New game: Coach or Brand

[Capt. Tuttle]

All of the following schools are successful basketball schools. The question is whether it is because the school is a brand or because for the past X years, they have had a great coach. Here is a list with my opinion. Feel free to add your own:

UNC - Brand
Kentucky - Brand
Kansas - Brand
UCLA - Brand
Indiana- Brand
MSU - leaning toward brand because of past successes

Syracuse - to be detemined
UCONN - to be determined
Duke - to be determined, leaning toward brand because of prior final fours
Gonzaga - to be determined, but 2 succesful coaches in a row lean me toward brand

Michigan - I think coach - you know the name, but not a real deciding factor for recruits.
OSU - see Michigan
Florida - coach
Butler - coach
GTown -lean toward coach, given Esherick, plus the style changed so much with JT3 its hard to say brand

SJU - should be a brand, but I say coach
Nova - I say coach, until I see what the next guy does.
Arizona - seems to be a brand, with how quickly Miller has cranked things up.
WVU - coach

KSU - coach
Texas - tough to say, but at this point I lean toward coach. (for bball)
Missouri - I always think of Mizzou as a good basketball school, so for me, Brand.

 

[orange79]

I would say SU has become a brand, because of the coach.

 

[SouthCampusHero]

I recall JB talking about this not that long ago. He mentioned how UCLA, UNC and Duke among others, were all brands. He said that once a program reaching 'brand status,' it is much easier to maintain a high level of success. JB cited the Carrier Dome and the 2-3 zone as Syracuse's 'brand.' So he thinks we are there.

 

[jekelish]

Syracuse, UConn and Duke might all be "brands" but if so, that's based purely on the coach in each case.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

I guess my unarticulated question was " can SU, Uconn and Duke have continued success after their iconic coaches leave or are tghey the brand"?

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[jordoo]

I would say SU has become a brand, because of the coach.

This. And pretty much every team you consider a brand had some coach that made them that way at some point.

 

[jekelish]

I guess my unarticulated question was " can SU, Uconn and Duke have continued success after their iconic coaches leave or are tghey the brand"?

Sent from my Vortex using Tapatalk

I say yes, absolutely, particularly in the case of Duke. I'd say, in order, the odds of a school becoming a "brand" out of those three are 1) Duke 2) Syracuse 3) UConn (Syracuse ahead of UConn primarily because we've been on the radar a lot longer).

 

[Bayside44]

I would say coach, which is the case with all Big East schools. JB does seem to work under market. The facility upgrades, etc make it easier for the next guy to sustain it and make it a brand. So coinflip :noidea:

 

[pfister1]

All of the following schools are successful basketball schools. The question is whether it is because the school is a brand or because for the past X years, they have had a great coach. Here is a list with my opinion. Feel free to add your own:

UNC - Brand
Kentucky - Brand
Kansas - Brand
UCLA - Brand
Indiana- Brand
MSU - leaning toward brand because of past successes

Syracuse - to be detemined
UCONN - to be determined
Duke - to be determined, leaning toward brand because of prior final fours
Gonzaga - to be determined, but 2 succesful coaches in a row lean me toward brand

Michigan - I think coach - you know the name, but not a real deciding factor for recruits.
OSU - see Michigan
Florida - coach
Butler - coach
GTown -lean toward coach, given Esherick, plus the style changed so much with JT3 its hard to say brand

SJU - should be a brand, but I say coach
Nova - I say coach, until I see what the next guy does.
Arizona - seems to be a brand, with how quickly Miller has cranked things up.
WVU - coach

KSU - coach
Texas - tough to say, but at this point I lean toward coach. (for bball)
Missouri - I always think of Mizzou as a good basketball school, so for me, Brand.

What does it take to be considered a brand and what is your definition of success?

For me it would mean that the basketball world thinks of that program as one of the top programs in the sport. And, I think the question you are really asking is will that place transcend the contributions of a single coach (or survive the departure of that coach.)

Gonzaga for example. I would not have even put them in the discussion. Sure they've had some nice seasons, but if they were to fall off the face of the earth tomorrow have they really accomplished anything that would keep them front of mind as a part of basketball history? They are not top 50 All time in wins and have only made it past the Sweet 16 in the tournament once.

I don't think Syracuse is a TBD. Sure JB has been a huge part of what the program is today, but it is 5th All time in wins - that isn't all on the back of JB. SU has two Helms National championships from prior to the JB era. It has a Final Four appearance from prior to the JB as head coach era.

A big one that you missed is Louisville. 2 National Championships, 8 Final Fours, 19th All time winningest program, Two Iconic coaches (Crum and Pitino).

 

[Rossco123]

I think it is all coach from one generation to another: Pitino & Cal pull Kentucky out of the trash; Pitino draggs LVlle back to Crum level; no JT11, no GT., UConn out of nowhere with Calhoun and probably back there when he goes -- etc.
It is going to be really tough for Hop but if he succeeds we really are a brand.

 

[texascpa]

indiana is coach. That have sucked since knight was canned.

 

[PoppyHart]

Any marketing professor will tell you that they are all brands.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Syracuse, UConn and Duke might all be "brands" but if so, that's based purely on the coach in each case.

Duke is clearly a brand. They were a final four team before coach k and they have quality basketball history going back to the 60s.

 

[billsin01]

Yeah, I'd say Duke has become a brand. Jury is out on the Cuse.

 

[OrangeMuskyFish]

The programs are all a brand, and the coaches make up a huge part of it, so separating the coaches from the brand isn't all that easy. When it comes to Syracuse University, Boeheim is a much bigger influence on the Syracuse brand than the coaches at 99% of the other schools. Jim has shown longevity, an ability to win, the ability to recruit, become synonymous with his community, and won his title. For his successor, it will be hard enough to just maintain the current brand. To strengthen it, he's going to have to win at least another national championship, while adding some twist of his own to what JB has already laid down.