Class of 2015 Killing It

[SUfanNC]

We all need to realize that sometimes it takes this. We will get there.

 

[anomander]

I will say this one of the things they stressed to us was they aren't taking any kids that have a sense of entitlement. If the kids come across with a what are you going to do for me above what you are doing for them attitude ... The staff won't take them.

I will also say I have seen a bunch of the 4 and 5 star kids and the entitlement is poring out of some of them. From the kid at rivals needing a back rub on the sideline from his entourage every time he ran a drill. To the kids in miami that tweeted the picture saying thank you Rick Ross if they ain't paying we ain't playing and we ain't signing till the pockets are full. The kid at bc that would even say hello when he was introduced to us. Their is a lot of kids whose coaches and parents have filled their heads with crap. They go to the fsu ohio etc and those coaches pump their tires and then come to a school that tells it like it is... Like syracuse does.

You will have a very hard time getting any of the 4 and 5 star kids. Now in sure not all of them are like that but like I aside I've probably met 30 of them and when I go to these camps I search them out to watch and compare shy to them. I've said before on quite a few... I'm not impressed... Hell there is a kid on Lowell that is shys teammate that doesn't have a single offer but is better than most of the 4 and 5 star kids.

Those kids have a coach that knows a coach or knows a guy that runs a camp. A lot of these kids the coach is at the camp high fiving the evaluator an hour before camp and are sitting up with them pointing his kid out. It's a big who knows who gets 5 stars game.

And after talking to the staff I would rather watch a team that scratches and fights to the top. Id rather a bunch of hardnosed guys smashing skulls than a fractured team of I'm better than yous. As hcss said entitlement is a cancer and it's a cancer I don't want near my team. But you may never get those big time guys... They want to be your cancer

Say what you want about the 4 and 5 star recruits, but I would much rather have the team full of 4 and 5 stars then not. Look at the top schools year in and year out. Bama, LSU, FSU, Georgia, Auburn, Ohio St, Clemson, etc. Those schools have rosters that are primarily made up of 4 and 5 star talents. Sure there will be some 4 and 5 stars that turn out to be busts, just like there will be some NR, and 2 stars that turn into NFL draft picks. The main thing is you need to have the HC, and the staff to develop those 4 and 5 star recruits. Coaches like Saban, Miles, Jimbo, Richt, Malzan, and Urban can develop the talent they bring in. When you have coaches that can bring out the talent those schools aren't getting beat because the talent they have is just too good. Everyone can point to examples like Boise St, who can do a lot with little, but it's because of the coaches. In our case we have to hope Shafer and his staff are the type of staff that can not only maximize the talent they bring in, but out scheme everyone else to make up for the difference in talent level. Personally I think we can do it because we have to if we want to be successful. The talent we have been bringing in is good for what we have been doing. 6-8 wins with a medium to lower level bowl. I'm not satisified with that though, but in order to do better we have to keep bringing in better talent, which just happens to be those 4 and 5 star kids.

 

[Bambrewer]

Say what you want about the 4 and 5 star recruits, but I would much rather have the team full of 4 and 5 stars then not. Look at the top schools year in and year out. Bama, LSU, FSU, Georgia, Auburn, Ohio St, Clemson, etc. Those schools have rosters that are primarily made up of 4 and 5 star talents. Sure there will be some 4 and 5 stars that turn out to be busts, just like there will be some NR, and 2 stars that turn into NFL draft picks. The main thing is you need to have the HC, and the staff to develop those 4 and 5 star recruits. Coaches like Saban, Miles, Jimbo, Richt, Malzan, and Urban can develop the talent they bring in. When you have coaches that can bring out the talent those schools aren't getting beat because the talent they have is just too good. Everyone can point to examples like Boise St, who can do a lot with little, but it's because of the coaches. In our case we have to hope Shafer and his staff are the type of staff that can not only maximize the talent they bring in, but out scheme everyone else to make up for the difference in talent level. Personally I think we can do it because we have to if we want to be successful. The talent we have been bringing in is good for what we have been doing. 6-8 wins with a medium to lower level bowl. I'm not satisified with that though, but in order to do better we have to keep bringing in better talent, which just happens to be those 4 and 5 star kids.

I understand what you are saying my point is those are teams full of head cases with coach that are going to let you play if you get busted for drugs or stealing crab legs or sexual assault. They are going to tolerate the entitled attitudes and not care if you fail out of school. That isn't your head coach. My point is most of those 4 and 5 star kids have been brain washed into little monster the mega factories will take. Coach Shafer would spend ten minutes with a certain 5 star New Jersey recruit and throw him out the building. He told us flat out he would rather win 8 or 9 games and graduate respectable young gentleman than have a team of monsters go undefeated. Now I believe he can take those kids he wants and tear the acc up... But if you feel you need the monsters to win... I'm just not sure you will get it

 

[anomander]

I understand what you are saying my point is those are teams full of head cases with coach that are going to let you play if you get busted for drugs or stealing crab legs or s e x ual assault. They are going to tolerate the entitled attitudes and not care if you fail out of school. That isn't your head coach. My point is most of those 4 and 5 star kids have been brain washed into little monster the mega factories will take. Coach Shafer would spend ten minutes with a certain 5 star New Jersey recruit and throw him out the building. He told us flat out he would rather win 8 or 9 games and graduate respectable young gentleman than have a team of monsters go undefeated. Now I believe he can take those kids he wants and tear the acc up... But if you feel you need the monsters to win... I'm just not sure you will get it

I don't know we basically offered all the 4 and 5 stars kids in NJ. He didn't get a chance to throw them out of the building because they never made it up. I think it would be a different story if all the 4 and 5 star kids were actually beating down our doors to come here.

 

[Bambrewer]

Th

I don't know we basically offered all the 4 and 5 stars kids in NJ. He didn't get a chance to throw them out of the building because they never made it up. I think it would be a different story if all the 4 and 5 star kids were actually beating down our doors to come here.

that could be true

 

[javadoc]

I love the way this staff recruits. They find the kids they want early on and start stacking that foundation up quickly. Shafer is over-the-top with his coaches that it is 110% about relationships. Understand the player, his situation, what motivates them, what worries them, get to know the parents/guardians, their worries, etc. This trumps any flashy jersey, facility or recent success/failures on the field. The kids who only care about the material stuff or who are selfish will be passed on by this staff.

Well, I didn't want this thread to turn into another discourse on "star ratings," because what mattered in my thinking was the "factory snob" aspect. The two are probably correlated, but one does not imply the other. When we do start getting some of the bigger fish - judged purely on star ratings and offers - it will be because they're not factory snobs.

Let's assume we have one OOC P5 team annually that is better than we are. Right now FSU is out of our league, and probably Clemson too. We can catch and overtake everyone else on our schedule with what we are doing right now. That's 9 wins. That will get us to the next level.

 

[spo023]

A lot of people are saying that we need to bring in 4 and 5 star kids. I just want to clear up that every year, there are about 15-20 5 star kids. Unless a 5 star kid is one of our coaches sons, we will most likely never bring in a 5 star recruit. However, there are about 300-400 4 star kids, so we should be grabbing 2-4 every year as we progress forward at this current pace with these coaches.

 

[orangefog]

A lot of people are saying that we need to bring in 4 and 5 star kids. I just want to clear up that every year, there are about 15-20 5 star kids. Unless a 5 star kid is one of our coaches sons, we will most likely never bring in a 5 star recruit. However, there are about 300-400 4 star kids, so we should be grabbing 2-4 every year as we progress forward at this current pace with these coaches.

I agree with you. We should be identifying the 5 star kids early and hire their fathers.

 

[CaliCuse]

Thats more like it

2013: 6 Commits/6 P5 offers
2014: 17 commits/ 17 P5 offers

Also recall that of the 17, 2 are silent that we do not know about and could have multiple P5 offers that are not accounted for here.

The silent verbal in just bulls#it. Always was and still is.Whether its a wink or a nod the stuff gets out.

 

[chakka3421]

Say what you want about the 4 and 5 star recruits, but I would much rather have the team full of 4 and 5 stars then not.

I look at this a little differently. Let's take our games against PSU - a perennial high 3 star, 4 star plus team. We played 3 times since 2008 under 3 different coaching staffs. Here are the results:

2008 - HCGR - we lost 55-13 at home. I was on the sideline that game - game was over within minutes. You could tell our players looked like boys against men. Very ugly game.

2009 - HCDM - we lost 28-7 at PSU. I was not there but I remember that the PSU players thought they were playing a completely different SU team and had far more respect for us since we made the game more competitive for them.

2013 - HCSS - we lost 23-17 at Meadowlands. We had the ball in the final minutes - game went down to the wire. You could argue their team was depleted but still it was full of 4 star kids.

We are getting far better (I still remember those nightmare years under HCGR) - both in player competitiveness and in coaching. We are recruiting strong again in the NE and now have 2 solid additional recruiting regions - Midwest IL & MI and Southeast FL & GA. Now we get "BOOMED" this year early with 15-17 recruits pre 4th of July. We are in new territory here from a recruiting perspective and it seems many here are afraid of change and want sure bets - personally I love the new approach. I know people want to compete with the FSU, PSU & LSUs of the football world, but I suspect HCSS has taken the approach I believe they had at WMU & Stanford did while he was there - get a lot of recruits early - fill out the needs you have first based upon staff's ability to identify D1 level kids before anyone else does (biggest risk here but they did it last year to a lesser extent) - then end up with the option to pick and choose the final spots on the roster with the best athletes left on the board regardless of position.

My guess is that most of these kids end up being 3 star kids after their senior season (and 1-2 end up being 4 star) and HCSS picks up 1-2 4 star kids in the fall to fill the remaining spots - anyone want to bet that this in fact happens?

 

[IthacaBarrel]

You have seen steady progress the past 5 years. I think the staff showed some growing pains last year, they also lost some very good seniors ( Nassib, Shamarko, Pugh, two very good collegiate receivers) but I think Shafer and his staff and his team performed very well towards the end of last year, the only debacle I saw was probably the NW and GT game. Lets hope we see a 2nd year staff and continued steady recruiting pay off this year. 7-8 wins would be great with less games where we are blown out. Slow and steady, slow and steady.

We have seen kids that are working hard for clearly a staff they love to play for, hopefully we continue to move forward, what more can you ask for? We all love what Shafer stands for and the kids he is trying to bring in. WIN games and this guy will be loved by all for more than just winning games.

The foundation and right people are in place. Onward and upward. I wouldn't say we are killing it recruiting wise but would say we continue to build a solid foundation year in year out and if we get off to a good start you will see some of the more highly contested kids swing our way. Like I said, when it comes to Syracuse football it is all one can ask for

 

[wfschrec]

I look at this a little differently. Let's take our games against PSU - a perennial high 3 star, 4 star plus team. We played 3 times since 2008 under 3 different coaching staffs. Here are the results:

2008 - HCGR - we lost 55-13 at home. I was on the sideline that game - game was over within minutes. You could tell our players looked like boys against men. Very ugly game.

2009 - HCDM - we lost 28-7 at PSU. I was not there but I remember that the PSU players thought they were playing a completely different SU team and had far more respect for us since we made the game more competitive for them.

2013 - HCSS - we lost 23-17 at Meadowlands. We had the ball in the final minutes - game went down to the wire. You could argue their team was depleted but still it was full of 4 star kids.

We are getting far better (I still remember those nightmare years under HCGR) - both in player competitiveness and in coaching. We are recruiting strong again in the NE and now have 2 solid additional recruiting regions - Midwest IL & MI and Southeast FL & GA. Now we get "BOOMED" this year early with 15-17 recruits pre 4th of July. We are in new territory here from a recruiting perspective and it seems many here are afraid of change and want sure bets - personally I love the new approach. I know people want to compete with the FSU, PSU & LSUs of the football world, but I suspect HCSS has taken the approach I believe they had at WMU & Stanford did while he was there - get a lot of recruits early - fill out the needs you have first - then end up with the ability to pick and choose the final spots on your roster with the best athletes left on the board.

My guess is that most of these kids end up being 3 star kids after their senior season (and 1-2 end up being 4 star) and HCSS picks up 2-3 4 star kids in the fall to fill the remaining spots - anyone want to bet that this in fact happens?

I will wait till the final recruiting rankings come out but I will say this ... if you look at things like the All-ACC teams you will see a mix of 3,4 and 5 stars. The one thing I see as a big discriminator for a lot of these teams is the QB, it can make a world of difference to have a Tajh Boyd or Jameis Winston type of QB. If Terrell Hunt makes a significant jump we could see SU pull a Duke like performance and get 9 wins. Anthony Boone made tremendous strides plus Connette played well and while their numbers weren't exactly All-American Boone showed a significant advancement as the season wore on and shredded A&M for 427 passing yards. His maturation was big for Duke and Hunt could give us the same boost, just look at how well Duke played when Boone took over for good.

When I follow recruiting I look at the OL, DL and QB positions first and foremost. That is why I am so excited about Edouard because I think he will be a good one and a difference maker. If your QB is a game breaker you can enter almost any game with a shot ... which is why I am a little down on Clemson, Boyd was an amazing talent and losing him might hurt a lot. I think the QB situation seriously tripped up ND last year and having Golson back and Zaire emerging will make them tougher than having Rees back there. If Hunt alone has a breakthrough campaign I think that is a 2 win difference for SU. The only reason BC won as frequently as they did ... and even had a shot to beat us was due to Rettig who is gone. And poor QB play doomed MD and NC State especially in games against SU. Hunt will be the big differentiator for us when we play our peers IMHO. I think Hunt is the reason I am bullish on SU this season.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

I will wait till the final recruiting rankings come out but I will say this ... if you look at things like the All-ACC teams you will see a mix of 3,4 and 5 stars. The one thing I see as a big discriminator for a lot of these teams is the QB, it can make a world of difference to have a Tajh Boyd or Jameis Winston type of QB. If Terrell Hunt makes a significant jump we could see SU pull a Duke like performance and get 9 wins. Anthony Boone made tremendous strides plus Connette played well and while their numbers weren't exactly All-American Boone showed a significant advancement as the season wore on and shredded A&M for 427 passing yards. His maturation was big for Duke and Hunt could give us the same boost, just look at how well Duke played when Boone took over for good.

When I follow recruiting I look at the OL, DL and QB positions first and foremost. That is why I am so excited about Edouard because I think he will be a good one and a difference maker. If your QB is a game breaker you can enter almost any game with a shot ... which is why I am a little down on Clemson, Boyd was an amazing talent and losing him might hurt a lot. I think the QB situation seriously tripped up ND last year and having Golson back and Zaire emerging will make them tougher than having Rees back there. If Hunt alone has a breakthrough campaign I think that is a 2 win difference for SU. The only reason BC won as frequently as they did ... and even had a shot to beat us was due to Rettig who is gone. And poor QB play doomed MD and NC State especially in games against SU. Hunt will be the big differentiator for us when we play our peers IMHO. I think Hunt is the reason I am bullish on SU this season.

I will buy that, provided Hunt can make a significant jump. He appeared to have the tools and the head most importantly to do it. is going to happened when you are a qb at this level, how do you respond is the question? The really good to great ones just keep coming at you. QB has to be solid between the ears, which I believe HUNT is