Its time to stuff or get off the pot...

[Millhouse]

Marrone will be judged on his recruiting. If whiteknuckling doesn't result in better recruits, then he'll have made a mistake by not taking the big bath putting in the offense he wanted to see. 2013 and 2014 are the years to judge him. If he can't run a good offense then, get someone who will. He bought himself a lot of time playing a qb he didn't recruit, I get why people are impatient.

 

[rrlbees]

Last time I checked, Louisville was a Top 25 team, and both Cinci and USF were Top 40.

Every BE team won't be a pushover.

No pushover but no definite loss either and can be argued either way. Way I look at it, we have a 5/95 chance of beating USC and a 95/5 chance of beating SB. Every other game IMO is in the 60/40 - 40/60 range. The rest are our peer group. We should be expected to go 5-5 vs. our peers.

 

[44PRIDE]

Man, I really wish I shared some of your optimism.

Or your narcotics, whatever is fueling this.

We were a lousy team last year, and 1-6 in the worst major conference in the game. I want to believe, but I'm expecting 4 wins.

Last year should have been a 7 win season, but the team quit.

Every team in the big east has some issue. We have a fully loaded team with no glaring points of concern (IE/ walk-on QB @ UConn). We are "bigger, faster, stronger" at every position. We have a relatively healthy team.

Like Cuseman78 said,

A well-coached team is going to win 6 or 7 games with this squad.

I completely agree with him.

 

[JeremyCuse]

Absolutely correct. The top team in our conference is about the 30th best team in the country. After that, there really isn't much of a separation talent wise. The best coached teams will be in the top half. Therefore, I expect a top half finish. The OOC schedule is way overblown from a difficulty perspective and I see no reason we shouldn't win 3 of those.

A well-coached team is going to win 6 or 7 games with this squad. I've been as patient as anybody (clearly with the exception of OPA who would give Marrone 15 years to win 9 games) and I expect we will be rewarded for the patience this year with a 2010 type season.

Sorry but the OCC is very difficult for a rebuilding SU team who barely scraped by Tulane and Toledo. Say what you want about Missouri and injuries and there record last year but playing an SEC team on the road in the second to last game of the year is idiotic.

 

[JeremyCuse]

Man, I really wish I shared some of your optimism.

Or your narcotics, whatever is fueling this.

We were a lousy team last year, and 1-6 in the worst major conference in the game. I want to believe, but I'm expecting 4 wins.

Hate to say it but I agree with you and Millhouse I just dont see where these wins are coming from. Maybe we can get past both NW and Minny that would be a big help but I am struggling to find 6 wins if the OL isnt much better and we dont get some sort of downfield passing attack.

 

[Chip]

Some programs help themselves with scheduling. This program never has. Sure there's a lot of winnable games. But I'm having trouble finding more than five wins.

Our non conference may be tough, but is there a weaker schedule among those in a conference? People don't look at the schedule overall, they look at non conference and say "SU is tougher than anyone". That doesn't account for the fact that basically every team in the other 5 big boy conference has a tougher schedule top to bottom because of who they have to play in conference.

Only finding 5 wins has a lot more to do with us than it does who we're forced to play. Maybe we go 1-6 in conference again, but I think it should be pretty clear that it would not represent progress in Year 4. GRob could go 1-6 in conference. Having 40 more yards per game on offense and giving up 30 less yards, but keeping the same record wouldn't make me feel any better.

Minimum expectation has to be a 13 game season.

 

[wfschrec]

Sorry but the OCC is very difficult for a rebuilding SU team who barely scraped by Tulane and Toledo. Say what you want about Missouri and injuries and there record last year but playing an SEC team on the road in the second to last game of the year is idiotic.

OSU barely got by Toledo ... should they just quit too? Every game sans SB and USC could go either way ... they should have beaten Rutgers and UConn IMHO and a couple bonehead turnovers turned a 7-5 season into a 5-7 season ... they really should have been 3-4 in conf last season at a minimum. The one BE team I have a hard time seeing SU beating is Louisville ... I think every other BE team on the slate is beatable ... even though final scores may not have reflected it SU was in a lot of games and could have easily won more than they did.

 

[Rocco]

I literally cringe every time I see that guy...

This guy gets hired as the spirit and cheerleading coach, yet somehow ends up coaching our football team for 4 years.

 

[44PRIDE]

Sorry but the OCC is very difficult for a rebuilding SU team who barely scraped by Tulane and Toledo. Say what you want about Missouri and injuries and there record last year but playing an SEC team on the road in the second to last game of the year is idiotic.

I guess someday I'd like to quit leaning on the "Rebuilding" crutch and just expect this team to win winnable games.

 

[JeremyCuse]

I guess someday I'd like to quit leaning on the "Rebuilding" crutch and just expect this team to win winnable games.

I actually agree with most of if not all of your points outlined in the original post. I think from a conference schedule point of view I think its time we actually beat Uconn and Pitt for a change and win some of these winnable games as you noted. Anything less then 5-7 I think in year four is cause for concern.

However I think some people are underestimating how difficult this OOC is, NW is a good team and the game Saturday could go either way though I think SU pulls it out. The rest of the schedule isnt exactly a walk in the park either; USC is ranked #1 and has all americans literally at every position, @ Minnesota looks easy on paper but our record on the road under Doug isnt exactly stellar and SU has been losing that type of road game since Coach P. Missouri is a game that never should have been scheduled, no one is asking the Athletic department to schedule like Rutgers but when your schedule allready has 3 BS opponents only 1 of which is at home you dont schedule an SEC team on the road at the end of the year when SU will likely be desperate for a W to get bowl eligible. How Gross and Marrone signed off on that is beyond me.

Hell even our 1AA team is ranked in the top 10 of the FCS and there RB is a D1AA Heisman candidate and they just brought in the leading rusher from the B10 last year in Coker who was kicked out of Iowa. People keep laughing it off but this teams performance against 1AA's the past few years hasnt exactly been dominant and SB looks light years better then the RI team we beat 21-14 last year. SU will win but again if its another close game is it the opponent or as you noted is it time for changes to be made.

 

[JeremyCuse]

OSU barely got by Toledo ... should they just quit too? Every game sans SB and USC could go either way ... they should have beaten Rutgers and UConn IMHO and a couple bonehead turnovers turned a 7-5 season into a 5-7 season ... they really should have been 3-4 in conf last season at a minimum. The one BE team I have a hard time seeing SU beating is Louisville ... I think every other BE team on the slate is beatable ... even though final scores may not have reflected it SU was in a lot of games and could have easily won more than they did.

Not sure I am understanding your response, I am talking about the OOC and your whole point is about the results of last years conference schedule? The fact OSU struggled against Toledo is meaningless, have you seen there record over the past decade and whats goign on there now? My point is SU struggled to beat non BCS level teams last year and barely scrapped by freaking Rhode Island. So yeah based on that I do think the OOC is hard for this team.

Also regardless if they could have beaten RU and UConn last year they didnt and we havent beaten Uconn is nearly a decade. Let that sink in for a moment.

 

[Cuseman78]

Sorry but the OCC is very difficult for a rebuilding SU team who barely scraped by Tulane and Toledo. Say what you want about Missouri and injuries and there record last year but playing an SEC team on the road in the second to last game of the year is idiotic.

Do you not expect to beat NW (at home), a horrible Minnesota team, and an FCS team? I do. I'm not asking for a Mizzou or USC win. A well-coached team goes 3-2 vs this OOC schedule. I'm not asking for the world here.

 

[JeremyCuse]

Do you not expect to beat NW (at home), a horrible Minnesota team, and an FCS team? I do. I'm not asking for a Mizzou or USC win. A well-coached team goes 3-2 vs this OOC schedule. I'm not asking for the world here.

No I absolutely expect that but based on what I have see the past few years and this camp so far I could also see SU easily going 2-3 vs this OOC schedule, if SU doesnt win Saturday it maybe 1-4.

 

[Scooch]

Last year should have been a 7 win season, but the team quit.

Oh really?

I always love how people assume that every game we win was our God-given right to win, but that many games we lose were winnable "if only..."

Of our 5 wins only WVU (and I guess URI, since losing to them would be unimaginable) were locks.

Beating Wake took a Herculean 4th quarter/OT effort. Beating Toledo took a gift credited XP. And we beat a horrendous Tulane team by 3 as time expired after pissing away a 17 point lead, twice.

Sure we could have gone 7-5. We also EASILY could have gone 2-10.

Hence my pessimistic outlook on this year.

 

[kcsu]

He will always defend this staff no idea why but it is what it is which is pretty blind in my minds eye. If Doug cant win 6 games this year or at a minimum play lights out and win 5 close games he should be fired. NW MN SB Temple Uconn are all games that should be won. Go 40-60 against the rest and you have a good year. This is Syracuse University for Gods Sake not fing Rutgers or UConn or Temple We are one of the top ten programs of all time. We are going into the ACC if he cant get it done there are plenty who will. Win play well or go back to the pros and let someone else take us to the level that we deserve to be at. Personally i believe that Doug is going to turn the corner this year and win 7 games get a nice 4-5 year extension and lead us with our heads up into the ACC. That is my wish. If not time to turn the page and move forward as it has to be about the program not the coach.

 

[Scooch]

Our non conference may be tough, but is there a weaker schedule among those in a conference? People don't look at the schedule overall, they look at non conference and say "SU is tougher than anyone". That doesn't account for the fact that basically every team in the other 5 big boy conference has a tougher schedule top to bottom because of who they have to play in conference.

Only finding 5 wins has a lot more to do with us than it does who we're forced to play. Maybe we go 1-6 in conference again, but I think it should be pretty clear that it would not represent progress in Year 4. GRob could go 1-6 in conference. Having 40 more yards per game on offense and giving up 30 less yards, but keeping the same record wouldn't make me feel any better.

Minimum expectation has to be a 13 game season.

Yep, our non-conference is a challenge -- because we've been pretty lousy for a decade -- but it's not like what we faced in, say, 1998.

N'western and Minnesota are middle-of-the-road B10 teams. Are they any better than most of our mediocre conference slate?

I mean if this were the 90s we'd be looking at this schedule and expecting 10 wins.

This year it's not about them, it's about us.

 

[Scooch]

No I absolutely expect that but based on what I have see the past few years and this camp so far I could also see SU easily going 2-3 vs this OOC schedule, if SU doesnt win Saturday it maybe 1-4.

Right, but your assessment of our schedule is based on SU's past performance, not entirely on the merits of those opponents in a vacuum.

I agree that we could (and probably will at best) go 2-3 against our OOC slate, but that doesn't mean it's a gauntlet.

It means we still kinda suck.

 

[JeremyCuse]

Right, but your assessment of our schedule is based on SU's past performance, not entirely on the merits of those opponents in a vacuum.

I agree that we could (and probably will at best) go 2-3 against our OOC slate, but that doesn't mean it's a gauntlet.

It means we still kinda suck.

Not saying its the greatest OOC in history but its been ranked #1 or #2 in every pre season article I have seen. But I do agree that its harder based on where are as a program right now then say if it was 1998 or 1991 or 1994 etc. Because this team still is no where near where it was in our hey day this schedule does feel much more difficult then it probably should and as you noted it could be because were simply still not a good team.

 

[Cadillac]

Oh really?

I always love how people assume that every game we win was our God-given right to win, but that many games we lose were winnable "if only..."

Of our 5 wins only WVU (and I guess URI, since losing to them would be unimaginable) were locks.

Beating Wake took a Herculean 4th quarter/OT effort. Beating Toledo took a gift credited XP. And we beat a horrendous Tulane team by 3 as time expired after pissing away a 17 point lead, twice.

Sure we could have gone 7-5. We also EASILY could have gone 2-10.

Hence my pessimistic outlook on this year.

Exactly, we were closer to 1-11 than 11-1.

Did Tulane feel like a win? Toledo? Wake? Those were Ls flipped into Ws by our uptight coaches and game plan. Thank God.

I think tough sledding early, bandwagon empties out, torches get lit, but we have the seniors and bodies down the stretch to finally overcome our conference foes. If we beat NW that changes everything.

 

[Scooch]

Not saying its the greatest OOC in history but its been ranked #1 or #2 in every pre season article I have seen. But I do agree that its harder based on where are as a program right now then say if it was 1998 or 1991 or 1994 etc. Because this team still is no where near where it was in our hey day this schedule does feel much more difficult then it probably should and as you noted it could be because were simply still not a good team.

I think that ranking is heavily affected by us playing #1 USC, and Mizzou on the road. And I'm sadly expecting we lose handily in each of those games. N'western was 6-7 last year, and Minnesota was 3-9. Maybe they're both tons better this year, but these aren't top 25 (or maybe even top 50) opponents we're talking about here. Yeah, it'd be easier if we were playing SouthCentralWesternSouthernState A&M at Podunkville instead of those two, but we're also not playing Oregon and LSU.

So I get that this OOC schedule looks tough in aggregate, but all we need is 3-2, and one of those wins would come from a 1-AA, to set us up to just not suck out loud against the BE to get a bowl bid.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Its not even close to or get off the pot for Doug, just because it gets posted by some nitwit on espn.com doesn't mean he is on the hot seat or by someone on Syracusefan. Doug will be fine, sure if he went 3-9 he may have some issues but I don't see that happening. We were horrendous last year and won 5 games, he will gut out at least 6 and keep building.

 

[billsin01]

He hasn't yet proven that he can have a solid offense at the college level. At this point I actually care more about seeing progress on offense than wins.

I'm not sure I totally agree with this but I do think progress on offense is probably a bit more important than simply how many wins we get. White-knuckling our way to 6-6 is great but pretty difficult to feel like you're really building toward something. Moving the ball well but getting out-gunned late in a couple games and ending up 5-7 would honestly probably make me feel a bit better.

I definitely don't view this as a make-or-break year but it's hard not to think we should at least be competitive and show progress in several key areas -- STs, big plays, offensive consistency, OL play, depth ...

 

[billsin01]

IYeah, it'd be easier if we were playing SouthCentralWesternSouthernState A&M at Podunkville instead of those two, but we're also not playing Oregon and LSU.

I'm pretty sure Podunkville moved to a multiple offense this year so I think we'd have tough time stopping them.

 

[bevosu]

I look at it this way. The Grob years were a total unmitigated disaster. Watching those teams was torture.

Marrone has at least made watching the team play football less painful. I never expected us to go from one of the worst college football teams in the country to a bowl contender all that quickly.

I'll admit the waiting is getting old, but I have to give Marrone more time to make this program respectable. I don't know if memories are extremely short, but what I saw on the field in our previous coach's tenure was so bad that Bud Wilkinson in his prime would have had trouble reversing that disaster within 5 years.

He needs more time. Whether he can do it or not, who knows? I think he can, but I doubt that this year is a make or breaker.

 

[billsin01]

Last time I checked, Louisville was a Top 25 team, and both Cinci and USF were Top 40.

Every BE team won't be a pushover.

I agree with the overall premise that this is in no way, shape or form a throw-away year but I don't buy that DM is really on the hot seat at all. And part of the reason is b/c, while this conference is far from exciting and has certainly been far from dynamic the last two years, there really are a bunch of teams who have been pretty solid programs. L'ville has a good staff, a ton of resources and quite a bit of talent. Cincy is still tough and USF is talented. UConn has been a tough out at times in the last few years as well. Does that mean we can't beat those teams? No, and we should beat some of them. But suggesting we should be 8-4 means we need to win a minimum of 4 games in conference and probably five. I'm not sure that's as easy as it sounds.