JB on Orangenation right now.

[50YRsofCuse]

General question and statement:
Do people realize that if a new coach was hired, he would require some reasonable amount of time to build his team either through recruiting or the portal? How long would you give the new coach to get his team in place and to be successful? Hopefully we would be generous to give a new coach more than one to two years.

Yet, we are calling for Red to be replaced after 1 season where he won 20 games and is 5-5 in his second season. He is still trying to put his team on the floor. It is a team where very few players have played/practiced together more than 2-3 months. There is definitely a period where players need to come together. Doesn’t help when a star player is sidelined for a prolonged period and others have slipped or not lived up to their previous play or expectations.

There are some misclicks on the team right now and cohesiveness is a concern. Maybe it will be hard for this team to have a winning season but to give up on them like a number of the board‘s posters have is pretty pathetic. I watched Syracuse Teams from 1967 on and some of the teams were not easy to watch but they played their best. You can gripe and complain but still rooted for your hometown team and supported them.

In this era of NIL and the portal, it is hard to maneuver to get the right players on a team working together. In the past, players usually reached their potential over four years of playing together as a team. With the portal, it is a crap (good word) shoot that you are able to put players from other teams together to produce a winning team.

In short, you either stay with the coach you have and support him during the good and bad stretches or you get a new coach to start over again with the same probability of success that the current coach has over the next 3 year period.

 

[EnviroSciGuy]

General question and statement:
Do people realize that if a new coach was hired, he would require some reasonable amount of time to build his team either through recruiting or the portal? How long would you give the new coach to get his team in place and to be successful? Hopefully we would be generous to give a new coach more than one to two years.

Yet, we are calling for Red to be replaced after 1 season where he won 20 games and is 5-5 in his second season. He is still trying to put his team on the floor. It is a team where very few players have played/practiced together more than 2-3 months. There is definitely a period where players need to come together. Doesn’t help when a star player is sidelined for a prolonged period and others have slipped or not lived up to their previous play or expectations.

There are some misclicks on the team right now and cohesiveness is a concern. Maybe it will be hard for this team to have a winning season but to give up on them like a number of the board‘s posters have is pretty pathetic. I watched Syracuse Teams from 1967 on and some of the teams were not easy to watch but they played their best. You can gripe and complain but still rooted for your hometown team and supported them.

In this era of NIL and the portal, it is hard to maneuver to get the right players on a team working together. In the past, players usually reached their potential over four years of playing together as a team. With the portal, it is a crap (good word) shoot that you are able to put players from other teams together to produce a winning team.

In short, you either stay with the coach you have and support him during the good and bad stretches or you get a new coach to start over again with the same probability of success that the current coach has over the next 3 year period.

I think most posters are just as concerned about the lack of coaching and disorganization as they are about the composition of the roster. Syracuse basketball should be able to make a new hire in the portal era that is a tournament team in Year 1. That only seems like such a heavy lift because of how bad things were allowed to get at the end of the JB era followed by hiring someone that had pretty questionable qualifications.

With all due respect, the game has totally changed in the last few years. So should our expectations for the timeline of a rebuild.

The in-game coaching, seeming lack of fundamentals, preening and whining while play is ongoing, and lack of preparation are my major concerns... and those are all on Red, not due to our place on some rebuild timeline.

 

[50YRsofCuse]

I think most posters are just as concerned about the lack of coaching and disorganization as they are about the composition of the roster. Syracuse basketball should be able to make a new hire in the portal era that is a tournament team in Year 1. That only seems like such a heavy lift because of how bad things were allowed to get at the end of the JB era followed by hiring someone that had pretty questionable qualifications.

With all due respect, the game has totally changed in the last few years. So should our expectations for the timeline of a rebuild.

The in-game coaching, seeming lack of fundamentals, preening and whining while play is ongoing, and lack of preparation are my major concerns... and those are all on Red, not due to our place on some rebuild timeline.

I understand your position. Winning at any level takes a combination of the right talent, good coaching strategy and time. Your view that the in-game coaching is not there and was never present with Red even last year.

I still feel that people have given up on him and the team way too early. The team has not jelled to prove itself yet. If the team starts winning, it won’t matter to you because Red should be replaced now.

As I tried to convey, this will be the start of a series of replacing coaches repeatedly because they don’t immediately demonstrate the ability to win from the start and to continue to win. One bad year and the career is over. There will be no loyalty to the coach or to the players. It is a business model and the model is without early and continued success, you replace the coach.

 

[miamicuse]

As I tried to convey, this will be the start of a series of replacing coaches repeatedly because they don’t immediately demonstrate the ability to win from the start and to continue to win. One bad year and the career is over. There will be no loyalty to the coach or to the players. It is a business model and the model is without early and continued success, you replace the coach.

Exactly, the business model has changed because of NIL and the portal.

We can no longer count on any player staying more than 1 year, at season's end it's a complete reset, like it or not. It's a constantly moving target, and requires a totally different mindset to thrive in this environment.

There is no loyalty. If you are not able to get what you need from a player, than you run the risk of losing that player next year to higher bids (Jesse Edwards or Maliq), the successful coaches need to be someone who can recruit from HS, from portal, lobby for NIL and talent evaluation, and in game coaching, being able to find a way to to mesh these players into a cohesive team on year 1. There is no year 2 because year 2 is a rinse and repeat of year 1. Its a wild wild west and completely different and that's why great coaches like K, Roy Williams, Jay Wright, Tony Bennett all quit, they saw the writing on the wall, the model has changed and they are not willing to bend with it.

So yes, there is no need to wait multiple years to let a BB coach to ramp up because there is no ramp.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

I understand your position. Winning at any level takes a combination of the right talent, good coaching strategy and time. Your view that the in-game coaching is not there and was never present with Red even last year.

I still feel that people have given up on him and the team way too early. The team has not jelled to prove itself yet. If the team starts winning, it won’t matter to you because Red should be replaced now.

As I tried to convey, this will be the start of a series of replacing coaches repeatedly because they don’t immediately demonstrate the ability to win from the start and to continue to win. One bad year and the career is over. There will be no loyalty to the coach or to the players. It is a business model and the model is without early and continued success, you replace the coach.

Every team has freshmen and transfers. That can’t be an excuse that favors us, since it’s a universal circumstance. Gelling—same thing. Why would our team need more time to gel than the other (not very good) teams we have been facing?

Even if you have a rationale for a ‘waiver’ for us, it will be the same thing next year and the year after that, because college sports has been changed and 3-4 year players in one system are not the rule anymore, they‘re the exception. Every coach has to be able to put together cohesive teams that include a majority of new players.

That isn’t the issue. Assessing Red comes down to our inability to play basketball well, and the persistence of the same basic flaws in approach, execution, technique…. To advocate giving this staff more time is to excuse it for not seeing and/or not being able to do anything about those issues. Some are very, very basic but… they persist. While i don’t doubt Wildhack will be slow to pull the plug (again), i believe we are seeing what we will get again in the balance of this year, and again next year. A good program doesn‘t collapse under the weight if its own apathy, indecision, and ’ballslessness.’

 

[cuseinseattle]

I think the people who think our main problem is Red can't coach and ignore the NIL and our lack of it aspect will be really disappointed if we get a new coach.

 

[Sherman20]

Sure but I'm guessing your in the camp that red deserves 4 or 5 years, right? And JB should coach until death?

You have to factor in the buyout and whether you can afford it. For example I'm football A&m could afford Jimbo's. At USC they can't afford Lincoln Rileys which is equal or greater than Jimbo's $75 mill

No one is giving Red 4-5 years. He needs to make the tourney next year or he’s gonzo. If things get really bad and he loses the team, he could possibly be gone after this season. I wanna have patience and give Red a legit chance to succeed in this era of upheaval, but the fan base is clearly and understandably restless.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think the people who think our main problem is Red can't coach and ignore the NIL and our lack of it aspect will be really disappointed if we get a new coach.

Increase our budget by a million and we might have a pg, but I think we’d be in a similar situation overall. We’ve completely mismanaged the end of games and we look clueless on defense.

 

[Cusefan0307]

If anyone wants to see good coaching I would suggest watching Drake and then watch us. They are 10-0 with multiple former D-2 players in their rotation. What they run looks like a completely different sport. They have 3 more Power conference wins than we do.

 

[orangecuse]

If anyone wants to see good coaching I would suggest watching Drake and then watch us. They are 10-0 with multiple former D-2 players in their rotation. What they run looks like a completely different sport and they have 3 more Power conference wins than we do.

Dang, if only we had the means and wherewithal the likes of Drake and similar, we'd be in a much different boat.

 

[Scooch]

I think the people who think our main problem is Red can't coach and ignore the NIL and our lack of it aspect will be really disappointed if we get a new coach.

I think folks need to be far more transparent about these supposed NIL woes if we're to believe that's the primary reason this season has been lousy.

If the issue is that we targeted all of those mid-major guys in the portal because we couldn't afford better, then I get the NIL gripes.

But if those were the guys that Autry wanted, along with Lampkin (who we broke the bank for), along with keeping Bell, then it's not really an NIL problem. It's a talent evaluation problem.

My understanding is that NIL cost us a PG. And needless to say that's been a killer. But it sure seems like everyone else on the roster is there because Red wanted them there.

 

[Sherman20]

I think folks need to be far more transparent about these supposed NIL woes if we're to believe that's the primary reason this season has been lousy.

If the issue is that we targeted all of those mid-major guys in the portal because we couldn't afford better, then I get the NIL gripes.

But if those were the guys that Autry wanted, along with Lampkin (who we broke the bank for), along with keeping Bell, then it's not really an NIL problem. It's a talent evaluation problem.

My understanding is that NIL cost us a PG. And needless to say that's been a killer. But it sure seems like everyone else on the roster is there because Red wanted them there.

Like many things in life, the causes may be varied. We have mediocre NIL AND Red is still learning to be a head coach. I think his talent evaluation has been solid (freshman evaluation very good, transfers not as much) but sometimes the pieces don’t always come together. Alex Kline will help with the evaluations in the transfer portal for next spring.

 

[cuseinseattle]

I think folks need to be far more transparent about these supposed NIL woes if we're to believe that's the primary reason this season has been lousy.

If the issue is that we targeted all of those mid-major guys in the portal because we couldn't afford better, then I get the NIL gripes.

But if those were the guys that Autry wanted, along with Lampkin (who we broke the bank for), along with keeping Bell, then it's not really an NIL problem. It's a talent evaluation problem.

My understanding is that NIL cost us a PG. And needless to say that's been a killer. But it sure seems like everyone else on the roster is there because Red wanted them there.

If we had gotten Laffew to pair with JJ and been able to keep Brown to go along with a defense not great offense center we would be good. I'm not saying that Reds coaching isn't disappointing but I think we would have a team that could compete. I blame NIL for not having the above more than Red. Maybe I'm wrong though

 

[Bayside44]

If we had gotten Laffew to pair with JJ and been able to keep Brown to go along with a defense not great offense center we would be good. I'm not saying that Reds coaching isn't disappointing but I think we would have a team that could compete. I blame NIL for not having the above more than Red. Maybe I'm wrong though

Not having Leffew has given us both large doses or Carlos and probably Lucas Taylor as consolation prizes. Maybe those guys being non-factors on offense has made it harder for Bell.

Davis as a mid-major find has been solid.

 

[Scooch]

If we had gotten Laffew to pair with JJ and been able to keep Brown to go along with a defense not great offense center we would be good. I'm not saying that Reds coaching isn't disappointing but I think we would have a team that could compete. I blame NIL for not having the above more than Red. Maybe I'm wrong though

That’s fair. Of course it’s also Autry’s job to develop the NIL pool to land the players he needs. He has to own that, not just rely on others to do it for him.

What’s transpired in football this last year has put a substantial dent in the whole “we’re Syracuse, we’ll never compete for NIL” narrative. The right coach can cultivate the necessary resources to land the guys we need. Maybe with access to Carmelo’s checkbook Autry can be that coach.

 

[Bayside44]

That’s fair. Of course it’s also Autry’s job to develop the NIL pool to land the players he needs. He has to own that, not just rely on others to do it for him.

What’s transpired in football this last year has put a substantial dent in the whole “we’re Syracuse, we’ll never compete for NIL” narrative. The right coach can cultivate the necessary resources to land the guys we need. Maybe with access to Carmelo’s checkbook Autry can be that coach.

Fran brought money to the table, hopefully like you said Melo can be a similar influence.

 

[anglerman]

I miss him so much more than I thought I would.

He’s the reason we are in this position. I certainly do t miss him

 

[Dmcnabbrules]

He’s the reason we are in this position. I certainly do t miss him

Good for you

 

[STEVEHOLT]

In fact I described it. And they are the country's #1 team.

Is Maryland number 2?

 

[SWC75]

Is Maryland number 2?

#8, I believe, in the NET. But we were far less competitive against them than Tennessee, even if the scores wound up similar.

 

[GHLF]

He’s not wrong that if we want to do well we need more $. But it’s very clear that Red is not a good coach

Are you lumping his opinion in your opinion together twist

 

[DilemaCuse]

Seebilia and Infante come on the air tomorrow at noon saying, "its only 1 game. They usually don't get blown out, except to really good teams. It's only 11 games into Reds 2nd year. It was right before the holiday break. Team was probably distracted. He's not getting fired, they are only 5-6, we haven't bottomed out, plenty of basketball left."

I could make the Orangenation bingo card game of what those clowns will say on the air tomorrow.

 

[djcon57]

Seebilia and Infante come on the air tomorrow at noon saying, "its only 1 game. They usually don't get blown out, except to really good teams. It's only 11 games into Reds 2nd year. It was right before the holiday break. Team was probably distracted. He's not getting fired, they are only 5-6, we haven't bottomed out, plenty of basketball left."

I could make the Orangenation bingo card game of what those clowns will say on the air tomorrow.

It’s already been established as state radio. Not sure why anyone would bother listening

 

[DilemaCuse]

It’s already been established as state radio. Not sure why anyone would bother listening

I like messing with Polly in the chat on cusesportstalk.com