Paying our Dues in the ACC

[HarrisonJBounel]

Syracuse, Louisville, Duke, and UNC will pull in big time talent. Pitt and ND will be what they have been as long as Dixon and Brey are coaching those respective teams. Dixon is starting to go after better talent (at least according to rankings) but that does not matter if he does not land them and get them on campus. I could see teams like Miami, FSU, and NC State having teams every one in a while where they really compete.

I did not see the game, but I saw where FSU (now 12-4) beat Miami 63-53, at Miami. FSU outrebounded them, 37-29, shot 7-15 from three, held Miami to 36% shooting, and only had 9 TO's (though they only forced 4 TO's by Miami). Also, they have a 7'3" starting center, Boris Bojanovsky, who played 28 minutes, who is only a sophomore, so he will probably continue to improve. FSU is our last game of the regular season, and it's at FSU. That promises to be a tough game for many reasons.

 

[TheCusian]

Notre Dame would be feasting if not for an injury. The Ville will do the same next year. Duke and N Carolina will come back, but the rest of the league will be down forever. The grunge will find it impossible to compete for talent with the likes of Cuse, Ville, Duke and the Heels. The grunge of the Big East never had a chance and neither will the ACC grunge. The bottom feeders lack any big name coaches to get them over the hump. Perhaps, Miami has the only shot for a break out. The ACC will not become a reincarnation of the old Big East. However, they will still grab more than their share of NC's.

They will resort to bringing up football.

 

[orange79]

General James Tecumseh Sherman Boeheim marching through the south... kinda thing seems to always tick em off down here.

Yup - our joining the league is just another stage in the War of Northern Aggression

 

[Timonen]

General James Tecumseh Sherman Boeheim marching through the south... kinda thing seems to always tick em off down here.

Seriously. It's like saying Attila should pay dues as he takes over new territories. If you're the conqueror, that's not how it works.

 

[Bornorange]

They will resort to bringing up football.

We are taking care of that little issue.

 

[Geode]

That's funny. I was wearing a 'Cuse pullover today at work (in Raleigh) and had a State fan tell me thank you for helping give the ACC some credibility this year. He also said he's terrified of what we're going to do to them in the Dome. I interact with a lot of State, UNC, and Duke fans and I'd say most are equal parts blown away with our athleticism and frustrated with their own teams. I think a lot of the bitterness toward us stems from the struggles on Tobacco Road.

I have a bunch of Clemson, NCSU, Duke, and FSU neighbors. All have been remarkably complimentary of the basketball team, a stark contrast to the discussions about football. Folks here in the Charlotte area are expressing a lot of the same frustrations that the ACC is just not good this season. With the Panthers losing last week the local media is starting to wind down their NFL coverage so it will be interesting to see if we get any love.

 

[HarrisonJBounel]

I have a bunch of Clemson, NCSU, Duke, and FSU neighbors. All have been remarkably complimentary of the basketball team, a stark contrast to the discussions about football. Folks here in the Charlotte area are expressing a lot of the same frustrations that the ACC is just not good this season. With the Panthers losing last week the local media is starting to wind down their NFL coverage so it will be interesting to see if we get any love.

I live in Charlotte as well and I agree with all this. I would add I find it interesting that in the local paper, the Charlotte Observer (Disturber), that they seem to pay only superficial attention to the Orange, covering them little more than they would, say, Michigan State. Rarely do I see the full box scores for our game, but they do print the box scores of the Carolina teams or other ACC teams, or get any special write-ups. IMHO, we clearly aren't one of "them" yet.

 

[Dave85]

ACC is a dumpster fire. we knew that when we were in the BE... we came over to prove it. Hopefully we can raise them up... else we're just Gonzaga.

The Syracuse basketball program is a work of art. There is so much tradition in place. Great coaches. Great methods. A great facility. Players come to Syracuse and raise their level of play several magnitudes by the time they leave. I don't think we will ever become a Gonzaga. The zeitgeist of the basketball program is not going to change. JB, his coaching staff, and everyone who has contributed have created a juggernaut that is not going to change for many years to come. Even after JB leaves all the pieces will be in place for the program to continue to bring out the best in players. Like of a lot the posters here I been following Orange basketball too many years to count. The last five years have been amazing! I just don't think it's going to stop. Being in the ACC is not going to change the program. When we were in the Big East we played Rutgers and DePaul. And the Orange basketball program was as strong as ever all those years we were playing Rutgers and DePaul. Long live Orange basketball!

 

[Dave85]

Yup - our joining the league is just another stage in the War of Northern Aggression

The South will rise again! Just not this basketball season.

Hopefully, we will get respect based on our love of basketball (before and after game time).

 

[edowd26]

The Syracuse basketball program is a work of art. There is so much tradition in place. Great coaches. Great methods. A great facility. Players come to Syracuse and raise their level of play several magnitudes by the time they leave. I don't think we will ever become a Gonzaga. The zeitgeist of the basketball program is not going to change. JB, his coaching staff, and everyone who has contributed have created a juggernaut that is not going to change for many years to come. Even after JB leaves all the pieces will be in place for the program to continue to bring out the best in players. Like of a lot the posters here I been following Orange basketball too many years to count. The last five years have been amazing! I just don't think it's going to stop. Being in the ACC is not going to change the program. When we were in the Big East we played Rutgers and DePaul. And the Orange basketball program was as strong as ever all those years we were playing Rutgers and DePaul. Long live Orange basketball!

By Gonzaga I meant a one horse show. Not actually talent level. Just to perennial conference power.

 

[jimsonjunction]

Over time, I think the ACC will become the best conference. SU, UNC, Duke, Ville, Pitt and ND will provide a steady upper echelon, but that also provides a lot more opportunities for the other teams. I think teams like FSU, Miami, NC State, Virginia, etc. will benefit in the long run...much like West Virginia and Marquette did in the BE.

 

[Dave85]

Over time, I think the ACC will become the best conference. SU, UNC, Duke, Ville, Pitt and ND will provide a steady upper echelon, but that also provides a lot more opportunities for the other teams. I think teams like FSU, Miami, NC State, Virginia, etc. will benefit in the long run...much like West Virginia and Marquette did in the BE.

I tend to agree. I think the ACC is already getting great branding. Even though Duke has a lot of losses the Syracuse/Duke game the night before the Super Bowl is going to get massive TV ratings. It's great for the league. It's great for Orange basketball.

 

[jncuse]

Over time, I think the ACC will become the best conference. SU, UNC, Duke, Ville, Pitt and ND will provide a steady upper echelon, but that also provides a lot more opportunities for the other teams. I think teams like FSU, Miami, NC State, Virginia, etc. will benefit in the long run...much like West Virginia and Marquette did in the BE.

Why is nobody giving any respect to Florida St? Why are they being tiered lower than Notre Dame which has been done a handful of times on this thread. The underrating of certain ACC programs and overrating of certain past Big East teams is getting out of control.

FSU is at the same program level as Notre Dame. They have made the tourney 4 of the last 5 years, and have had two top 5 seeds (a 3 seed and a 5 seed) . Notre Dame has also made the tournament 4 of the last 5 years and been a top 5 seed once (a 2 seed). Florida St has won 3 games in the NCAA tournament over that time, Notre Dame has only one - so much for Florida St only feasting on its own conference.

Furthermore, Florida St is poised to make the NCAA tournament again this year while Notre Dame is not.

Both teams have solid coaches in Leonard Hamilton and Mike Brey. Florida St has a nice defensive system in place.

What exactly has set apart Notre Dame from Florida St?

 

[jncuse]

Over time, I think the ACC will become the best conference. SU, UNC, Duke, Ville, Pitt and ND will provide a steady upper echelon, but that also provides a lot more opportunities for the other teams. I think teams like FSU, Miami, NC State, Virginia, etc. will benefit in the long run...much like West Virginia and Marquette did in the BE.

Other than the inclusion of ND as part of the upper echelon above Florida St (a mistake done by many), this is a really excellent point.

Like WVU and Marquette these programs have a solid fanbase, a solid pedigree from not that long ago in and have great resources (look at a team like NC St). They just need a little push to get over the top again.

 

[itsbotime]

I don't understand the "paying your dues argument." So Syracuse is supposed to come into the ACC and suck for the first couple years as a way of showing respect? No thanks, we have plenty of teams that suck. We want more GOOD teams. To me, paying your dues would mean representing the conference well on a national scale, which SU has done a good job of thus far this season.

 

[RMH44]

Why is nobody giving any respect to Florida St? Why are they being tiered lower than Notre Dame which has been done a handful of times on this thread. The underrating of certain ACC programs and overrating of certain past Big East teams is getting out of control.

FSU is at the same program level as Notre Dame. They have made the tourney 4 of the last 5 years, and have had two top 5 seeds (a 3 seed and a 5 seed) . Notre Dame has also made the tournament 4 of the last 5 years and been a top 5 seed once (a 2 seed). Florida St has won 3 games in the NCAA tournament over that time, Notre Dame has only one - so much for Florida St only feasting on its own conference.

Furthermore, Florida St is poised to make the NCAA tournament again this year while Notre Dame is not.

Both teams have solid coaches in Leonard Hamilton and Mike Brey. Florida St has a nice defensive system in place.

What exactly has set apart Notre Dame from Florida St?

FSU is a VERY dangerous team that has great size. I wouldn't want to play them in an early round match-up in March.

 

[jimsonjunction]

Why is nobody giving any respect to Florida St? Why are they being tiered lower than Notre Dame which has been done a handful of times on this thread. The underrating of certain ACC programs and overrating of certain past Big East teams is getting out of control.

FSU is at the same program level as Notre Dame. They have made the tourney 4 of the last 5 years, and have had two top 5 seeds (a 3 seed and a 5 seed) . Notre Dame has also made the tournament 4 of the last 5 years and been a top 5 seed once (a 2 seed). Florida St has won 3 games in the NCAA tournament over that time, Notre Dame has only one - so much for Florida St only feasting on its own conference.

Furthermore, Florida St is poised to make the NCAA tournament again this year while Notre Dame is not.

Both teams have solid coaches in Leonard Hamilton and Mike Brey. Florida St has a nice defensive system in place.

What exactly has set apart Notre Dame from Florida St?

Wow, interesting numbers. I have to plead ignorance - I simply haven't paid much attention to Florida State. It's tough to draw a distinction with those teams. Would you move FSU into the top tier? Would you move ND down? Then is Pitt good enough to remain? Either way, I look forward to understanding the ACC teams more as the year goes on.

 

[normaliswear]

I'd say the top tier is SU, UNC, Duke, Lville. Pitt just a hair below them. Then an upper middle class of ND, FSU, and Virginia

Wow, interesting numbers. I have to plead ignorance - I simply haven't paid much attention to Florida State. It's tough to draw a distinction with those teams. Would you move FSU into the top tier? Would you move ND down? Then is Pitt good enough to remain? Either way, I look forward to understanding the ACC teams more as the year goes on.

 

[sufandu]

When you have the best freshman in the country, and the best transfer, but you are now 23rd in the polls because you have no idea how to defend {Duke}. After the Plumlee's left none of the new people want to do the dirty work. That's the problem with these one and downs, too many are concerned about getting theirs, they forget about the team.

They still have one Plumlee left, but he doesn't see the floor that much.

 

[bnoro]

FSU also beat a very good UMass team (UMass's only loss so far this year). They are definitely a good squad.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Pay dues? We should go back and make Louisville pay theirs when they joined the Big East.

Hoping the refs aren't in charge of ACC's initiation & hazing.

 

[edowd26]

I don't understand the "paying your dues argument." So Syracuse is supposed to come into the ACC and suck for the first couple years as a way of showing respect? No thanks, we have plenty of teams that suck. We want more GOOD teams. To me, paying your dues would mean representing the conference well on a national scale, which SU has done a good job of thus far this season.

I dunno? Last time the ACC grabbed Miami, BC, and Va. Tech. So who knows what the ACC wanted out of this batch of teams.

 

[Hoo's That]

Notre Dame would be feasting if not for an injury. The Ville will do the same next year. Duke and N Carolina will come back, but the rest of the league will be down forever. The grunge will find it impossible to compete for talent with the likes of Cuse, Ville, Duke and the Heels. The grunge of the Big East never had a chance and neither will the ACC grunge. The bottom feeders lack any big name coaches to get them over the hump. Perhaps, Miami has the only shot for a break out. The ACC will not become a reincarnation of the old Big East. However, they will still grab more than their share of NC's.

Forever is a mighty long time, especially when you have no shot for a break out.:noidea:

 

[Geode]

I don't understand the "paying your dues argument." So Syracuse is supposed to come into the ACC and suck for the first couple years as a way of showing respect? No thanks, we have plenty of teams that suck. We want more GOOD teams. To me, paying your dues would mean representing the conference well on a national scale, which SU has done a good job of thus far this season.

The best respect we can show the ACC is to beat the living tar out of them and drag them kicking and screaming away from Tobacco Road.

 

[senorpalmer]

I'd say the top tier is SU, UNC, Duke, Lville. Pitt just a hair below them. Then an upper middle class of ND, FSU, and Virginia

This is correct. The mistake wasn't so much putting ND ahead of FSU, but rather putting ND into that top tier.