Class of 2014 Isaiah Whitehead

[jordoo]

It seems like the crux of the NCAA's problem is hypocrisy. Claiming to be about amateurism while raking in and paying out huge sums of money, penalizing "student-athletes" who make a dime off their own fame while coaches and schools are making millions, cracking down on some schools while looking the other way at higher profile programs' indiscretions, claiming to protect student-athletes from the handlers and hangers-on who leech off them while enacting a huge loophole to let high school and AAU coaches do it in the open, etc. etc. It feels to me, though, like public opinion has shifted to such an extent that the NCAA is the last to realize they they are on the wrong side of history. I'm hopeful there will be big changes in the not-too-distant future.

You have nailed the NCAA but the only major changes I see on the horizen is when realignment ends with 4-5 power conferences whoch control all the maningfull fball teams and tv dollars as well as enough of meaningfull bball teams to run their own championship torney if need be. Then they can dictate the terms to the NCAA should they wish to continue to be around otherwise they can simply form their own rules and affiliations and not give a sheet if its amatuer or not.

 

[tee1222]

How's this for foreshadowing?
http://syracusefan.com/threads/so-this-is-it-no-roberson-huh.56921/page-2#post-733671

 

[orangefog]

How's this for foreshadowing?
http://syracusefan.com/threads/so-this-is-it-no-roberson-huh.56921/page-2#post-733671

I just hope the rest of your prediction happens.

 

[tee1222]

I just hope the rest of your prediction happens.

Ha, I was thinking exactly that!

 

[Francis03]

I told you SJU is as deep and talented as Cuse this year. I stand by that. We are no mid major. We were for a long time. But that is for another thread. Today, we share the common link that neither of us got scammed by Tiny Morton and Isaiah Whitehead. I'm fine with that.

 

[Orangezoo]

SJU is on a good path to being a near top 25 team- but saying they are on a congruent plane to syracuse right now is very premature- and well all know premature anything isnt very good.

 

[SJUBall]

SJU is on a good path to being a near top 25 team- but saying they are on a congruent plane to syracuse right now is very premature- and well all know premature anything isnt very good.

I think SJU is a Sweet 16 team this year or better. Right now SJU returns more double digit scorers and more contributors than Cuse does including two all Big East players. No doubt Cuse has reloaded in the last with young talent. That said, Fair is the only double digit scorer back and Cuse is relying on marked improvement frm guys like Coleman, Christmas, Grant as well as lots of questions in the backcourt. I don't see why it's outlandish to make the claim that SJU has as much depth. We do. Our 3rd option at PG was a double digit scorer I believe last year. Not talking crazy. I think we should be pretty good. We will still need a lot to beat Cuse because if the confounding 2-3 zone that gives problems to opponents. But if you go player for player, depth is going to be a close one.

 

[Orangezoo]

I think SJU is a Sweet 16 team this year or better. Right now SJU returns more double digit scorers and more contributors than Cuse does including two all Big East players. No doubt Cuse has reloaded in the last with young talent. That said, Fair is the only double digit scorer back and Cuse is relying on marked improvement frm guys like Coleman, Christmas, Grant as well as lots of questions in the backcourt. I don't see why it's outlandish to make the claim that SJU has as much depth. We do. Our 3rd option at PG was a double digit scorer I believe last year. Not talking crazy. I think we should be pretty good. We will still need a lot to beat Cuse because if the confounding 2-3 zone that gives problems to opponents. But if you go player for player, depth is going to be a close one.

depth and the talent level of that depth are an important aspect here. statistical things like having more returning double digit scorers mean nothing. There are senior laden low major squads who can claim such things- that doesn't put them in the conversation of being a top notch program. St johns should compete for a spot in the ncaa's this year. Take it easy jumping them to the sweet 16. Just making it is a first step. Having guys who were decently rated recruits who can put up numbers is nice but you have to make that gel. it takes more than a couple seasons to turn around a squad. i think you need to temper your expectations. What evidence is there for this to be a sweet 16 squad?

 

[SJUBall]

depth and the talent level of that depth are an important aspect here. statistical things like having more returning double digit scorers mean nothing. There are senior laden low major squads who can claim such things- that doesn't put them in the conversation of being a top notch program. St johns should compete for a spot in the ncaa's this year. Take it easy jumping them to the sweet 16. Just making it is a first step. Having guys who were decently rated recruits who can put up numbers is nice but you have to make that gel. it takes more than a couple seasons to turn around a squad. i think you need to temper your expectations. What evidence is there for this to be a sweet 16 squad?

I don't mean to hijack the thread, but quite a few. SJU was almost all freshmen last year which was part of the main problem. We would have been an NCAA team easy had Lavin not suspended Harrison who was a problem last year. SJU returns everybody and adds a lot to areas that were our weaknesses.

SJU returns the big east Rookie of the year in Jakarr Sampson at PF. SJU returns the big east second leading scorer prior to suspension in Harrison. We also return the #1 shotblocker in the nation in Chris Obekpa and the #1 shotblocking team in the nation.

We had issues in the frontcourt with depth but in addition to Obekpa and Sampson, SJU adds 6'9" Orlando Sanchez who is reportedly one of the best players on the team. Sanchez dribbles like a guard and will be a combo forward. SJU also returns God's Gift who redshirted last season who was valuable for depth his freshman year. In addition, we return our best defensive player Sir'Dominic Pointer.

SJU in the backcourt returns starter Phil Greene who was a double digit scorer, but the guys who seems to have taken the starting spot is Jamal Branch who killed it on the European tour this summer.. Both Greene and Branch were injured last year. Add to that D'Angelo and Rysheed Jordan.

We also added a shooter who hit 10 of 12 treys in a game this summer named Max Hooper and have others like Bourgault, Balamou and others.

 

[Orangezoo]

nice writeup but outside of sampson, frontcourt scoring is a huge question mark. Harrison is immature. He is not the type of player i would want my prized pg recruit learning behind from. Greene is a decent player. you have some better pieces - that said , unless this summer superstar is money from outside you're still limited offensively. As i said you're on the right track- just not there yet.

 

[SJUBall]

nice writeup but outside of sampson, frontcourt scoring is a huge question mark. Harrison is immature. He is not the type of player i would want my prized pg recruit learning behind from. Greene is a decent player. you have some better pieces - that said , unless this summer superstar is money from outside you're still limited offensively. As i said you're on the right track- just not there yet.

While SJU has questions, Cuse has as many or more. Who besides Fair is going to score in Cuse's frontcourt? It remains to be see, but as of last year, only Fair produced the numbers. You see my point? All team's have question marks. I've heard Harrison is back on track, but that remains to be seen. He was dealing with a lot of personal issues with a brother in jail etc. hopefully he has matured. Pointer improved his shooting and can really do it all out there on the court. The wildcard is Sanchez who can also hit out to three point range. I too have concerns about frontcourt scoring, but I think Sampson, Sanchez and Pointer can hold their own there with Hooper added for keeping team's honest.

Of course it all needs to come together and nobody knows if that will happen. I just know that we return a ton of talent both in frontcourt and backcourt. This should be the best team we've had in a long while.

 

[cusetown1]

While SJU has questions, Cuse has as many or more. Who besides Fair is going to score in Cuse's frontcourt? It remains to be see, but as of last year, only Fair produced the numbers. You see my point? All team's have question marks. I've heard Harrison is back on track, but that remains to be seen. He was dealing with a lot of personal issues with a brother in jail etc. hopefully he has matured. Pointer improved his shooting and can really do it all out there on the court. The wildcard is Sanchez who can also hit out to three point range. I too have concerns about frontcourt scoring, but I think Sampson, Sanchez and Pointer can hold their own there with Hooper added for keeping team's honest.

Of course it all needs to come together and nobody knows if that will happen. I just know that we return a ton of talent both in frontcourt and backcourt. This should be the best team we've had in a long while.

Our forward rotation is going to be unbelievable, best in the country. Wait until you see Coleman this year, freaking beast mode.

 

[SJUBall]

Our forward rotation is going to be unbelievable, best in the country. Wait until you see Coleman this year, freaking beast mode.

I certainly like the depth that Cuse had, but can only play 3 at a time. Coleman and Christmas had a bit of improving to do from last season. They were far from dominant. I do think Cuse has a huge and athletic frontline.

 

[Orangezoo]

While SJU has questions, Cuse has as many or more. Who besides Fair is going to score in Cuse's frontcourt? It remains to be see, but as of last year, only Fair produced the numbers. You see my point? All team's have question marks. I've heard Harrison is back on track, but that remains to be seen. He was dealing with a lot of personal issues with a brother in jail etc. hopefully he has matured. Pointer improved his shooting and can really do it all out there on the court. The wildcard is Sanchez who can also hit out to three point range. I too have concerns about frontcourt scoring, but I think Sampson, Sanchez and Pointer can hold their own there with Hooper added for keeping team's honest.

Of course it all needs to come together and nobody knows if that will happen. I just know that we return a ton of talent both in frontcourt and backcourt. This should be the best team we've had in a long while.

you will meet mr grant soon enough..

 

[SJUBall]

you will meet mr grant soon enough..

We've met Mr. Grant already. I think he had 4 pts against SJU last year. He's got amazing upside but also needs to show what he has and put up the points. We've got Jakarr back and you haven't met Orlando Sanchez yet. I venture to guess you'll be surprised with him. "Primo" is Grant's size and isn't going to give up any in the skill department. Sanchez is a huge addition to SJU frontcourt.

 

[cusetown1]

We've met Mr. Grant already. I think he had 4 pts against SJU last year. He's got amazing upside but also needs to show what he has and put up the points. We've got Jakarr back and you haven't met Orlando Sanchez yet. I venture to guess you'll be surprised with him. "Primo" is Grant's size and isn't going to give up any in the skill department. Sanchez is a huge addition to SJU frontcourt.

I'd be surprised if you boys kept the game within 18 this year. Just being honest.

 

[SJUBall]

I'd be surprised if you boys kept the game within 18 this year. Just being honest.

I'll just say that I think you guys might be surprised at the SJU team you run into this year. It should be a better game than recent years.

 

[normaliswear]

I'll just say that I think you guys might be surprised at the SJU team you run into this year. It should be a better game than recent years.

Ok... Rasheed Jordan is a very nice player. Sanchez will help some, but you're overestimating what you'll get from a big man who's never played at this level. Both should be good additions to your team. But the level of growth you're assuming for your 2nd and 3rd year players is absurd. Syracuse was a Final Four team last season. St John's was a below average BE team last year and was BLOWN OUT in the 2nd round of the NIT. You got a couple nice additions but they aren't Lebron and Kobe. A more realistic goal might be to make the tournament with a ceiling of being a top 25 team. Past that you need to put down the red colored glasses.

 

[Ward]

I'll just say that I think you guys might be surprised at the SJU team you run into this year. It should be a better game than recent years.

I agree with you in that St. John's is no doubt going to be a tourney team. My prediction would be best case scenario they're a weaker 4 seed (of the 4 teams who will be 4 seeds) and worst case scenario they're one of those scary 8-9 seeds that has a lot of talent and ability but for whatever reason has some trouble putting it all together. I agree with you when you say SJU is right there with athleticism with us. Jordan, Sampson, Pointer, are all freaks and your other players are all pretty athletic too.

Where I disagree with you is that your just as talented. This is a very talented Syracuse team who's real only weakness is back up pg and finding some stability at the 2. I think your really underestimating Grant as well. He's going to blow up and IMHO be a lottery pick this year. He's bulked up quite a bit and was dominant in Canada. Granted I've never seen Sanchez play but I would have a very tough time thinking he's as good as Grant. I don't really expect you to take my word for it because I know I probably just sound like a huge homer with Grant but time will tell and his play will speak for itself.

It will be a close game and I have to see SJU play but my gut feeling is we win by 7-12. You guys are trending up and definitely are going to have some success if things come together the right way.

 

[Orangezoo]

We've met Mr. Grant already. I think he had 4 pts against SJU last year. He's got amazing upside but also needs to show what he has and put up the points. We've got Jakarr back and you haven't met Orlando Sanchez yet. I venture to guess you'll be surprised with him. "Primo" is Grant's size and isn't going to give up any in the skill department. Sanchez is a huge addition to SJU frontcourt.

i was trying to leave freshmen and newcomers out.. well first off grant is bigger and much improved. He is a menace and a future 1st round pick. then comes tyler roberson. roberson brings a higher class game, motor and presence than sanchez. you will see . Defensively we are just as tough as last year. Ennis is the real deal and runs the show like a senior not a frosh. we have our 3 headed monster at the 5 and have some promising youth at guard in bj johnson who can really stroke it. Gbinije and cooney hold down the 2 spot and are solid on d while effective on offense. We are a legitimate threat to return to the FF with our depth. FF over swt 16 every day of the week. i am happy for you that your johnnies are getting closer to swimming and succeeding in the deep end of the pool- just not there yet.

 

[Orangezoo]

I'll just say that I think you guys might be surprised at the SJU team you run into this year. It should be a better game than recent years.

one moment we are equal talent the next it should be a better game.. ok so which is it? your jumping around here. good luck this season but this debate has been over and settled before it started bud

 

[kirbivore]

 

[OrangeDW]

I told you SJU is as deep and talented as Cuse this year. I stand by that. We are no mid major. We were for a long time. But that is for another thread. Today, we share the common link that neither of us got scammed by Tiny Morton and Isaiah Whitehead. I'm fine with that.

I think you've been saying that for a few years now. Who was the SJU guard recruit that was supposedly better than Michael Carter Williams, again? Where's he at now?

St. Johns hasn't had as much talent as Syracuse since the Ron Artest-Erick Barkley team, and right now they're not even close.

 

[OrangeDW]

I think SJU is a Sweet 16 team this year or better. Right now SJU returns more double digit scorers and more contributors than Cuse does including two all Big East players. No doubt Cuse has reloaded in the last with young talent. That said, Fair is the only double digit scorer back and Cuse is relying on marked improvement frm guys like Coleman, Christmas, Grant as well as lots of questions in the backcourt. I don't see why it's outlandish to make the claim that SJU has as much depth. We do. Our 3rd option at PG was a double digit scorer I believe last year. Not talking crazy. I think we should be pretty good. We will still need a lot to beat Cuse because if the confounding 2-3 zone that gives problems to opponents. But if you go player for player, depth is going to be a close one.

Who cares about returning "double digit scorers"? Every bad team has double digit scorers. It's a 40 minute game, somebody has to score.

Jerami Grant averaged 4 points per game last year(because he was a freshman on a loaded final 4 team), and he's better than anyone on St. Johns. Watch.

 

[HOFCeluck]

. it takes more than a couple seasons to turn around a squad.

It takes literally one good recruiting class.