OT: Florida Fires Head Coach Will Muschamp

[Millhouse]

The firing was rushed, and that led to the disaster that followed.

What's it tell you that a guy that had been fired twice in the five years prior, the last time having the the worst and 4th worst defenses in the NFL his two years in KC, and a one season, not one year, but one season stint as Co-DC at UT, a program that had gone 10-3 the year before, was the BEST candidate in the pool, for HC no less.

it doesn't tell us that the firing was rushed

maybe it tells you gross had lousy criteria

 

[rrlbees]

It was rushed, you had an AD who had been on the job for less than month pushed by a Chancellor who had been there less than a year. That is the definition of rushed. They had no business making that the decision at that time. It was reckless and incompetent and has had negative consequences to this day.

I bet if gross had been there a year and P fired in September the list would have basically been the same.

 

[GoSU96]

it doesn't tell us that the firing was rushed

The statement that the firing was rushed stands on its own.

 

[rrlbees]

The firing was rushed, and that led to the disaster that followed. What's it tell you that a guy that had been fired twice in the five years prior, the last time having the the worst and 4th worst defenses in the NFL his two years in KC, and a one season, not one year, but one season stint as Co-DC at UT, a program that had gone 10-3 the year before, was the BEST candidate in the pool, for HC no less.

You can do what you're doing with any coach. I don't think there's a coach alive that has only had great success. How did those 3 years at UConn go? How are those middle of the road Bears defense doing? Anyone can cherry pick. Thing with GRob is that people far far smarter than you or I kept hiring the guy. Both pro and college.

 

[GoSU96]

I bet if gross had been there a year and P fired in September the list would have basically been the same.

Just shows what an idiot he was then. He's grown into the job.

 

[Millhouse]

Just shows what an idiot he was then. He's grown into the job.

i won't forget that sinking feeling when gerg started talking about west coast offense.

 

[KaiserUEO]

The firing was rushed, and that led to the disaster that followed.

What's it tell you that a guy that had been fired twice in the five years prior, the last time having the the worst and 4th worst defenses in the NFL his two years in KC, and a one season, not one year, but one season stint as Co-DC at UT, a program that had gone 10-3 the year before, was the BEST candidate in the pool, for HC no less.

giving gross about $7.44 to go hire a staff with was the bigger fail.

ive been against gross hiring a 4th guy from the get go.

they both need to go.

ive laid it out before...gross should be gone this spring, new guy gives SS the fall.

he will fail, be fired...and we start fresh in 16.

 

[rrlbees]

The statement that the firing was rushed stands on its own.

Then every hire that didn't work out was rushed. Must be P's hiring in Connecticut was rushed.

 

[Alsacs]

I heard from Florida friend the Gator AD wants one of Hugh Freeze, David Cutcliffe, or Jim McElwain as the next Florida HC.

I agree with Kaiser about SS but he isn't getting popped for another year.

 

[Chip]

i won't forget that sinking feeling when gerg started talking about west coast offense.

I'll never forget when GRob was talking about the first time Pariani met Bob Wylie and they started drawing up their vision for offense on the whiteboard, and how much they were on the same page and everything was going to gel.

I found a copy of the whiteboard session.

 

[Full_Rebar]

Can we all agree that we're glad SU didn't get Skip Holtz when DG wanted him?

 

[rrlbees]

Can we all agree that we're glad SU didn't get Skip Holtz when DG wanted him?

We'll never know. Maybe he would have been successful here.

 

[KaiserUEO]

We'll never know. Maybe he would have been successful here.

and if i just bought 1 more megamillions ticket...

 

[GoSU96]

Then every hire that didn't work out was rushed. Must be P's hiring in Connecticut was rushed.

I said getting rid of P when they did was the rushed part. You're arguing against something I didn't say.

Gross was in the job for 3 weeks, he might have had a profile and names in mind, doesn't mean the timing was right or that he knew the program, the issues it faced, and what was really needed.

 

[GoSU96]

i won't forget that sinking feeling when gerg started talking about west coast offense.

West coast offense with Perry Patterson and Joe Fields as the returning QB's.

Jesus

Pariani having a nervous breakdown in the box, that stupid jump stop drop back.

 

[ssbriefcase]

I heard from Florida friend the Gator AD wants one of Hugh Freeze, David Cutcliffe, or Jim McElwain as the next Florida HC.

I agree with Kaiser about SS but he isn't getting popped for another year.

Been hearing McElwain is the favorite a lot today on our local radio. He brought CSU up from the basement. Yeah, they don't play anyone, but somehow they're top 25 now..

 

[GoSU96]

You can do what you're doing with any coach. I don't think there's a coach alive that has only had great success. How did those 3 years at UConn go? How are those middle of the road Bears defense doing? Anyone can cherry pick. Thing with GRob is that people far far smarter than you or I kept hiring the guy. Both pro and college.

Robinson was and is horrible. When there is any aspect of success it's a surprise.

2000 - his last year in Denver, 24th in TD, 30th in Yds per play allowed, 7th in rush defense, 31st pass defense, 23rd scoring defense.

2001 - KC 23rd TD, 23 ypp, 27th rush def, 14th pass def, 23rd scoring

2002 - 32rd TD, 30 ypp, 24th rush, 31st pass, 28th scoring

2003 29th TD, 25th ypp, 30th rush, 2oth pass, 19th scoring

2004 UT - 23rd TD, 16th rush, 58th pass, 18th scoring. One season, co-DC, 10-3 the year before

2005 SU 57th TD, 97th rush, 21st pass, 67th scoring, 1-10 record

2006 107th TD, 110th rush, 76th pass, 72nd scoring, 4-8 record

2007 111th TD, 108th rush, 102nd pass, 104th scoring, 3-9 record

2008 101st TD, 101st rush, 83rd pass, 101st scoring, 2-10 record

SU tenure, worst four years in school history, 4 worst offenses, 3 worst defenses in school history.

That wasn't just a "it just didn't work out" he was a complete system failure onto himself.

Shafer comes in the next year, 37th TD, 13th rushing, 85th pass, 81st Scoring

He picked up from Shafer at UM 2009. Year before under Shafer, 69th TD, 50 Rush, 87th pass, 83 rd scoring

2009 82nd TD, 91st Rush, 67th Pass, 77th scoring

2010 110th TD, 95th Rush, 112th Pass, 108 scoring.

Within four years Greg Robinson managed to have the worst defenses in the history of both SU and Michigan. Within 9 seasons (KC 2002, SU 2007, UM 2010) he was the coordinator of the three worst defenses playing at that level that season.

His great recent "success" is UT last year 68th, 83 rush, 53 pass, 57 scoring.

This year he is DC at 3-9 San Jose St, remarkably they are 26th in total defense, but that is because they are 11oth in rush def and teams don't bother throwing against them. They are 1st in pass defense, so that got that going for them, I guess. Even if teams don't throw against them they are 69th in scoring.

On his own as a college DC or HC his rush defenses have been 97th, 110th, 108th, 101st, 91st, 95th, 83rd, and 110th at four different schools. See a consistent pattern there? And it's right in line with his performance in the NFL. Want to tell me what I'm cherry picking there?

It was common knowledge coming out of the NFL that his run defense schemes and the way he coached them were awful.

You can't win if you can't stop the run. First job of any defense and he has failed at every stop.

Find another coach with that history of disaster.

 

[Chip]

Can we all agree that we're glad SU didn't get Skip Holtz when DG wanted him?

He has his Louisiana Tech team at 6-0 in Con USA.

But I'm ok that it fell thru. Paying him over $2M per year would have left little for the staff. He would have just cashed checks until we fired him.

 

[rrlbees]

Robinson was and is horrible. When there is any aspect of success it's a surprise. 2000 - his last year in Denver, 24th in TD, 30th in Yds per play allowed, 7th in rush defense, 31st pass defense, 23rd scoring defense. 2001 - KC 23rd TD, 23 ypp, 27th rush def, 14th pass def, 23rd scoring 2002 - 32rd TD, 30 ypp, 24th rush, 31st pass, 28th scoring 2003 29th TD, 25th ypp, 30th rush, 2oth pass, 19th scoring 2004 UT - 23rd TD, 16th rush, 58th pass, 18th scoring. One season, co-DC, 10-3 the year before 2005 SU 57th TD, 97th rush, 21st pass, 67th scoring, 1-10 record 2006 107th TD, 110th rush, 76th pass, 72nd scoring, 4-8 record 2007 111th TD, 108th rush, 102nd pass, 104th scoring, 3-9 record 2008 101st TD, 101st rush, 83rd pass, 101st scoring, 2-10 record SU tenure, worst four years in school history, 4 worst offenses, 3 worst defenses in school history. That wasn't just a "it just didn't work out" he was a complete system failure onto himself. Shafer comes in the next year, 37th TD, 13th rushing, 85th pass, 81st Scoring He picked up from Shafer at UM 2009. Year before under Shafer, 69th TD, 50 Rush, 87th pass, 83 rd scoring 2009 82nd TD, 91st Rush, 67th Pass, 77th scoring 2010 110th TD, 95th Rush, 112th Pass, 108 scoring. Within four years Greg Robinson managed to have the worst defenses in the history of both SU and Michigan. Within 9 seasons (KC 2002, SU 2007, UM 2010) he was the coordinator of the three worst defenses playing at that level that season. His great recent "success" is UT last year 68th, 83 rush, 53 pass, 57 scoring. This year he is DC at 3-9 San Jose St, remarkably they are 26th in total defense, but that is because they are 11oth in rush def and teams don't bother throwing against them. They are 1st in pass defense, so that got that going for them, I guess. Even if teams don't throw against them they are 69th in scoring. On his own as a college DC or HC his rush defenses have been 97th, 110th, 108th, 101st, 91st, 95th, 83rd, and 110th at four different schools. See a consistent pattern there? And it's right in line with his performance in the NFL. Want to tell me what I'm cherry picking there? It was common knowledge coming out of the NFL that his run defense schemes and the way he coached them were awful. You can't win if you can't stop the run. First job of any defense and he has failed at every stop. Find another coach with that history of disaster.

Again cherry picking and even being deceptive.

How about his Broncos teams? 2 superbowls. 4th in yards allowed and 7th in points allowed. Then 12th in yards allowed and 8th in points allowed.

You over simplify KC. Zero talent there as they were built for offense always having 5-6 pro bowlers on offense and 1 on defense. After Grob left? Those defensive stats got worse.

Texas? He was co-defensive coordinator. Why is that a negative? Their defense was very good. He had something to do with that.

SU? Sure he was a bad HC. Nobody ever denied that. Those defensive stats? Yea, real bad. But his first year here they got better from P's last year. That senior class had some talent, but P didn't get anything out of them. After that it was the culmination of 3 years of bad recruiting and no speed. 2002-2004.

Michigan? You know this too. But he and Shafer were both forced to play a 3-3-5 defense which does not work in a power football league like the B10. Multiple analysts said that over and over. And those Shafer stats and the following year look the same to me.

And why post stats for Texas for all of last season? He wasn't the DC when they got drilled. He took over when that guy got canned. And every sane person said Grob did a great job thee and turned their defense, and season around. They were giving up 500 yards of rushing to team like BYU. Grob got that defense to the point of holding Oregon to 1 TD and 3 FGs. Their run to a bowl game was in large part due to Grob.

And he's doing pretty darn good on a bad team this year.

See? Anyone can cherry pick. Choose any coach and I'll point out good things and bad. Guy was hired by some of the best NFL and college programs. Has to be a reason for that.

 

[Crusty]

That's one opinion. Just as many people felt P was kept a year too long. The start and end of the season showed that to be correct.

Also, the GRob hire wasn't as rushed as you think. Gross went thru a very specific process to identify what became 4 candidates. You know all this but HE wanted to follow the same model that HE felt worked at USC. And that was a DC or defensive coach with NFL experience. That's what he followed and he identified 4 candidates that fit that model. GRob, Donnie Henderson, Jerry Gray and Tim Lewis. They were all interviewed and a down select was made to Grob and Gray then Grob hired.

And what red flags on Grob were there related to being a HC? He had no HC experience. Just like Marrone didn't or Shafer didn't. The hire didn't work out but Gross was able to use the process and model he wanted so it wasn't rushed. And of the 4 interviewed that fit the model, Grob had the strongest resume.

Interesting. I assume all of those guys wanted the job. To my knowledge none of them ever became a HC. Not sure what I make of that list.

 

[GoSU96]

Again cherry picking and even being deceptive.

How about his Broncos teams? 2 superbowls. 4th in yards allowed and 7th in points allowed. Then 12th in yards allowed and 8th in points allowed.

You over simplify KC. Zero talent there as they were built for offense always having 5-6 pro bowlers on offense and 1 on defense. After Grob left? Those defensive stats got worse.

Texas? He was co-defensive coordinator. Why is that a negative? Their defense was very good. He had something to do with that.

SU? Sure he was a bad HC. Nobody ever denied that. Those defensive stats? Yea, real bad. But his first year here they got better from P's last year. That senior class had some talent, but P didn't get anything out of them. After that it was the culmination of 3 years of bad recruiting and no speed. 2002-2004.

Michigan? You know this too. But he and Shafer were both forced to play a 3-3-5 defense which does not work in a power football league like the B10. Multiple analysts said that over and over. And those Shafer stats and the following year look the same to me.

And why post stats for Texas for all of last season? He wasn't the DC when they got drilled. He took over when that guy got canned. And every sane person said Grob did a great job thee and turned their defense, and season around. They were giving up 500 yards of rushing to team like BYU. Grob got that defense to the point of holding Oregon to 1 TD and 3 FGs. Their run to a bowl game was in large part due to Grob.

And he's doing pretty darn good on a bad team this year.

See? Anyone can cherry pick. Choose any coach and I'll point out good things and bad. Guy was hired by some of the best NFL and college programs. Has to be a reason for that.

What cherry picking, just facts, no excuses. There's two constants, him and his consistently awful defenses.

Texas, Dick Tomey ran that defense, they were doing Robinson a favor.

Why do you defend that guy. He brought nothing but disaster to this program.

 

[rrlbees]

What cherry picking, just facts, no excuses. There's two constants, him and his consistently awful defenses. Texas, Dick Tomey ran that defense, they were doing Robinson a favor. Why do you defend that guy. He brought nothing but disaster to this program.

Not defending anything. Just stating facts myself that you ignore. I know you got the double whammy. It was a bad hire but he's also the guy that replaced P.

 

[rrlbees]

Interesting. I assume all of those guys wanted the job. To my knowledge none of them ever became a HC. Not sure what I make of that list.

IMO, it's a bad model. Not surprised none ever became a HC. For SU, especially since we play in a dome, you need someone with an offensive mind.

 

[SmilinBob]

i won't forget that sinking feeling when gerg started talking about west coast offense.

The sea was angry that day my friend.

 

[Moontan]

I heard from Florida friend the Gator AD wants one of Hugh Freeze, David Cutcliffe, or Jim McElwain as the next Florida HC.

Cutcliffe would be reunited with his favorite OC. An Alabama boy, who coached at TN and led Ole Miss to an SEC West title, coaching at UF would be interesting.

I wonder if Foley would prefer someone younger, like Freeze.