless he was the one making it.

As for hiring Shafer, or Hackett for that matter, perfectly reasonable thing to do. Shafer was a proven coordinator, had been integral to rebuilding the program, including recruiting.

As for judging his performance, the whole needs time "his guys" is a bit much. The guys already on the roster were "his guys". Also, he didn't inherit a disaster. The offense finished ranked 17th, the defense 48th. The team smoked a top 10 Lville team, whipped WVU, beat a SEC team in a night road game. The second half of the year it was performing at a top 20 level.

This job was not a rebuild, it was to continue improvement and development, he wasn't starting from scratch. He made one massively bad hire that has set the program back, hopefully Lester can fix it. The offense didn't need to sustain the level it was at in 2012, but it shouldn't have fallen off the cliff like it did.

I don't think he is safe, no questions asked. I don't think it's a forgone conclusion that's he out. But I'd expect he's under pressure to show legitimate improvement. There's more than win/loss record in that evaluation.

hiring shafer is reasonable and having a shorter leash than an external candidate is also reasonable.

 

[Millhouse]

I think the major philosophy difference between Marrone's offense and McDonald was Marrone wanted to build an offense around the existing strengths of the team and McDonald (especially year 2) wanted to "square peg/round hole" what the unique/successful offenses were doing (Clemson, Oregon, Baylor) without having the ideal personnel to run it.

Hopefully Lester has taken stock of what we have and developed an offense around it and isn't falling into the same philosophical mistakes that McDonald made.

Early Prediction: Offense is better, defense is worse. Worst case 4-8, best case 6-7/7-6.

Shafer gets year 4, tweaks assistant coach roster.

i don't think it was a square peg round hole offense problem, I think it was a the offensive coordinator doesn't know actually know the offense he installed and doesn't know how to call plays problem.

there's nothing wrong with hurry up spread to run offenses. a million teams do it just fine

 

[RMH44]

Not in the least.

I specifically said that expecting the offense to sustain the performance was unreasonable in 2013. Thing is what was obvious to everyone, that the run game was the strength of the offense was true, everyone except McF**it. They actually ran the ball better in '13, once they committed to the run. Instead they wanted to be a pass heavy team, which required taking a flyer on 5th year transfer, instead of going with a strong armed, decent running QB.

The offense wasn't decimated. They returned three starters on the OL with experienced backups stepping in, the TE, the entire running back unit, and multiple WR's with substantial experience. What killed them was scrapping what worked and not tailoring it to what was on the roster and trying to switch to whatever it was MacDonald was trying to do.

The collapse was by choice, not necessity.

Who is this strong armed, decent running QB of whom you speak?

 

[Chip]

Bottom line, 3 win seasons

SU has never fired a coach with two or more years left on his contract.

Shafer has a 5 year deal. He's entering Year #3.

He will get Year #4.

I think he'll get year 4 as well, but not because of the unprecedented nature of it. If we win 3 or less, and you give the new AD the authority that an AD should have, then all bets are off.

Stanford fired Buddy Teevens after 3 years, hired Walt Harris and fired him after 2 years. Worked out ok for them.

Bottom line, just get the right guy. Hopefully Shafer is it, but if he's not, then get the right guy.

 

[storange]

In 2015 any pro or p5 coach that goes 3-9 ( or similar) is at least somewhat on the hot seat.

 

[TheCusian]

Huh?

Sorry - phone typing - meant "conveniently"

 

[GoSU96]

Sorry - phone typing - meant "conveniently"

I didn't conveniently leave out anything.

 

[TheCusian]

I didn't conveniently leave out anything.

Oh - I saw the part about the flyer on Allen and going with a running QB with a strong arm. Just wondering if you're giving all the credit to Marrone/Hackett instead of mentioning the drop off between Nassib and everyone else on the roster?

For me that's 1b, right after 1a of new OC (who wasn't as good as Hackett)

 

[GoSU96]

Oh - I saw the part about the flyer on Allen and going with a running QB with a strong arm. Just wondering if you're giving all the credit to Marrone/Hackett instead of mentioning the drop off between Nassib and everyone else on the roster?

For me that's 1b, right after 1a of new OC (who wasn't as good as Hackett)

Jesus, that's why I said you couldn't expect to sustain that level of performance. It's what I always said.

What am I giving Marrone/Hackett credit for, it certaintly isn't at the exclusion of the 2012 seniors, or the returning line or back field guys either.

The fact is that McF***it made a conscious decision to go in another direction on offense which compounded the changes, didn't mitigate them.

He was the guy who ushered Jerome Smith out because he didn't fit what he was trying to do on offense.

 

[baggerbob]

Jesus, that's why I said you couldn't expect to sustain that level of performance. It's what I always said.

What am I giving Marrone/Hackett credit for, it certaintly isn't at the exclusion of the 2012 seniors, or the returning line or back field guys either.

The fact is that McF***it made a conscious decision to go in another direction on offense which compounded the changes, didn't mitigate them.

He was the guy who ushered Jerome Smith out because he didn't fit what he was trying to do on offense.

Smith should have stayed, and we would have had a running attack, PTG could have continued his role as a change of pace back.

 

[TheCusian]

Jesus, that's why I said you couldn't expect to sustain that level of performance. It's what I always said. What am I giving Marrone/Hackett credit for, it certaintly isn't at the exclusion of the 2012 seniors, or the returning line or back field guys either. The fact is that McF***it made a conscious decision to go in another direction on offense which compounded the changes, didn't mitigate them. He was the guy who ushered Jerome Smith out because he didn't fit what he was trying to do on offense.

Whatever. You said "he wasn't starting from scratch" and that the offense shouldn't have fallen off a cliff - but the in your reasoning you left out losing an NFL QB to the draft. I'm simply saying that when your DC gets promoted, loses an NFL QB, NFL OC, all of your offensive assistants, etc, etc that he was starting from scratch. Jerome and PTG and some linemen - yeah - it should have been clear that running was the way to go... But losing Nassib and Hackett's system was a major, major loss.