Program ain't what it used to be

[Cusefan0307]

You say that like I dont know that. I dont believe I ever said we are in perfect shape anymore.

I just think this is the ebbs and flows of the business especially after shockingly unfair sanctions. <- thats my opinion.

but what ive been saying is we dont need to see this exact thread after losses to top 5 teams like they are out of the ordinary. we were beating uva at the half for christ sakes. THIS GAME (i have CAPPED THIS about 3x in this thread but maybe caps/bold/italic/underline will get the point across) changed NOTHING in regards to our program.

do you get it now?

It’s not just the last game. I’m sick of losing to UNC and Virginia. It’s old. We get blitzed by them. It is rarely close. We’ve won 3 games combined against them in 6 years in this league.

We used to beat UConn and Georgetown all the time in the other conference when they were good. We had multiple big wins in Louisville back to back in 2012 and 2013z We struggled with Pitt at times, but at least we had big wins against them when it mattered in big games over the years.

We have no shot against some of these good teams. That’s never been Syracuse Basketball.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

a lot of good points, let me respond to these two


if they are saying that, they are misinformed. we are 7th in tempo in acc play. uva and vpi are the slowest
View attachment 155370


no, they did not. they were forced to vacate wins, including a national championship, but they have not yeat received any structural penalties to impact recruiting. that shoe has yet to drop

Is this chart from this year? The comments by broadcasters i'm referring to were in the four or so prior years. I haven't really heard it so much this year. Either way, it doesn't even matter if they were misinformed, or if they were only talking about their impressions of our style of play. What they said is important because that's what was heard by potential recruits.

Thanks for the chart and the Louisville intel.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

i am honestly not trying to work you up... but i dont believe ive ever heard that line from a commentator?

we dont get the ball inside is BY FAR the most popular (and correct) line.

I'm talking about a three-ish year period, maybe beginning around or just after Ennis, until maybe a year or two ago. Haven't heard it so much this year, and i don't recall last year. But, it absolutely was a common talking point, and i used to mention it in forum posts over the past five years.

 

[moqui]

Is this chart from this year? The comments by broadcasters i'm referring to were in the four or so prior years. I haven't really heard it so much this year. Either way, it doesn't even matter if they were misinformed, or if they were only talking about their impressions of our style of play. What they said is important because that's what was heard by potential recruits.

Thanks for the chart and the Louisville intel.

it is for this year only
syracuse has never been the slowest team in the conference. the orange have been close a couple times - 14th last year & in the ennis season. but miami was the slowest team that year and uva has been the slowest every season since.

 

[OrangeDW]

It’s not just the last game. I’m sick of losing to UNC and Virginia. It’s old. We get blitzed by them. It is rarely close. We’ve won 3 games combined against them in 6 years in this league.

We used to beat UConn and Georgetown all the time in the other conference when they were good. We had multiple big wins in Louisville back to back in 2012 and 2013z We struggled with Pitt at times, but at least we had big wins against them when it mattered in big games over the years.

We have no shot against some of these good teams. That’s never been Syracuse Basketball.

Agreed. Coming into the league our program was right there with UNC, Duke, and Louisville as the best programs in the league. We had been every bit as good as them the previous 5 years. I thought we’d be pretty much a perennial top 4 team in the league for the foreseeable future. Would’ve thought we’d have a regular season title by now. Would’ve thought at worst we’d beat those teams 30-40% of the time, and probably closer to 50-50.

Duke has been competitive and Louisville we’re doing ok against. But UNC and Virginia...yikes.

 

[Sherman20]

Can we skip to the part where we get to the final four and everyone is excited except for the people who are never happy?

I think Virginia is the best team we’ve played and are probably 1 or 2 nationally. We lost these types of games in the Big East. We will lose them in the ACC going forward.

We’ll win some too - but *everyones* record vs top 5 teams is a low %.

Fer real. Great post.

 

[Ghost]

Some fans care way too much about the regular season.

I think there are a couple tough parts about this:

1. We play a strange, slow, offensively inept style of basketball that just isn't all that fun to watch most nights. Can we please just have a PG.

2. It's a long regular season. You can derive A LOT of joy from that...if it goes well.

3. Even in our FF run we barely made the tourney...pretending the regular season isn't worth caring "too much" about is silly. We've barely made it twice. I mean, selection Sunday sucks now...that used to be one of my favorite days of the year. Now, it's either, I hope we get in, or, "I hope we get the worst shooting team that's way better than us...and hopefully they're not in the ACC!"

I mean, even the conference tourney is an annual embarrassment...that used to be almost as much fun as the NCAA Tourney for me. Now I sort of dread it.

That's a strange shift from most of my life watching SU basketball...it takes a bit to accept I guess.

 

[MSOrange]

Agreed. Coming into the league our program was right there with UNC, Duke, and Louisville as the best programs in the league. We had been every bit as good as them the previous 5 years. I thought we’d be pretty much a perennial top 4 team in the league for the foreseeable future. Would’ve thought we’d have a regular season title by now. Would’ve thought at worst we’d beat those teams 30-40% of the time, and probably closer to 50-50.

Duke has been competitive and Louisville we’re doing ok against. But UNC and Virginia...yikes.

I think the lack of competitiveness with UNC and Virginia bothers me the most. They are excellent programs but it's very frustrating going in to those games with not much hope that we're going to win. I also feel it's become way too easy for opposing teams to win in the Dome. Upsets happen but we're losing serve on the home court way too easily.

 

[OrangeDW]

I think there are a couple tough parts about this:

1. We play a strange, slow, offensively inept style of basketball that just isn't all that fun to watch most nights. Can we please just have a PG.

2. It's a long regular season. You can derive A LOT of joy from that...if it goes well.

3. Even in our FF run we barely made the tourney...pretending the regular season isn't worth caring "too much" about is silly. We've barely made it twice. I mean, selection Sunday sucks now...that used to be one of my favorite days of the year. Now, it's either, I hope we get in, or, "I hope we get the worst shooting team that's way better than us...and hopefully they're not in the ACC!"

I mean, even the conference tourney is an annual embarrassment...that used to be almost as much fun as the NCAA Tourney for me. Now I sort of dread it.

That's a strange shift from most of my life watching SU basketball...it takes a bit to accept I guess.

Agreed.

I’ve always cared about the regular season, and always thought we had a legit chance to win every game.

I took pride in knowing Syracuse was pretty much a lock to go like at least 24-7 or something in most years. It was like clockwork. Double digit loss seasons were a rare thing.

We really need to make a conference tourney run too.

 

[OrangeDW]

I think the lack of competitiveness with UNC and Virginia bothers me the most. They are excellent programs but it's very frustrating going in to those games with not much hope that we're going to win. I also feel it's become way too easy for opposing teams to win in the Dome. Upsets happen but we're losing serve on the home court way too easily.

Yup. Duke has beaten us more than we’ve beaten them, but it’s reasonably close and I think every game has been close except for one.

Those are the kind of results we should be able to have against anybody IMO.

Nobody should consistently beat us by double digits and beat us almost every single time we play. Even with teams who got the best of us(GTown in 80s, UConn in mid 90s, Lville and Pitt in 00s), it was never like this. Most of the games were competitive and we would at least win sometimes.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

it is for this year only
syracuse has never been the slowest team in the conference. the orange have been close a couple times - 14th last year & in the ennis season. but miami was the slowest team that year and uva has been the slowest every season since.

I was paraphrasing or whatever you call it, [single quotes] and probably the announcers didn't say "the slowest team." Maybe it was 'one of the slowest teams in the conference'—that kind of comment.

...'the slowest in the league?' is what i wrote above. Not a direct quote.
Thanks for the facts. : )

 

[kcsu]

That's a good post, but you're hanging it all on one set of factors, when there are multiple matters to consider.
• Did sanctions create our style of play, which was constantly hammered by commentators as being 'the slowest in the league?'
• We also were newbies to a new conference, the best league in the country, and we did/do not have the same status.
• JB actually is older. I don't know very many people who are as good at anything at 70+ as they were earlier. I don't know anyone who actually puts in more effort at 70+ than earlier.
• We were told JB was going to retire. That has to affect recruiting. Hopkins may have been a worthy successor, but he was an unknown. And if you're competing for top 20 kids, the impending takeover by an assistant without credentials is not a plus in a critical column.
• Maybe, just maybe, the world adapted to the zone and no longer feared it. Shooters now are seeing Harden and Curry launching from five feet past the line. Like how every receiver is Beckham-style one-handing catches for no reason, and tailbacks and tight ends are hurdling tacklers, it's a copycat sporting world. The zone's success in our past is not a permanent thing.
• I'm too tired/lazy to look it up, but what happened to Louisville following their scandal? Did they get sanctions? The same kind as were imposed on us? They lost a HoF coach, and still managed to be ranked. Are their issues 'too new,' and we expect them to suffer over the next few years?

We love you forever and a day Jimmy