Out of state kids are easier than in state an example

[Statesman1]

Not really ... still waiting for that list not clown responses ... notice you take the time to respond but still waiting for this list of megarecruits. And as someone who deploys IT systems in excess of $8 million dollars per I know how it works ... you go where the market yields ... give me the list or shut up already. Why am I not surprised you can't grasp big business, CFB is big business not vacuum cleaners.

That's hilarious- I never like to make these things personal but I'm the guy that sells the $8 mil IT system- then collects the huge commission check. I go turn over the rocks, forge the relationships, and close the deal-guys like you go where you're told- but I appreciate your perspective on sales and "Big Business" none the less. We don't need an arbitrary list of 20 non-Milford transfers that in hindsight have stayed out of trouble, don't transfer, get injured, or beaten out by better players at a factory. That's not how recruiting works, nor does it speak to the issue of building a more competitive team at Syracuse- which is the only point I have been making. You can't or wont grasp the simple concept that keeping guys like the Jones bros, the Gause bros, Holley, Curtis Samuel, Officer, Gus Edwards, Zembec, Wheatley, and even Chad Kelly would have made us a better team. Instead, we have an IT guy who apparently advocates dropping the entire state because there's better HS football in Florida, and the leftovers that are passed up by the local powers might just choose us without getting injured, homesick, and keep their noses clean. Good luck with that philosophy it hasn't been working so well lately.

 

[TheCusian]

That's hilarious- I never like to make these things personal but I'm the guy that sells the $8 mil IT system- then collects the huge commission check. I go turn over the rocks, forge the relationships, and close the deal-guys like you go where you're told- but I appreciate your perspective on sales and "Big Business" none the less. We don't need an arbitrary list of 20 non-Milford transfers that in hindsight have stayed out of trouble, don't transfer, get injured, or beaten out by better players at a factory. That's not how recruiting works, nor does it speak to the issue of building a more competitive team at Syracuse- which is the only point I have been making. You can't or wont grasp the simple concept that keeping guys like the Jones bros, the Gause bros, Holley, Curtis Samuel, Officer, Gus Edwards, Zembec, Wheatley, and even Chad Kelly would have made us a better team. Instead, we have an IT guy who apparently advocates dropping the entire state because there's better HS football in Florida, and the leftovers that are passed up by the local powers might just choose us without getting injured, homesick, and keep their noses clean. Good luck with that philosophy it hasn't been working so well lately.

It's the assumption that something different needs to happen to get the guys you mentioned that's wrong.

The reason we're not getting the best NY talent or the best talent anywhere - is our record on the field over the last 12-15 years.

We need to get good talent, win with that talent over time - and then we have a shot. State is irrelevant.

And - you can have the no 10-20 players from within 100 miles of Syracuse and I'll take the no 10-20 players from within a 100 miles of Miami and we'll see who is better.

 

[wfschrec]

It's the assumption that something different needs to happen to get the guys you mentioned that's wrong.

The reason we're not getting the best NY talent or the best talent anywhere - is our record on the field over the last 12-15 years.

We need to get good talent, win with that talent over time - and then we have a shot. State is irrelevant.

And - you can have the no 10-20 players from within 100 miles of Syracuse and I'll take the no 10-20 players from within a 100 miles of Miami and we'll see who is better.

He rattles off 12 guys that range over a 12-15 year period ... he really just doesn't get it ... of course speaking of keeping our noses clean how does Naes Howard look now ... or Cater or EO or ... hell dude maybe you should go root for a team built up with all this NY talent ...oh wait that doesn't exist ... you can see your way out now.

 

[Statesman1]

It's the assumption that something different needs to happen to get the guys you mentioned that's wrong.

The reason we're not getting the best NY talent or the best talent anywhere - is our record on the field over the last 12-15 years.

We need to get good talent, win with that talent over time - and then we have a shot. State is irrelevant.

And - you can have the no 10-20 players from within 100 miles of Syracuse and I'll take the no 10-20 players from within a 100 miles of Miami and we'll see who is better.

"Its the assumption that something different needs to happen to get the guys you mentioned that's wrong"-- How is that wrong? By definition we just tried something different and cleaned out the coaching staff. Is that not the very definition of trying something different?? Perhaps you would have preferred the status quo with the former regime? OF COURSE we have to try something different, otherwise why would any sane person expect a different result.
"We need to get good talent, win with that talent over time- and then we have a shot." -Hardly a revelation. This seems fairly indisputable and elementary and is a point I have been making. No one has suggested differently, but I'm amazed you seem to agree with me on that point.
"And - you can have the no 10-20 players from within 100 miles of Syracuse and I'll take the no 10-20 players from within a 100 miles of Miami and we'll see who is better" You mean there's more good football players in South Florida than CNY?? This is hardly breaking news nor is it a point I've advanced. For the fifth time, I've not argued that the level of HS football in NY is comparable to Florida, in fact I've stated the contrary. All I've stated is that there are good players in NY that we need to do a better job retaining.

 

[Statesman1]

He rattles off 12 guys that range over a 12-15 year period ... he really just doesn't get it ... of course speaking of keeping our noses clean how does Naes Howard look now ... or Cater or EO or ... hell dude maybe you should go root for a team built up with all this NY talent ...oh wait that doesn't exist ... you can see your way out now.

12 guys over a 12-15 year period? Dude you're not only hilarious you can't count. Go back to your keyboard and google the names I mentioned and tell me again why we're better off without them.

 

[wfschrec]

12 guys over a 12-15 year period? Dude you're not only hilarious you can't count. Go back to your keyboard and google the names I mentioned and tell me again why we're better off without them.

Sorry Arthur Jones was recruited 9 years ago ... but continue to knitpick again you have to reach back 9 years to round up to a full dozen names ... yawn. You obviously don't get it. You can't field a team relying on 1.25 recruits a year ... but whatever helps you sleep at night man.

 

[wfschrec]

12 guys over a 12-15 year period? Dude you're not only hilarious you can't count. Go back to your keyboard and google the names I mentioned and tell me again why we're better off without them.

I stand corrected Arthur Jones redshirted in 2005 ... so its 11 years ... yawn

 

[Statesman1]

Sorry Arthur Jones was recruited 9 years ago ... but continue to knitpick again you have to reach back 9 years to round up to a full dozen names ... yawn. You obviously don't get it. You can't field a team relying on 1.25 recruits a year ... but whatever helps you sleep at night man.

Not to nitpick, but I wasn't referring to Arthur Jones, rather the Jones brothers from Rochester- Jarron and Jamir. Perhaps you've heard of them? Both "mega recruits" -- to use your words-- who signed at ND out of Aquinas?? Ringing any bells yet?? Jarron is entering his senior year and is an NFL prospect NT. Jamir signed his LOI to play LB this fall - not like we have any needs at either of those two positions at least!! You really should get up to speed on local recruiting before you trash it- otherwise you just come off as smug, condescending, and ignorant (but not necessarily in that order!) You're probably right though, neither one of these kids would have helped us, probably would have run into some trouble on the Hill or flunked out the way most NY prospects do. By the way, I sleep great at night, especially after I've sold somebody something, a product if you will...

 

[TheCusian]

"Its the assumption that something different needs to happen to get the guys you mentioned that's wrong"-- How is that wrong? By definition we just tried something different and cleaned out the coaching staff. Is that not the very definition of trying something different?? Perhaps you would have preferred the status quo with the former regime? OF COURSE we have to try something different, otherwise why would any sane person expect a different result. "We need to get good talent, win with that talent over time- and then we have a shot." -Hardly a revelation. This seems fairly indisputable and elementary and is a point I have been making. No one has suggested differently, but I'm amazed you seem to agree with me on that point. "And - you can have the no 10-20 players from within 100 miles of Syracuse and I'll take the no 10-20 players from within a 100 miles of Miami and we'll see who is better" You mean there's more good football players in South Florida than CNY?? This is hardly breaking news nor is it a point I've advanced. For the fifth time, I've not argued that the level of HS football in NY is comparable to Florida, in fact I've stated the contrary. All I've stated is that there are good players in NY that we need to do a better job retaining.

Exactly - it's all obvious. Not sure why the back and forth.

We are backfilling with kids from outside of the NE for a reason. My point was that we are not in the running locally because we've sucked. Retaining those kids doesn't happen unless we start winning. There is no magic NE recruiting wand.

I think we'll do better when we start winning. The end. Complaining in the mean time is pointless.

 

[TheCusian]

Not to nitpick, but I wasn't referring to Arthur Jones, rather the Jones brothers from Rochester- Jarron and Jamir. Perhaps you've heard of them? Both "mega recruits" -- to use your words-- who signed at ND out of Aquinas?? Ringing any bells yet?? Jarron is entering his senior year and is an NFL prospect NT. Jamir signed his LOI to play LB this fall - not like we have any needs at either of those two positions at least!! You really should get up to speed on local recruiting before you trash it- otherwise you just come off as smug, condescending, and ignorant (but not necessarily in that order!) You're probably right though, neither one of these kids would have helped us, probably would have run into some trouble on the Hill or flunked out the way most NY prospects do. By the way, I sleep great at night, especially after I've sold somebody something, a product if you will...

We couldn't get them because we've sucked. We won't compete with ND off the field until we're competing with them on it.

Any argument that says we should have gotten them over ND is bunk.

 

[wfschrec]

Not to nitpick, but I wasn't referring to Arthur Jones, rather the Jones brothers from Rochester- Jarron and Jamir. Perhaps you've heard of them? Both "mega recruits" -- to use your words-- who signed at ND out of Aquinas?? Ringing any bells yet?? Jarron is entering his senior year and is an NFL prospect NT. Jamir signed his LOI to play LB this fall - not like we have any needs at either of those two positions at least!! You really should get up to speed on local recruiting before you trash it- otherwise you just come off as smug, condescending, and ignorant (but not necessarily in that order!) You're probably right though, neither one of these kids would have helped us, probably would have run into some trouble on the Hill or flunked out the way most NY prospects do. By the way, I sleep great at night, especially after I've sold somebody something, a product if you will...

Yeah but according to you we can't count Jamir its too early remember? Since you didn't want me using 2011-14 as a 4 year window. Jamir is a "mega recruit" who hasn't even seen the field ... I asked for guys contributing now ... holy crap you are unreal.

 

[Statesman1]

We couldn't get them because we've sucked. We won't compete with ND off the field until we're competing with them on it.

Any argument that says we should have gotten them over ND is bunk.

Who said we "should have" gotten them? All I've done is point out there is talent in the state, that has mostly chosen to go elsewhere. I've already agreed with you that maybe Dino can inject some excitement into the program and start landing some of these guys.

 

[Statesman1]

Yeah but according to you we can't count Jamir its too early remember? Since you didn't want me using 2011-14 as a 4 year window. Jamir is a "mega recruit" who hasn't even seen the field ... I asked for guys contributing now ... holy crap you are unreal.

Who's nitpicking now?? You're a real piece of work- It is kind of difficult to not mention Jamir and Jarron together when talking about missed opportunities in local recruiting, but whatever, lets disqualify Jamir as a talented local player we lost out on because he hasn't enrolled at ND yet. According to your logic, he'll probably be a bust anyway, just like his brother...( and by "bust" I mean NFL prospect) You had no idea who Jarron and Jamir were until I pointed it out to you even though they both signed with ND and played their hs ball 90 minutes from the Dome. It's a facile argument to insist there is no talent worth recruiting in the state and point to the washouts (hardly unique to NY), while simultaneously ignoring guys who choose other programs and go on to success. We may not produce the quantity of places like Florida (never said we did) but we produce enough to help our own program- which is the only point I've been making. Given you have no idea what's going on a couple stops down the thruway, I can see why you make the argument that the state sucks. Please tell me again why we're better off with these guys going to other p5 schools instead of ours? I can't wait to hear that rationale.

 

[Statesman1]

Exactly - it's all obvious. Not sure why the back and forth.

We are backfilling with kids from outside of the NE for a reason. My point was that we are not in the running locally because we've sucked. Retaining those kids doesn't happen unless we start winning. There is no magic NE recruiting wand.

I think we'll do better when we start winning. The end. Complaining in the mean time is pointless.

Pretty much agree with the above. Winning, along with a little salesmanship from the new staff, is the answer. (Thank goodness wfschrec isn't in charge of the salesmanship!!)

 

[wfschrec]

Who's nitpicking now?? You're a real piece of work- It is kind of difficult to not mention Jamir and Jarron together when talking about missed opportunities in local recruiting, but whatever, lets disqualify Jamir as a talented local player we lost out on because he hasn't enrolled at ND yet. According to your logic, he'll probably be a bust anyway, just like his brother...( and by "bust" I mean NFL prospect) You had no idea who Jarron and Jamir were until I pointed it out to you even though they both signed with ND and played their hs ball 90 minutes from the Dome. It's a facile argument to insist there is no talent worth recruiting in the state and point to the washouts (hardly unique to NY), while simultaneously ignoring guys who choose other programs and go on to success. We may not produce the quantity of places like Florida (never said we did) but we produce enough to help our own program- which is the only point I've been making. Given you have no idea what's going on a couple stops down the thruway, I can see why you make the argument that the state sucks. Please tell me again why we're better off with these guys going to other p5 schools instead of ours? I can't wait to hear that rationale.

No you changed the qualifier earlier ... too early to tell right? You are ridiculous seriously I asked you for guys who are CONTRIBUTORS Jamir has yet to play a snap and you are using 1 guy as a tipping point for your argument so that alone should tell you how scarce talent is there. Not my fault you can't see the forest from the trees ... and again I asked for a list of capable guys over a 4 YEAR period still waiting ... I never ever said there isn't talent here. What your tiny mind fails to get is the fundamental point that going all in on 1 school where there might be 1 legit P5 player and wasting a lot of time courting them is stupid when you can focus your energy on a school that might put out 8 or 10, its called odds. ND is a totally different story because kids grow up wanting to play there and they have deep influence across the entire country ... notice they aren't loaded up with kids from Indiana. They have 10 or let me do the math for you 2.5 per year in a recruiting cycle ... THEY GO ELSEWHERE DO YOU GET THAT? My God you are thick. Seriously I'm done explaining simple things to you.

 

[wfschrec]

Pretty much agree with the above. Winning, along with a little salesmanship from the new staff, is the answer. (Thank goodness wfschrec isn't in charge of the salesmanship!!)

Thank God you aren't running the program.

 

[Statesman1]

Thank God you aren't running the program.

No you changed the qualifier earlier ... too early to tell right? You are ridiculous seriously I asked you for guys who are CONTRIBUTORS Jamir has yet to play a snap and you are using 1 guy as a tipping point for your argument so that alone should tell you how scarce talent is there. Not my fault you can't see the forest from the trees ... and again I asked for a list of capable guys over a 4 YEAR period still waiting ... I never ever said there isn't talent here. What your tiny mind fails to get is the fundamental point that going all in on 1 school where there might be 1 legit P5 player and wasting a lot of time courting them is stupid when you can focus your energy on a school that might put out 8 or 10, its called odds. ND is a totally different story because kids grow up wanting to play there and they have deep influence across the entire country ... notice they aren't loaded up with kids from Indiana. They have 10 or let me do the math for you 2.5 per year in a recruiting cycle ... THEY GO ELSEWHERE DO YOU GET THAT? My God you are thick. Seriously I'm done explaining simple things to you.

In addition to being a dolt, you are highly entertaining! You're all over the place. Who has suggested going all in on 1 high school or even 1 state?? I already gave you names who but you don't know your Jones Bros from the Jones Bros (Hint: they all have the same last name but they're not all related!) If that's all you've been able to deduce from what I've written your reading comprehension skills are severely lacking, and SU needs to seriously reconsider our admission standards.

 

[Statesman1]

Thank God you aren't running the program.

Oh c'mon, you can do better than that. Can't you? Actually, from the author of "a product if you will..." maybe that's the best you've got.

 

[wfschrec]

In addition to being a dolt, you are highly entertaining! You're all over the place. Who has suggested going all in on 1 high school or even 1 state?? I already gave you names who but you don't know your Jones Bros from the Jones Bros (Hint: they all have the same last name but they're not all related!) If that's all you've been able to deduce from what I've written your reading comprehension skills are severely lacking, and SU needs to seriously reconsider our admission standards.

Seriously I'm done with you ... if you have an issue with that use ignore. Again you missed my point and I'm not responding any further.

 

[Statesman1]

Seriously I'm done with you ... if you have an issue with that use ignore. Again you missed my point and I'm not responding any further.

Gee, that's too bad. I'll really miss those straw man arguments like we shouldn't commit all our recruiting resources to one high school. And where else will I find such insight that some kids grow up and dream of playing at ND? The point is that NY puts kids in these schools on the regular- and is not devoid of talent- we just haven't been getting any of it-which I'm glad you finally admitted. Was that so difficult?