Players are just not good enough.

[Melancer46]

I know people expect development and all, but it continues to shock me that people are surprised that the guys that shot 35-38% from the field a year ago are shooting 35-38% from the field this year. This is actually the most efficient season Howard has ever had as a scorer and his A:T ratio is higher than it was last year too. O'Shae's FG% is up 4% this year, but the decline in his 3PT% (which was probably flukey as a freshman considering he was a poor shooter in high school) and FT% have negated all of that.

Neither Howard or Brissett are good and they never have been. They're just guys that are more willing to take shots than their teammates.

Battle is the only player on the team that is semi-consistently good. Hughes, Dolezaj, and Chukwu generally bring some value to the team, though each of them is severely limited in ways that hurt the team a lot when they have an off night.

Howard and Brissett are just chuckers.

 

[cspades99]

Is Battle any better than he was last year?

Given that the entire team has regressed and this team has no PG, I don't judge Battle harshly. His numbers aren't better, but I think he's a better player.

 

[cspades99]

I know people expect development and all, but it continues to shock me that people are surprised that the guys that shot 35-38% from the field a year ago are shooting 35-38% from the field this year. This is actually the most efficient season Howard has ever had as a scorer and his A:T ratio is higher than it was last year too. O'Shae's FG% is up 4% this year, but the decline in his 3PT% (which was probably flukey as a freshman considering he was a poor shooter in high school) and FT% have negated all of that.

Neither Howard or Brissett are good and they never have been. They're just guys that are more willing to take shots than their teammates.

Battle is the only player on the team that is semi-consistently good. Hughes, Dolezaj, and Chukwu generally bring some value to the team, though each of them is severely limited in ways that hurt the team a lot when they have an off night.

Howard and Brissett are just chuckers.

Unfortunately, we need Howard to run an offense, not have the occasional good shooting night. I know his numbers stack up over 40 mins, but it's playing worse basketball game to game.

And if the point is that inefficient offensive players will remain inefficient, sure, that's fine. But it's not a lot to ask that a highly regarded prospect in OB actually plays better basketball in year 2. He's not. And he's worse in many areas. And that a 4 yr Senior shows just an ounce of consistency. But he's not, and he's also worse in many areas.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Battle is better than last year with the exception of 2 things- 1. his three point shooting, and 2. his tendency to be invisible for long stretches and even entire games (relative to what we expect). It's a tough position. I never expected to have Battle be this type of player (where we need him to be the star) when we first recruited him.

 

[tptcuse]

The sad thing is, I believe they are good enough. For some reason they can't shoot the ball in some game situations. And when they don't shoot well, they lose focus and intensity. Why they don't shoot well? I don't know, and nobody else seems to know either. According to all reports, they hit those same shots in practice, and obviously in some games.

Maybe they're just a bunch of head cases.

Seems like a simplistic take, but I agree. Each player has had good nights. We just lack consistency in shooting. It seems like we need someone on the team to be a more vocal leader on the floor. In my opinion, that should be Frank.

 

[SBU72]

Exactly. We haven’t proven we can beat any legit 0.500+ ACC team in the league. We beat Duke with a historic stroke of luck including 1) their best perimeter shooter being out due to sickness, 2) their PG and defensive catalyst out after 5 min due to injury, 3) 3 free points on a bank shot 3 pointer by Buddy, and 4) 3 more free points on a freakish 80 foot heave by Hughes. That was ‘all stars aligned’ 1-in-100 win but people here seems to think it means we can compete with Duke on a night-in/night-out basis.

Over the years many here say/feel that SU's big wins are by luck or happenstance, and the loses are bad players/bad recruiting/bad coaching. Never the other way around. The 1000 plus wins the same plus beating up on NY teams. That's ok, feel that way but the whining gets me more frustrated! And the feeling of entitlement that many express.

 

[Fly Rodder]

All I'll say about this team is that I cannot believe how much two key players (Howard and Brissett) regressed after such good seasons.

I don't think either was particularly great in conference last season. Both were average to slightly below average, they just played a ton of minutes. They've regressed slightly this year if you look at their PER and other advanced stats, but not overwhelmingly so. It's disappointing that they didn't improve, though.

 

[cspades99]

I think it's been pointed out in past threads and I do believe it: this team construction is not good. We have core players that are all best driving to the basketball. We have a PG that can't get into the paint to kick out to two very good shooters, shooters that can't really get their own shot. It's the opposite of what good offenses are now, especially when there is no big man on roster than can be any sort of threat at any spot on the floor. The best guy to run offense through, MD, is too small to anchor the defense.

So, in the end, we have a lot of one-trick ponies with tricks that often overlap and don't compliement one another at all.

Defensively, I have no idea. I've never seen an experienced team under JB not being lethal with the zone at this point in the season. And all that means to me is that offenses now are just too good at converting the things the zone used to stop. More players shoot effectively from 25+ feet now and require no time to get a shot off. More big men are highly skilled. Ironically, recruiting for the zone means we aren't getting those players, either.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Well its not the coaching I hear.

Yeah, allegedly the recruiting is fine, coaching is fine and the players have talent and size.

So ... it's random bad luck apparently punctuated by the occasional good-to-great games to take the stink off.

 

[hoopsupstate]

The reference was ballhandlers. And unless SU recruits a decent center for next year, it’ll be more of the same.

There are no centers out there who are good enough to have a major impact on next year’s team. They are all long gone by now.

 

[cuseguy]

There are no centers out there who are good enough to have a major impact on next year’s team. They are all long gone by now.

SU has become involved with Tre Mitchell. He could make an impact. If not, a grad transfer is a must.

 

[NineOneSeven]

All I'll say about this team is that I cannot believe how much two key players (Howard and Brissett) regressed after such good seasons.

.

We have different definitions of good. If all you are looking at is 15 and 9 then sure... Oshae had a good season. When you look closer, you see 35% shooting including 37% from 2 (!). All of this in 38 minutes, including many 40min games. It was a function of incredible volume. He got a pass (at least from me) because he was a freshman, and the team was severely limited in terms of offensive factors.

However, I do agree his 3pt shooting and ft shooting has regressed this year. It's proven by the %s.

 

[Cuse12]

Raw talent as a team? We probably have more than NC State.

But we need to stop pretending that small forwards are point guards and that the only centers we can attract are 4- or 5-year projects.

If this coaching staff can’t figure that out, we need one that can.

Spot on. We took less talented recruits because their length and think they’re become elite at a position they should not be playing. I would take the 5’8” PG from Miami any day over length. That kid makes plays and collapses defenses. We could not handle any pressure it was awful last night. They were more stout and stood their ground and we can not get by defenders because again we do not have a true point guard. And additionally we have big men that DO NOTHING. They just clog up driving lanes and offer nothing at all. Zero. Frustrating, but just have to hope we go on a run where we play above our talents level. I’ll still be cheering every game and hoping for change that probably won’t happen.

 

[kuethstheman]

We certainly aren't talented enough to run this offense and not good enough to rebound against good rebounding teams.

 

[SUFan44]

Go down the list of players we have starting for us and name me one player, other than Battle, that would start on a Top 7 team in this league.

I'd be willing to bet there are 1 or 2 guys that wouldn't start on a Top 10 team in this league. Not the country, in the Atlantic Coast Conference.

Whether its lack of raw materials or lack of improvement upon arriving to SU, I'm not sure. But the fact is, our players are just not good enough right now with what they're being asked to do.

 

[tptcuse]

The bottom line:
Syracuse’s 3 leading scorers can’t score; Orange loses to N.C. State

 

[SBU72]

Go down the list of players we have starting for us and name me one player, other than Battle, that would start on a Top 7 team in this league.

I'd be willing to bet there are 1 or 2 guys that wouldn't start on a Top 10 team in this league. Not the country, in the Atlantic Coast Conference.

Whether its lack of raw materials or lack of improvement upon arriving to SU, I'm not sure. But the fact is, our players are just not good enough right now with what they're being asked to do.

Brissett and Hughes.
It is very difficult to judge exactly how players would do with another coach or in another system. Would Tom Brady win 6 Super Bowls playing for another team? We'll never know.

 

[bozophobe]

I never understood reruiting players from places where there hasn't been a strong basketball culture in place; project players seem like a losing gamble overall.

 

[Cuse12]

We certainly aren't talented enough to run this offense and not good enough to rebound against good rebounding teams.

What offense are we even running?

 

[Trueblue25]

I think our players are fine, the team just lacks an approach offensively that creates easy shots. Our whole offensive approach is just to react. We don’t set things up by moving or passing. We don’t take advantage of drawn defenders. There’s just no visible plan. Its been pointed out and discussed for years now. We’re in the acc, we cant just rely on Tyus and whoever else to be consistently good enough to great.

 

[orangenirvana]

We have different definitions of good. If all you are looking at is 15 and 9 then sure... Oshae had a good season. When you look closer, you see 35% shooting including 37% from 2 (!). All of this in 38 minutes, including many 40min games. It was a function of incredible volume. He got a pass (at least from me) because he was a freshman, and the team was severely limited in terms of offensive factors.

However, I do agree his 3pt shooting and ft shooting has regressed this year. It's proven by the %s.

Normally when you see a kid with an NBA body post 15 and 9 as a freshman for a Sweet 16 team you’d think he would be more than just a pretty capable rebounder as a sophomore.

I had assumed that at least half of those bunnies that OB barely missed last season would’ve fallen and he’d develop into a first-round draft pick.

Little did I know that his layup attempts as a Sophomore would instead fly over the backboard and/or out of bounds. Shame on me, I guess.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Normally when you see a kid with an NBA body post 15 and 9 as a freshman for a Sweet 16 team you’d think he would be more than just a pretty capable rebounder as a sophomore.

I had assumed that at least half of those bunnies that OB barely missed last season would’ve fallen and he’d develop into a first-round draft pick.

Little did I know that his layup attempts as a Sophomore would instead fly over the backboard and/or out of bounds. Shame on me, I guess.

You are not alone. I try to be level-headed about our guys' pro prospects unlike some, but even I expected him to develop into a firm first round pick. Granted he is still young and it's still possible by the time he is done here.

 

[orangenirvana]

I think our players are fine, the team just lacks an approach offensively that creates easy shots.

Is there a system on the planet that consistently “creates easy shots” for such limited players?

 

[Trueblue25]

Is there a system on the planet that consistently “creates easy shots” for such limited players?

How are they limited? We have multiple players that can score all over the floor. They just choose to jack up threes, take long twos and drive into impossible circus shots because they’re depended on to figure it out.

I shouldnt say choose, because noones moving around to help them out.

 

[OrangeDW]

How are they limited? We have multiple players that can score all over the floor. They just choose to jack up threes, take long twos and drive into impossible circus shots because they’re depended on to figure it ou

We have nobody that’s good in the post, 2 good three point shooters and 2-3 more average at best ones.

One guy with both the ability to get to the basket and the ability to finish.

And mostly poor passers.

There may not be one NBA player on this team.

Our good teams usually have at least 3-4.