JB's Postgame Presser | Colgate

[Toga]

An nba team?!

40+ road games? I don't think so.

 

[Toga]

W-wait. You mean there is no secret plan to make a smooth transition? I could have sworn they told us that indeed there was an 'ironclad' plan in place.

Must've imagined it...

I believe that was JB talking, not the AD.

 

[baggerbob]

SU owes everything to JB. I disagree. The school isn't the school without what he's done for 45 years on the Hill. You are crazy to be so myopic.

What they owe him the most is a succession plan. A lifetime tenure never works. They can figure out a way to make this elegant.

When he got the school put on probation. the second time he should have been shown the door.
No coach who gets a school put on probation 2 times deserves a third chance.

 

[Toga]

I've been watching SU hoops for (well forever) and that was the most inept offensive and defensive effort I've ever seen. Passionless.

 

[Symphony Steve]

I believe that was JB talking, not the AD.

Probably. By 'ironclad', he meant 'shackled in chains'.

 

[orangecuse]

I get a bit squeamish when someone gets held up as THE reason for success. Boeheim has been the overwhelmingly biggest factor, no doubt. But others played a non-trivial role as well.

Jake C. got the program into the Big East, and moved it into the Dome -- both things JB didn't really want to do.

Dozens of great players committed their blood, sweat and tears to the program. Jim coached them, but they performed.

JB reportedly was given an elegant succession plan several years ago. A close confidant and lifelong SU guy was going to take over the program. JB had coached to the ripe age of 72. It was all there for the doing, but Jim balked. That's on him.

The last thing I want to see is SU treat Boeheim poorly in public. There is absolutely no need for that. But it really is long past time to move on and try someone new to reinvigorate things.

A few years ago I would've agreed that SU "owed" Jim, but at this point I think we're all square.

No one can argue that JB didn't assist in elevating the program. However, just as Sherman20 pointed out, Syracuse went to the Final Four in 1975 and was already a very good regional program.

Getting into the Big East and moving to the Dome played huge roles in Syracuse's success, which had nothing to do with JB, and his lack of foresight, just as you alluded to. Additionally, the advent of ESPN, along with moving to the Dome and the BE Conference is what truly launched SU into the stratosphere and on the national scene.

Again, no doubt JB certainly played a role in the success, however, IMO, it was the the BE Conference, the Dome and ESPN that had the greater impacts.

 

[baggerbob]

No one can argue that JB didn't assist in elevating the program. However, just as Sherman20 pointed out, Syracuse went to the Final Four in 1975 and was already a very good regional program.

Getting into the Big East and moving to the Dome played huge roles in Syracuse's success, which had nothing to do with JB, and his lack of foresight, just as you alluded to. Additionally, the advent of ESPN, along with moving to the Dome and the BE Conference is what truly launched SU into the stratosphere and on the national scene.

Again, no doubt JB certainly played a role in the success, however, IMO, it was the the BE Conference, the Dome and ESPN that had the greater impacts.

Those attendance figures of 28,000+ during the early years of the Big East were a huge factor in Syracuse success. Pearl, and then DC, Sherm, Rony, Stevie, Billy built the program, JB was along for the ride.
The fans and Great players built the program without them JB is just another coach.

 

[kcsu]

Secrets revealed . We’ve never run good sets . We just out talented people

I will not name names, but I was at a very famous NY Hs coaches kitchen table about 10 years ago or so talking ball with a couple of well-known college coaches and JB came up. The bottom line is that they believe he got by on talent in the early years, but they did give him credit for the zone. They all liked him and thought he was a good guy.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Hey guy, I assume you’re aware that we made the Final Four in 1975, the year BEFORE JB became head coach, and were on the upswing as a program under Danforth? I’m not saying that JB isn’t a better coach than Roy, but stop acting like Syracuse was a mid major.

Also the Big East and the Dome had a lot to do with our success. So even without JB, we look a lot like Nova in the old Big East (1980-2013).

We owe JB for being better than that level, but let's not act like we are the Bonnies without him.

 

[orangecuse]

Those attendance figures of 28,000+ during the early years of the Big East were a huge factor in Syracuse success. Pearl, and then DC, Sherm, Rony, Stevie, Billy built the program, JB was along for the ride.

I do believe the attraction of the BE Conference, ESPN and the national attention the Dome drew at the time with 30k fans, etc. all encompassed nothing ever scene before to that point in time. And, that was more of an attraction than playing for the particular coach. Again, that said, JB still played a role in the successes.

I am old enough to recall in those early days of 'to the moon' type success many in the local community believed how JB was a "great recruiter," but not thought much of as a coach and "couldn't win the big one." I never got caught up in all of that at the time as I only cared that we had those players, and were winning a lot of games, and even playing in the "big ones."

We certainly have had our share of incredible players over the years and JB's record is reflected by this with all of the games he has won, and at such an impressive percentage rate.

However, I don't think it's a coincidence at all that since we have been on our downward slide over these past 8 years or so, that there's a direct correlation between his wins/winning percentage rate and the level of talent that JB is responsible for and assembled.

 

[Scooch]

No one can argue that JB didn't assist in elevating the program. However, just as Sherman20 pointed out, Syracuse went to the Final Four in 1975 and was already a very good regional program.

Getting into the Big East and moving to the Dome played huge roles in Syracuse's success, which had nothing to do with JB, and his lack of foresight, just as you alluded to. Additionally, the advent of ESPN, along with moving to the Dome and the BE Conference is what truly launched SU into the stratosphere and on the national scene.

Again, no doubt JB certainly played a role in the success, however, IMO, it was the the BE Conference, the Dome and ESPN that had the greater impacts.

I wouldn't say those things had greater impacts. Lots of other Big East schools had the benefit of the conference forming and getting nation-wide exposure via ESPN.

Providence had a lot of NCAA success in the 70s, and it's not like they launched into the college basketball stratosphere in the 80s like we did. And that's because they didn't have Jim Boeheim.

My point was not to diminish JB's role in any way. Merely to note that our success wasn't 100% him. Which I think you agree with. It was mostly him, but he benefited from a few other dynamics, some of which he didn't necessarily want.

Mostly I was pushing back on the notion that SU "owes" Jim. He's done remarkable things for the school and community. And the school, particularly in the past several years, has shown quite a bit of support and loyalty to him. At this point, I think the school and JB are square.

 

[orangecuse]

I wouldn't say those things had greater impacts. Lots of other Big East schools had the benefit of the conference forming and getting nation-wide exposure via ESPN.

Providence had a lot of NCAA success in the 70s, and it's not like they launched into the college basketball stratosphere in the 80s like we did. And that's because they didn't have Jim Boeheim.

My point was not to diminish JB's role in any way. Merely to note that our success wasn't 100% him. Which I think you agree with. It was mostly him, but he benefited from a few other dynamics, some of which he didn't necessarily want.

Mostly I was pushing back on the notion that SU "owes" Jim. He's done remarkable things for the school and community. And the school, particularly in the past several years, has shown quite a bit of support and loyalty to him. At this point, I think the school and JB are square.

It's just my opinion. I've have stated that JB contributed to the elevated success of SU.

However, I'll maintain my position as it's what I believe. There isn't any school, IMO, that got the amount of coverage, notoriety, grandeur, etc. that ESPN afforded them at the time than Syracuse University. And, that's because, no other school had anything like the Carrier Dome and what that scene, image, etc. created for the players, recruits & masses at the time.

 

[Scooch]

It's just my opinion. I've have stated that JB contributed to the elevated success of SU.

However, I'll maintain my position as it's what I believe. There isn't any school, IMO, that got the amount of coverage, notoriety, grandeur, etc. that ESPN afforded them at the time than Syracuse University. And, that's because, no other school had the Carrier Dome and what that scene, image, etc. created for the players, recruits & masses at the time.

Totally get it. I would counter that the reason why the Dome was attractive to TV was the tens of thousands of fans in it. And we only got that kind of unprecedented attendance after JB recruited Pearl and we ascended to being a top 10 program. Prior to that our Dome attendance was great (16-18K) but not transcendent.

 

[hoopsupstate]

Totally get it. I would counter that the reason why the Dome was attractive to TV was the tens of thousands of fans in it. And we only got that kind of unprecedented attendance after JB recruited Pearl and we ascended to being a top 10 program. Prior to that our Dome attendance was great (16-18K) but not transcendent.

We haven’t had a “Pearl” like recruit in a long time. It’s tough to say who’s the best recruit we‘ve recruited since Hop left.

 

[81South]

My take aways from the presser are…1) I think the man 2 man experiment is already over and 2) he looks a bit bloated in the gut

 

[orangecuse]

Totally get it. I would counter that the reason why the Dome was attractive to TV was the tens of thousands of fans in it. And we only got that kind of unprecedented attendance after JB recruited Pearl and we ascended to being a top 10 program. Prior to that our Dome attendance was great (16-18K) but not transcendent.

It appears, based upon direct quotes from the Pearl at the time, the attendance was already transcendent.

Jim Boeheim: Landing Pearl Washington Was Turning Point For Syracuse Basketball

www.thepostgame.com

Pearl admitted the opportunity to play basketball in front of huge crowds inside the Dome also was a major appeal.

"It was the largest stage I'd ever seen," he said. "What other school are you going to go to where you're going to play in front of 32,000 to 33,000 people? It really was amazing to come up there and see a place that big. I wanted to play on that stage."

 

[djorange1989]

JB is a major reason why the program became what it was, along with the Dome, the Big East etc. That doesn't mean he should be allowed to stay around long enough to continue sending the program into a tailspin that has now lasted about 8 years. enough already.

 

[richard levy]

He is pretty heavily underpaid relative to performance, maybe not the last 9 years, but for the 20+ years after his first FF, he was getting paid like a mid major to coach a leading D1 program

It has always his choice to stay. Supposedly once had an NBA coaching offer? Then and now could have become an analyst on tv/cable. We don’t owe him for his self imposed hometown discount

 

[SDjohn]

JB built the program to a national Powerhouse for a lot of years and for that, I will always be grateful to him.

That being said, JB has also “built” what we have seen in recent years as well, being a constant “bubble” or less program. He was great but his time has passed. We struggle recruiting top talent because nobody wants to come play a 2-3 zone when it’s not the primary D at the next level AND they want to play in the tournament, which isn’t a given here anymore. That’s it, pretty simple IMO. It won’t get better until he leaves unfortunately.

 

[Cuse181]

It has always his choice to stay. Supposedly once had an NBA coaching offer? Then and now could have become an analyst on tv/cable. We don’t owe him for his self imposed hometown discount

Oh, I’m not saying we owe him, I’m just saying that he has been underpaid for a while and that he is now performing to that level. If we want to get a top tier guy, it isn’t going to be for 2 million a year

 

[STEVEHOLT]

That presser was 10 minutes of shrugged shoulders and "eh, what can you do?".

That and a few minutes of likening Colgate to the 2017 Golden State Warriors

 

[charleston]

I've been watching SU hoops for (well forever) and that was the most inept offensive and defensive effort I've ever seen. Passionless.

six recruits and not one of them can shoot in todays basketball world?? What was he thinking so because of that now he says they have to "penetrate" more to take pressure off Edwards. Last year no one could penetrate...transfer portal JB? what happended to "best class of recruits ever"?

 

[Syracuslove]

Biggest takeaway for me is that we need to stop scheduling Colgate at least until Langel is gone (and becomes our HC)… not sure how scheduling works and whether it’s determined each year or if it’s like football where teams schedule multiple games years ahead, but if we scheduled them before this year started after last years shellacking, that sure would’ve been a boneheaded move. Like JB was saying, their ball movement and shooting is particularly exceptional for a mid-major (though I wouldn’t say the best they’ll see…) and particularly good against the zone.

Let’s schedule the SUNYs and what not instead… FYI I know it’s sad saying this

 

[Cheriehoop]

Neither of you are correct. SU owes JB a ton, but not everything. We made a FF with JBs predecessor. Any school who thinks it owes everything to an individual is in for trouble, which is where we seem to be with the basketball program, sadly.

One observation regarding your 2nd sentence. Like the majority of coaches he leveraged that FF for more $, what he thought was a more favorable situation and university to immediately leave SU too.

 

[Otto'd]

They owe him a succession plan? What about the one in place he blew up ?

^^^ This.

It was all set. Everything after that has been mostly torture with a couple nuggets of fools gold.