My expectations and when we know we have turned it around

[omniorange]

Let me preface this by saying we are only in year two of what will likely be at least a 4 year reclamation project.

Like many others, I came into this season believing we had 5 likely wins (the first three games along with Wake and BC) making Pitt the key to a potential bowl season. Middle Tennessee State blew that out of the water. But for me, the Pitt game is still meaningful, though not necessarily for bowl chances like we had all hoped.

The two games I was most interested in watching this season were the NC State and Pitt games not so much for this season, but as a measuring stick for how far we still have to go. We failed yesterday against the Pack, but again it is still early in the Babers' era. However, the truth is we will know for sure we have turned the corner when we start beating those two programs more than we lose to them. When we get to that point of beating those two programs more often then we lose to them, we can begin to focus on competing with the likes of Clemson, FSU, and Louisville in the Atlantic division.

Until such time, we will remain a mediocre bottom tier (along with Wake and BC) ACC team. And about all we can say for now is - at least we ain't Rutgers.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[CousCuse]

Let me preface this by saying we are only in year two of what will likely be at least a 4 year reclamation project.

Like many others, I came into this season believing we had 5 likely wins (the first three games along with Wake and BC) making Pitt the key to a potential bowl season. Middle Tennessee State blew that out of the water. But for me, the Pitt game is still meaningful, though not necessarily for bowl chances like we had all hoped.

The two games I was most interested in watching this season were the NC State and Pitt games not so much for this season, but as a measuring stick for how far we still have to go. We failed yesterday against the Pack, but again it is still early in the Babers' era. However, the truth is we will know for sure we have turned the corner when we start beating those two programs more than we lose to them. When we get to that point of beating those two programs more often then we lose to them, we can begin to focus on competing with the likes of Clemson, FSU, and Louisville in the Atlantic division.

Until such time, we will remain a mediocre bottom tier (along with Wake and BC) ACC team. And about all we can say for now is - at least we ain't Rutgers.

Cheers,
Neil

Wake is a strong team.

 

[Crazylegs]

Wake is a strong team.

I feel like we have made significant progress already, just too early to put it all together for wins like this. The system requires almost perfect execution but is designed to wear out opponents. We had LSU and NC State on the ropes and gassed. Not too long ago, it was our guys that were weezing with the beer guts. I think we are right on schedule.
Also, liked the physical play in second half. My sense is Dino reminded them that hitting the other guy harder matters.

 

[CousCuse]

I feel like we have made significant progress already, just too early to put it all together for wins like this. The system requires almost perfect execution but is designed to wear out opponents. We had LSU and NC State on the ropes and gassed. Not too long ago, it was our guys that were weezing with the beer guts. I think we are right on schedule.
Also, liked the physical play in second half. My sense is Dino reminded them that hitting the other guy harder matters.

Most of the progress the team has appeared to make is because Dungey is a junior and is healthy.

 

[HSPORANGE]

I like what I'm seeing. The D has been much improved. Dino and staff seems to be making good adjustments at halftime. Need to get the run game going so we can balance the o. That NC St team is loaded with seniors/upper classmen and has a good shot at 9 wins this season. Pitt game is fucillo huuuge next weekend.

 

[Crazylegs]

Most of the progress the team has appeared to make is because Dungey is a junior and is healthy.

True I'd say the D is better also.

 

[cusefan88]

It's going to be when we can finally redshirt most players and create a roster where guys have been in the program for 2-3 years before getting a big role.

From the current freshman I think you'll see that with Harper, Melifonwu, DeVito, Pierre, and D. Davis among others.

 

[CousCuse]

True I'd say the D is better also.

They are playing very hard.

 

[SaltineWarrior]

Let me preface this by saying we are only in year two of what will likely be at least a 4 year reclamation project.

Like many others, I came into this season believing we had 5 likely wins (the first three games along with Wake and BC) making Pitt the key to a potential bowl season. Middle Tennessee State blew that out of the water. But for me, the Pitt game is still meaningful, though not necessarily for bowl chances like we had all hoped.

The two games I was most interested in watching this season were the NC State and Pitt games not so much for this season, but as a measuring stick for how far we still have to go. We failed yesterday against the Pack, but again it is still early in the Babers' era. However, the truth is we will know for sure we have turned the corner when we start beating those two programs more than we lose to them. When we get to that point of beating those two programs more often then we lose to them, we can begin to focus on competing with the likes of Clemson, FSU, and Louisville in the Atlantic division.

Until such time, we will remain a mediocre bottom tier (along with Wake and BC) ACC team. And about all we can say for now is - at least we ain't Rutgers.

Cheers,
Neil

I will be happy once we stop proving we are the less disciplined team on the field. It's been this every year since Paul's last few years (maybe a few times under Marrone this was not true). Weather its penalties, execution or coaching decisions, we always seem to shoot ourselves in the foot. Even when we play an undisciplined, sloppy team we seem to play down to that or even lower level.

Football is a tough game on several levels and I get that our offense takes a while to work. But there are plenty of examples where young players, new coaches and programs that have less resources than SU execute well. Winning will take care of itself if this team (players and coaches alike) executes for an entire game. And I'm not talking about moral victories either. Right now it doesn't "feel" like SU is playing their potential. Until they clean this stuff up, sloppy and stupid play is this team's reality.

Here's hoping they prove me wrong.

 

[cusefan88]

The WR's next year post Erv/Ish look abysmal. Hopefully Neal can replace Erv but not confident in anyone on the outside.

 

[SU94]

The WR's next year post Erv/Ish look abysmal. Hopefully Neal can replace Erv but not confident in anyone on the outside.

How can you say this with a straight face? You have no idea. Is it a bit of an unknown? Sure. But looks "abysmal?"

Look, if there is any position that I am not worried about in Dino's system, it's at wideout.

 

[TheCusian]

Most of the progress the team has appeared to make is because Dungey is a junior and is healthy.

So, so wrong.

The D is a lot better at almost every position.

 

[CousCuse]

So, so wrong.

The D is a lot better at almost every position.

Where would this team be if they were forced to start a 5th string walk-on QB?

 

[OrangeinBoston]

Let me preface this by saying we are only in year two of what will likely be at least a 4 year reclamation project.

Like many others, I came into this season believing we had 5 likely wins (the first three games along with Wake and BC) making Pitt the key to a potential bowl season. Middle Tennessee State blew that out of the water. But for me, the Pitt game is still meaningful, though not necessarily for bowl chances like we had all hoped.

The two games I was most interested in watching this season were the NC State and Pitt games not so much for this season, but as a measuring stick for how far we still have to go. We failed yesterday against the Pack, but again it is still early in the Babers' era. However, the truth is we will know for sure we have turned the corner when we start beating those two programs more than we lose to them. When we get to that point of beating those two programs more often then we lose to them, we can begin to focus on competing with the likes of Clemson, FSU, and Louisville in the Atlantic division.

Until such time, we will remain a mediocre bottom tier (along with Wake and BC) ACC team. And about all we can say for now is - at least we ain't Rutgers.

Cheers,
Neil

Agree, SU is 2 or 3 recruiting classes away from being a bowl team. Watching NC State, while they had the accelerator floored in the first half, clearly showed the disparity in talent.

Of course, this ASSUMES that the recruiting classes improve in coming years. The last class was saved by JUCOs & transfers. If Babers didn't get those, you are looking at a class near the bottom of the ACC which is, screw the SEC, the best Fball conference in the land.

 

[Crusty]

Most of the progress the team has appeared to make is because Dungey is a junior and is healthy.

Yes, but that is what is needed to have a winning team. A good healthy QB above all else. However, I see much more than that. We have young corners that can actually play in the ACC. We are recruiting at a much better level. And the staff is much better from top to bottom.
While I am at it - the bad calls are really just calculated risks. It is axiomatic that coaches at this level see much more than us fans. They have reasons for onside kicks and time outs that we don't value as much as they do. Besides, if they work everyone on this site would be calling them gutsy. I like the aggressiveness. We have had enough of the defensive minded mentality that thinks we can stop them - quite enough.

Babers is the best thing to happen to us since perhaps, Coach Mac.

As Bill Polian says, "If you listen to the fans, you will soon be sitting with them!

 

[cusefan88]

How can you say this with a straight face? You have no idea. Is it a bit of an unknown? Sure. But looks "abysmal?"

Look, if there is any position that I am not worried about in Dino's system, it's at wideout.

Fine. Based on Butler and Custis, I have this opinion. Naturally I want to be wrong. It was a snap judgement like many posts on this fine website. You're probably right.

 

[TheCusian]

Where would this team be if they were forced to start a 5th string walk-on QB?

That's true of every single CFB team. C'mon.

 

[TheCusian]

Yes, but that is what is needed to have a winning team. A good healthy QB above all else. However, I see much more than that. We have young corners that can actually play in the ACC. We are recruiting at a much better level. And the staff is much better from top to bottom.
While I am at it - the bad calls are really just calculated risks. It is axiomatic that coaches at this level see much more than us fans. They have reasons for onside kicks and time outs that we don't value as much as they do. Besides, if they work everyone on this site would be calling them gutsy. I like the aggressiveness. We have had enough of the defensive minded mentality that thinks we can stop them - quite enough.

Babers is the best thing to happen to us since perhaps, Coach Mac.

As Bill Polian says, "If you listen to the fans, you will soon be sitting with them!

When asked about why he goes for it or what his strategy is ... his answer is math.

That is the right answer.

 

[TexanMark]

When asked about why he goes for it or what his strategy is ... his answer is math.

That is the right answer.

He failed on the math last game. The onside kick after the latest rule changes is only a last resort option. Its chance of success is about 5%.

Down 8, Cuse had better odds to kick long, get a 3 and out and move the ball 70-80 yards.

 

[TheCusian]

He failed on the math last game. The onside kick after the latest rule changes is only a last resort option. Its chance of success is about 5%.

Down 8, Cuse had better odds to kick long, get a 3 and out and move the ball 70-80 yards.

There is gray area here... Dino had 1 TO, 4:39 to go. NC State needs one 1st down to be able to take a knee. You’ll want to use your TO during their possession, if you get the stops. If you get a 3 and out, they punt and we’re 70-80 yards no TO, 2:30 left.

What happened: Onsides kick, 5% chance you get the ball on their side of the field with 1 TO and 4:39 on the clock. They get the ball, we stop them and force a 4th down and 1. (We stop them and get the ball on our own 38.. still need to go 62 yds with 2:30 left, no TO). They did convert, game over.

I think I would have kicked - but he did get two chances at the ball, both with better position with more time or similar time left.

 

[SmilinBob]

I don't understand why most teams on an onside kick just don't pop it over the front line and make it a free for all for the free ball. Once that ball hits the ground it can go anywhere.

 

[elimunelson]

I think we also have to hope that Dino can win 1-2 games where he punches above his talent weight too. Great coaches IMO find a way to win games where they had no business winning. I'm just hoping we get to a 5-6 range before talent can win us games again.

I know Dino is the right guy for the program. I'm not wavering on this. BUT, I want to see him win a few What games before the talent catches up.

 

[blizz]

He failed on the math last game. The onside kick after the latest rule changes is only a last resort option. Its chance of success is about 5%.

Down 8, Cuse had better odds to kick long, get a 3 and out and move the ball 70-80 yards.

Yeah but specialty kick dude. Dozens of threads and hundreds of posts, still haven't seen the stats on specialty kicks...just sayin.

 

[TexanMark]

There is gray area here... Dino had 1 TO, 4:39 to go. NC State needs one 1st down to be able to take a knee. You’ll want to use your TO during their possession, if you get the stops. If you get a 3 and out, they punt and we’re 70-80 yards no TO, 2:30 left.

What happened: Onsides kick, 5% chance you get the ball on their side of the field with 1 TO and 4:39 on the clock. They get the ball, we stop them and force a 4th down and 1. (We stop them and get the ball on our own 38.. still need to go 62 yds with 2:30 left, no TO). They did convert, game over.

I think I would have kicked - but he did get two chances at the ball, both with better position with more time or similar time left.

Just quibbling a bit...yes basically that is correct but lots of variables. Make no doubt Cuse's chance for victory was at 1-2% at best when they kicked off. If you kick off long. At most you would want NCSt to run no more than 5-6 plays. Hopefully you get a 3 and out and maybe they have a run OOB or an incomplete pass so you save a timeout. Cuse still would have to score, get two point play (their second one) and win in OT.

An on sides kick most likely would give you a ball somewhere around the 43-47 Cuse yard line. Why I hated it...was I have seen no evidence we have a kicker/team capable to execute one. I'd rather roll the dice kicking long.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Down 8, Cuse had better odds to kick long, get a 3 and out and move the ball 70-80 yards.

you’d have to hold them to a 3-and-out in either scenario. The only difference is 15 yards.