NBA Thread 2020-21 Season

[Melancer46]

More orange

Damnit

 

[jncuse]

I am just happy to report free agency is nearly 15 hours old and the Knicks haven't done anything approaching stupid yet!

I think by the end of the weekend either the Knicks or the Raptors will be accused by many of overpaying for Fred Van Vleet.

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

I think by the end of the weekend either the Knicks or the Raptors will be accused by many of overpaying for Fred Van Vleet.

Van Vleet 100% will be a Knick

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This is clearly a means to an end. There are 3 ways to build a team, and Presti is setting himeself up to use them all:
1) The Draft (especially being bottom 5)
2) Cap Space to Sign Players or as an Asset Accumulator by taking on bad contracts
3) Through Trades -- and this is a big part of his ultimate plan

Presti is also not going about this like Sam Hinkle. 2 Big Differences between what they are doing:
1) Presti was able to get much more of a head start in asset accumulation because of the Westbrook / George deals last summer. The Sixers did not have such valuable talent.
2) Hinkle's main plan was to try to get stars in the draft as soon as possible. When he traded Jrue Holiday it was on draft night for Nerlens Noel. When he traded MCW when he was a "hot" asset it was for a pick the next year.

Hinkle's main weapon to building was sucking to get high picks that would play for the Sixers. Presti already has the big head start in accumulated assets, and he has yet to even start the process of tanking to get some top draftees.

The result of these above two differences is huge. Presti will have much more trade capital to consolidate assets to bring top players together and a much longer window to do it with picks in 2023 to 2025. It gives him a much longer window to effectively use those picks as trade capital. Presti has shown that he will go for it, and consolidate assets, when he did the trades for George / Carmelo to join Russell. It did not work out, but he has been able to unwind for it pretty good.

So what he is doing.
1) Yes they are tanking to a degree, to get high picks in what apparently will be some strong drafts.
2) Oklahoma will not likely get stars to come to them via FA. However, he will have no problem making trades to bring 2 of them together in future years, and perhaps one of them when they are still not at max level.
3) When he gets his 1 or 2 stars in the draft, he can surround them with real talent via trade not let them flounder.

If you get an elite draft talent, add 2 stars via trade you might be attractive for players to remain for a while --and you might still have some cap space to bring in another all star who wants to win.

The above is an ideal scenario so it may not go exactly as planned, but they have the flexibility to grow.. Oklahoma City has to really accumulate assets to bring in talent outside of the draft. Presti realizes this. Presti has also shown in the past that he is not as pragmatic as say someone like Ainge -- Ainge has nickel and dimed trades in the past which has hurt some deals for the Celtics. When Presti decides to go for it he won't need to worry whether I should hassle over 2 picks instead of 3 or 4. Giving up 3 or 4 will not be a problem.

It could just end up creating a team that caps out in the 50-55 win area once again... or it could create a really good team.

One other thing to add here... as a small market team, they could also sell some of these picks for cash, which could help the books but also offset to a small degree things like luxury tax down the road.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Seems like a good move for the Rockets. I like it for them.
At the same I am always leery of the guy who puts up big numbers for a bad team and somebody needs to get shots -- and those stats are sometimes put up against opponents who aren't even close to playing 100% because the team (in this case) Detroit was so bad.

Totally. That's also why I phrased it that he's the most interesting free agent, and not the best free agent.

 

[OrangeDW]

More orange

Nice! He quietly had a solid year. Coach seems to really like him. Glad he’s still there, seems like he’s found a niche there.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Nice! He quietly had a solid year. Coach seems to really like him. Glad he’s still there, seems like he’s found a niche there.

Yeah, now that he's not carrying those ROY expectations anymore and can just be the solid, defensive bench guard he is, he's found his place in the NBA.

It's wild to me that Trey Burke from the same draft looked pretty washed but rallied and just got a 3 year deal yesterday.

 

[Arangeman]

VanVleet, Bogdanovic, Ibaka, Heyward trade, Melo... still some interesting names out there.

Anyone hear a peep on Melo?

 

[jncuse]

One other thing to add here... as a small market team, they could also sell some of these picks for cash, which could help the books but also offset to a small degree things like luxury tax down the road.

I don't know if anybody has sold a first for cash for quite some time.

But say in 2023, I could see Presti trading a 2023 First for a 2026 First + Cash.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I don't know if anybody has sold a first for cash for quite some time.

But say in 2023, I could see Presti trading a 2023 First for a 2026 First + Cash.

True, but nobody has had the stockpile OKC has. I mean, they legitimately may not have roster spots to keep all of their picks.

As for your second point, can you trade a pick for cash and picks? For some reason I thought if you took cash, you could only take straight cash, not anything else.

 

[jncuse]

True, but nobody has had the stockpile OKC has. I mean, they legitimately may not have roster spots to keep all of their picks.

As for your second point, can you trade a pick for cash and picks? For some reason I thought if you took cash, you could only take straight cash, not anything else.

You might be right on that. Not sure on the rule.

 

[jncuse]

Van Vleet 100% will be a Knick

I think he ends up back with the Raptors, but he is certainly using competing offers as leverage. Apparently he is meeting with 3 teams in Chicago today. Only the Knicks have cap space, so whomever that other party is would need to do an S&T.

FVV had been pretty open that he is all about getting a fair amount of cash. He did re-iterate in a podcast this week that he was not going to play games, and play teams off each other, but that seems to be exactly what he is doing... which is his right as a free agent.

 

[jncuse]

There were rumours out there during the season and after the season that there was some significant issues between Harrell and Kawhi.

His signing with the Lakers at what seems to be a discount does nothing to discount those rumours.

 

[Arangeman]

There were rumours out there during the season and after the season that there was some significant issues between Harrell and Kawhi.

His signing with the Lakers at what seems to be a discount does nothing to discount those rumours.

Klutch

 

[jncuse]

Updated odds for the NBA Title per Bet365

Lakers +290
Nets +500
Bucks +600
Clippers +600
Celtics +1400
Heat +1600

 

[jncuse]

Klutch

Yes that was certainly a big part of the reason as well, but I don't discount spite either as a large factor.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Man, this Adams deal for New Orleans is really good.

Ingram/Zion/Adams is a nasty frontcourt.

Their guard depth is phenomenal - Bledsoe/Lonzo/Hart/Reddick/Hill.

They've got a few young guys that are interesting.

Feels like they could use a little more depth at forward, but that's a nice team.

 

[jncuse]

Man, this Adams deal for New Orleans is really good.

Ingram/Zion/Adams is a nasty frontcourt.

Their guard depth is phenomenal - Bledsoe/Lonzo/Hart/Reddick/Hill.

They've got a few young guys that are interesting.

Feels like they could use a little more depth at forward, but that's a nice team.

I liked that deal for the Pelicans as well. If they can retain players and consolidate some of their draft capital and players, there window is not that far away. That being said I don't trust Zion as the big piece in my core due to health reasons.

I thought Adams value was more than a 2023 Lotto Protected First.

 

[Arangeman]

Updated odds for the NBA Title per Bet365

Lakers +290
Nets +500
Bucks +600
Clippers +600
Celtics +1400
Heat +1600

Probably early in their timeline but the Pelicans at +6500 seem like a viable long shot. Mavs +2100. I’ll Probly put a little on the Celtics at those odds if they get Turner.

 

[OrangeDW]

Man, this Adams deal for New Orleans is really good.

Ingram/Zion/Adams is a nasty frontcourt.

Their guard depth is phenomenal - Bledsoe/Lonzo/Hart/Reddick/Hill.

They've got a few young guys that are interesting.

Feels like they could use a little more depth at forward, but that's a nice team.

Agreed. They’re gonna be a sneaky good 6 seed or something.

 

[Arangeman]

Yes that was certainly a big part of the reason as well, but I don't discount spite either as a large factor.

I don’t disagree. Hopeful that Trez is motivated. He’s basically playing for a big contract again.

As Contenders Scurry to Keep Up, the Lakers Have Gotten Even Better

Days after trading for Dennis Schröder, the champs added Montrezl Harrell and Wes Matthews

www.theringer.com

 

[OrangeDW]

Wait, did I hear that Toronto will be playing home games in Tampa? Was this discussed here? Why in Tampa? They can’t work out a deal with the Sabres and play in that arena?

Or is this about helping their players out by not subjecting them to living in Buffalo in the winter and getting them into a more pleasant place to temporarily live?

 

[jncuse]

Probably early in their timeline but the Pelicans at +6500 seem like a viable long shot. Mavs +2100. I’ll Probly put a little on the Celtics at those odds if they get Turner.

Those are all solid bets.

I liked the Celtics at +1400 as well.

Pelicans have the draft assets to make a few "stunning moves" between now and the deadline to move them up the ladder quickly. Not bad at 65-1 either.

And although very unlikely, maybe the Bucks are forced to move off Giannis, and the Mavs trade for him. Makes the Mavs a worthy bet.

I have the Pelicans at +6000 on my site, but Mavs at +2500.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Wait, did I hear that Toronto will be playing home games in Tampa? Was this discussed here? Why in Tampa? They can’t work out a deal with the Sabres and play in that arena?

Or is this about helping their players out by not subjecting them to living in Buffalo in the winter and getting them into a more pleasant place to temporarily live?

I'm not sure why, but it sounded like they were looking exclusively for places in Florida.

 

[jncuse]

Wait, did I hear that Toronto will be playing home games in Tampa? Was this discussed here? Why in Tampa? They can’t work out a deal with the Sabres and play in that arena?

Or is this about helping their players out by not subjecting them to living in Buffalo in the winter and getting them into a more pleasant place to temporarily live?

Biggest factors seem to be:
Weather
State taxes
Ability to have some fans.