NCAA threatens to boot the whole state of California if bill becomes law

[maxxyz]

This women’s performance went viral last year.

She could have likely gotten some endorsements from all the publicity but the NCAA rules wouldn’t let her.

California Law will help women athletes as well even from non-revenue sports.

Not to quibble, but this law will only benefit about 0.5% of all D1 athletes.

Start a 32 team league major college league. Make the football & basketball players in the league employees, not students. They sign a contract, can sell their likeness, and can be cut. Let the rest of the colleges carry on as is.

 

[RandomGuy]

Exactly my point.

The politicians will come in and pass legislation that they think makes them look good. And the schools and their agent, the NCAA, will deal with the obvious and unintended consequences.

The American people have caught on to this and that’s why they view all politicians as frauds, crooks and opportunists.

I wish they didn't have to. Other than competitive advantage, what are the issues you see with allowing them to participate in a market for their likeness?

I did post some labor examples where I think we all agree, were good legislation.

 

[Townie72]

I wish they didn't have to. Other than competitive advantage, what are the issues you see with allowing them to participate in a market for their likeness?

I did post some labor examples where I think we all agree, were good legislation.

How about local car dealer boosters using this as a way to funnel money to players?

Also, child labor laws are a hangover from the Industrial revolution. I couldn't caddy at the local golf club til I was 14.

But like all Government programs they going forever regardless of the need.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Not to quibble, but this law will only benefit about 0.5% of all D1 athletes.

1, we don't know that, and 2, so what?

 

[RandomGuy]

How about local car dealer boosters using this as a way to funnel money to players?

Also, child labor laws are a hangover from the Industrial revolution. I couldn't caddy at the local golf club til I was 14.

But like all Government programs they going forever regardless of the need.

Other than competitive advantage, what is the problem with a car dealer funneling $$ to a player? (For use of their likeness, of course)

Didnt a certain Cuse dealership kinda sorta do something like that way back when?

 

[Townie72]

Other than competitive advantage, what is the problem with a car dealer funneling $$ to a player? (For use of their likeness, of course)

What's the problem?

You gotta be kidding? Talk about opening the barn door.

And yes, SU booster car dealers did give special benefits to players. And the NCAA has tried to stop this sort of thing sometimes going to what seem to be ridiculous lengths. But the problem has always been to draw the line. If you flat-out prohibit something you don't have to split hairs on enforcement.

If you buy into the idea that everyone is greedy and the players are abused (uncompensated labor) then you are going to think this is a great idea.

 

[maxxyz]

1, we don't know that, and 2, so what?

Because it reeks of how our country is handled right now. Making laws that help a small percentage of the population without regard to how it affects the remaining 99.5%.

The anarchy that will come over the next years is a complete unknown. Maybe everything will work out fine. But they passed a law with no regard to consequences.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Because it reeks of how our country is handled right now. Making laws that help a small percentage of the population without regard to how it affects the remaining 99.5%.

That's an impressive leap.

 

[SU2NASA]

I wouldn’t pay a 5* recruit for appearances until he actually enrolls and shows up for his first appearance. But that’s just me...

What’s to stop making the contract contingent on that person enrolling in the specified school?

And anyway, I’d be paying younger high school kids. Yeah, most of them wouldn’t pan out, and might not get offers, but they’d be pennies on the dollar versus juniors and seniors.

 

[RandomGuy]

.

Because it reeks of how our country is handled right now. Making laws that help a small percentage of the population without regard to how it affects the remaining 99.5%.

The anarchy that will come over the next years is a complete unknown. Maybe everything will work out fine. But they passed a law with no regard to consequences.

I believe the intent of the law is to restore the right most other Americans have, that have been taken by the NCAA. I'm good with that.

 

[maxxyz]

.
I believe the intent of the law is to restore the right most other Americans have, that have been taken by the NCAA. I'm good with that.

So state politicians quickly push thru a law that lowers the the drinking age to 18 years old, and it starts tomorrow. This restores the right to drink for 18-21 year olds that was ripped away from them for a totally unfounded reason and is very popular with college students. Wouldn’t you want to make sure of the potential consequences and possibly roll it out on a timeline that would allow municipalities to adjust?

 

[upperdeck]

the had the Calif person sponsoring the law on ESPN today.. almost every question she answered "we dont know how that will work" thats why they pushed it out to 2023 so someone else could solve all the issues it creates.

 

[Townie72]

This is going to be great.

Now boosters will be able to funnel money to players and write it off on their taxes.

 

[HtownOrange]

.
I believe the intent of the law is to restore the right most other Americans have, that have been taken by the NCAA. I'm good with that.

The NCAA cannot take anything away, that is a false premise. The player gives away the right to his image and name while playing for an NCAA school. The kids may do as he likes and forgo the NCAA stage to showcase his talents and get a free ride to college, but he chooses to give away the right to make a few bucks for a $400K education (after full benefits and tax advantages are calculated into the entire deal) and the chance to showcase their talents in hopes of the bigger Pro contract.

The whole premise of kids making money off their likeness is a fraud of an argument because the kid cannot be made to sign a letter of intent. Several people like to bring up Zion, guess what, he made the decision to skip the Blaezly route, showcase his talents for a year and make a huge contract. It stinks that he has no loyalty to his school, but that is his option to exercise. Does anyone not think SU could have won another title (or two or three) had Carmello Anthony stayed in school?

The NBA refuses to take kids fresh out of HS. The NFL refuses to take kids under 20. The kids have several options, just because you do not like the options does not mean the kid is forced into anything. Most of us agree that the NCAA is the best option Conveniently, most of us are college educated and most of us understand staying in the lime light makes it easier to attack attention from the pros than working in construction trades, retail, driving trucks, etc. However, that does not lessen the fact that the kid has a choice.

Ironically, you and others have refused to acknowledge that the kid gets the "right most other Americans have" once he leaves school. This reinforces the point that the kid has a choice, weighed his options and chose to sign away the right while in school.

I would like the system changed to give kids a little more. However, I do NOT want the Congress, a looney state legislature, or the courts to make the decision, I want the parties involved to make the decision. Our whole economy is based on private parties and entities making contracts WITHOUT government involvement and it works pretty good. People seem to make decisions in their own best interest (NOTE: NOT your best interest or my best interest, but in their own best interest, whether common sense agrees or not.)

 

[RandomGuy]

So state politicians quickly push thru a law that lowers the the drinking age to 18 years old, and it starts tomorrow. This restores the right to drink for 18-21 year olds that was ripped away from them for a totally unfounded reason and is very popular with college students. Wouldn’t you want to make sure of the potential consequences and possibly roll it out on a timeline that would allow municipalities to adjust?

Raising the drinking age was to reduce vehicle deaths. No one is going to die if their rights are restored.

 

[RandomGuy]

The NCAA cannot take anything away, that is a false premise. The player gives away the right to his image and name while playing for an NCAA school. The kids may do as he likes and forgo the NCAA stage to showcase his talents and get a free ride to college, but he chooses to give away the right to make a few bucks for a $400K education (after full benefits and tax advantages are calculated into the entire deal) and the chance to showcase their talents in hopes of the bigger Pro contract.

The whole premise of kids making money off their likeness is a fraud of an argument because the kid cannot be made to sign a letter of intent. Several people like to bring up Zion, guess what, he made the decision to skip the Blaezly route, showcase his talents for a year and make a huge contract. It stinks that he has no loyalty to his school, but that is his option to exercise. Does anyone not think SU could have won another title (or two or three) had Carmello Anthony stayed in school?

The NBA refuses to take kids fresh out of HS. The NFL refuses to take kids under 20. The kids have several options, just because you do not like the options does not mean the kid is forced into anything. Most of us agree that the NCAA is the best option Conveniently, most of us are college educated and most of us understand staying in the lime light makes it easier to attack attention from the pros than working in construction trades, retail, driving trucks, etc. However, that does not lessen the fact that the kid has a choice.

Ironically, you and others have refused to acknowledge that the kid gets the "right most other Americans have" once he leaves school. This reinforces the point that the kid has a choice, weighed his options and chose to sign away the right while in school.

I would like the system changed to give kids a little more. However, I do NOT want the Congress, a looney state legislature, or the courts to make the decision, I want the parties involved to make the decision. Our whole economy is based on private parties and entities making contracts WITHOUT government involvement and it works pretty good. People seem to make decisions in their own best interest (NOTE: NOT your best interest or my best interest, but in their own best interest, whether common sense agrees or not.)

They have no option, should they want to play football. That's why the NCAA was found in violation of antitrust laws.(Alston vs. NCAA)

 

[NKR1978]

The NCAA cannot take anything away, that is a false premise. The player gives away the right to his image and name while playing for an NCAA school. The kids may do as he likes and forgo the NCAA stage to showcase his talents and get a free ride to college, but he chooses to give away the right to make a few bucks for a $400K education (after full benefits and tax advantages are calculated into the entire deal) and the chance to showcase their talents in hopes of the bigger Pro contract.

The whole premise of kids making money off their likeness is a fraud of an argument because the kid cannot be made to sign a letter of intent. Several people like to bring up Zion, guess what, he made the decision to skip the Blaezly route, showcase his talents for a year and make a huge contract. It stinks that he has no loyalty to his school, but that is his option to exercise. Does anyone not think SU could have won another title (or two or three) had Carmello Anthony stayed in school?

The NBA refuses to take kids fresh out of HS. The NFL refuses to take kids under 20. The kids have several options, just because you do not like the options does not mean the kid is forced into anything. Most of us agree that the NCAA is the best option Conveniently, most of us are college educated and most of us understand staying in the lime light makes it easier to attack attention from the pros than working in construction trades, retail, driving trucks, etc. However, that does not lessen the fact that the kid has a choice.

Ironically, you and others have refused to acknowledge that the kid gets the "right most other Americans have" once he leaves school. This reinforces the point that the kid has a choice, weighed his options and chose to sign away the right while in school.

I would like the system changed to give kids a little more. However, I do NOT want the Congress, a looney state legislature, or the courts to make the decision, I want the parties involved to make the decision. Our whole economy is based on private parties and entities making contracts WITHOUT government involvement and it works pretty good. People seem to make decisions in their own best interest (NOTE: NOT your best interest or my best interest, but in their own best interest, whether common sense agrees or not.)

I appreciate this and your long response the other night that I didn’t have the time to answer properly. You make some really good points, the NCAA makes rules, and it seems that there are some schools, conferences and states that want those rules changed.

The education may be worth $x, but it doesn’t actually cost the school anything. And it isn’t like the schools are running athletics programs, especially P5 program, to be altruistic. They only reason they don’t want money getting in players’ hands is because it means less money for them in the form of donations.

 

[Townie72]

Here’s how it will work.

“Recruit, if you come to our school we have a booster that give you an advertising / PR job that’ll net you $20,000 a year to start. if you make All Conference, your deal with this guy gets better”


And/or.

Dear prized recruit,

Did you know that our average starting player earned $10,000 last year and only had to show up twice to shake a few hands at a car dealership? Our players made more money for their likenesses than any other team in our conference!

Just imagine what you could do with these thousands of dollars..

Signed, Bill Jones
Coach and Recruiting Coordinator

Tell me how this won’t be allowed under this law.

if Nike can do it, why can’t Sam’s Muffler Shop?

Who can prove this isn’t a legit business expense for Sam’s Muffler Shop?

 

[NKR1978]

Here’s how it will work.

“Recruit, if you come to our school we have a booster that give you an advertising / PR job that’ll net you $20,000 a year to start. if you make All Conference, your deal with this guy gets better”


And/or.

Dear prized recruit,

Did you know that our average starting player earned $10,000 last year and only had to show up twice to shake a few hands at a car dealership? Our players made more money for their likenesses than any other team in our conference!

Just imagine what you could do with these thousands of dollars..

Signed, Bill Jones
Coach and Recruiting Coordinator

Tell me how this won’t be allowed under this law.

if Nike can do it, why can’t Sam’s Muffler Shop?

Who can prove this isn’t a legit business expense for Sam’s Muffler Shop?

Exactly! That’s the point. Why is that bad?

 

[HtownOrange]

They have no option, should they want to play football. That's why the NCAA was found in violation of antitrust laws.(Alston vs. NCAA)

Again, you don't like their choices and you believe a $100k/year deal is worth nothing to a kid dreaming of the pros. The choice exists whether you agree with it or not. Play football under X deal or don't play. Regardless, it is still a choice.

 

[HtownOrange]

I appreciate this and your long response the other night that I didn’t have the time to answer properly. You make some really good points, the NCAA makes rules, and it seems that there are some schools, conferences and states that want those rules changed.

The education may be worth $x, but it doesn’t actually cost the school anything. And it isn’t like the schools are running athletics programs, especially P5 program, to be altruistic. They only reason they don’t want money getting in players’ hands is because it means less money for them in the form of donations.

It does cost a school money. There are only so many seats in a class. Books, room, board are not free. The equipment, training, enhanced dining, stadium, etc. are not free. Whether state or private, the cost is borne by others (Donors or taxpayers) and the kid benefits.

 

[NKR1978]

Again, you don't like their choices and you believe a $100k/year deal is worth nothing to a kid dreaming of the pros. The choice exists whether you agree with it or not. Play football under X deal or don't play. Regardless, it is still a choice.

But you make it sound as though the schools are the only ones marketing the athlete. Conferences, media partners, the NCAA and other random businesses get to license footage and use them in commercials (Buffalo Wild Wings comes to mind) with no compensation.

 

[NKR1978]

It does cost a school money. There are only so many seats in a class. Books, room, board are not free. The equipment, training, enhanced dining, stadium, etc. are not free. Whether state or private, the cost is borne by others (Donors or taxpayers) and the kid benefits.

The seats are long since accounted for.

The dining, etc., is done for the sole purpose of winning games. It’s not an altruistic investment.

 

[Townie72]

Exactly! That’s the point. Why is that bad?

You should be able to figure that out by yourself. You seem like a bright guy.

Boosters unchained. Bidding wars among schools. Kids with more money than sense.

What could possibly go wrong?

 

[HtownOrange]

But you make it sound as though the schools are the only ones marketing the athlete. Conferences, media partners, the NCAA and other random businesses get to license footage and use them in commercials (Buffalo Wild Wings comes to mind) with no compensation.

I have been consistent that I would like a change but I want the parties involved making the change, not any government or court.

Additionally, the schools will lose the marketing revenue to be paid to players. As most schools lose money, this will make them lose more. Marketing is not going to magically come up with truckloads dollars to pay athletes, they will reduce payouts to schools.