Should 44 be used as a recruiting tool...

[bnoro]

Simple solution: don't offer it to those type of recruits.

And who knows--maybe the next 44 will build upon the legend instead of watering it down.

Right, like when we supposedly offered it to Robert Washington because he was a high character guy and a great talent...

 

[SUFaninNJ]

So every recruit that is a 4 or 5 star is pampered and self absorbed? Talk about a broad brush. If giving a recruit a chance to wear #44 was somehow important enough to help sway him from one of the big schools, why not use it? If it's in the arsenal, offer it up. It probably won't even be an issue with 99% of the recruits anyway. Having the Mandel Robinsons and Glenn Moores of the world did nothing to tarnish the impact that Brown, Davis and Little had on the field. I like the idea that was mentioned earlier about honoring the number but still keeping it available.

 

[JrodCuse]

So, what kind of numbers would a RB have to put up to not be considered a "44 bust"? 1,000+ yards and 10+ TD?

 

[Trueblue25]

Robert Washington ptsd setting in

 

[RF2044]

Right, like when we supposedly offered it to Robert Washington because he was a high character guy and a great talent...

That seems like a poor example, on many levels.
Was he ever even officially offered the number?
On that latter point, there's a big difference between internet forum chatter in favor of offering it to a prospect and the coaches actually extending that honor.

 

[retro44]

Isn't that also the reason why he left SU and transferred to Wyoming?

Fans were expecting him to be the next Jim Brown, and when he didn't meet expectations they let him know it.

Yes I did know why he transferred,but my point was it was being offered before the 80's like someone alluded to in a post above.

 

[721Comstock]

#RESTORE44.

It becomes increasingly irrelevant as time goes by.
The majority of us weren't even born yet when Brown, Davis and Little played at Syracuse.

There were quite a few 44's after Floyd, and that didn't seem to "water down the legend" one iota.
Rob Konrad certainly was a worthy 44.
Even guys like Terry Richardson and Michael Owens did not somehow diminish 44 by virtue of not being transcendent.

 

[baggerbob]

#RESTORE44.

It becomes increasingly irrelevant as time goes by.
The majority of us weren't even born yet when Brown, Davis and Little played at Syracuse.

There were quite a few 44's after Floyd, and that didn't seem to "water down the legend" one iota.
Rob Konrad certainly was a worthy 44.
Even guys like Terry Richardson and Michael Owens did not somehow diminish 44 by virtue of not being transcendent.

Michael Owens played well for us, his 2 point conversion against West Virginia will never be forgotten. Also he gained over 1000 yards as a senior after Moose, and Robert Drummond graduated.

 

[BKCuse]

You guys who don't want to use 44 are nuts. We need every possible angle to improve this program and using one the the most historic numbers in the history of sports is an incredible resource.

Leave it in the rafters and it does us no good.

Use it to lure elite RB's to wear Orange and it raises the profile of the entire program AND Davis, Little and Brown.

I think Dino "gets it" since he said no one we're recruiting this year is worthy of it. And you don't offer it to a recruit to wear day 1 freshman season (although that was done for many kids in previous decades) but rather you let kids earn the right to wear the number by excelling on the field, in the classroom and as a citizen for 1 or 2 years on the Hill before you award the jersey. By then he will be a respected leader of the team and there will be no animosity in the locker room.

BUT you certainly dangle this to the 5 star RB's and tell them if they earn it they will instantly be in the Heisman conversation once they put it on.

and for the record there are PLENTY of elite recruits who aren't entitled brats - that's just silly to say.

 

[Ish88888]

You guys who don't want to use 44 are nuts. We need every possible angle to improve this program and using one the the most historic numbers in the history of sports is an incredible resource.

Leave it in the rafters and it does us no good.

Use it to lure elite RB's to wear Orange and it raises the profile of the entire program AND Davis, Little and Brown.

I think Dino "gets it" since he said no one we're recruiting this year is worthy of it. And you don't offer it to a recruit to wear day 1 freshman season (although that was done for many kids in previous decades) but rather you let kids earn the right to wear the number by excelling on the field, in the classroom and as a citizen for 1 or 2 years on the Hill before you award the jersey. By then he will be a respected leader of the team and there will be no animosity in the locker room.

BUT you certainly dangle this to the 5 star RB's and tell them if they earn it they will instantly be in the Heisman conversation once they put it on.

and for the record there are PLENTY of elite recruits who aren't entitled brats - that's just silly to say.

How do you think Dino makes incoming recruits feel saying " None of the recruits we are looking at this year are worthy of 44"???
If 1 singled out recruit was promised 44 if he came to Cuse then what's that do for the "TEAM" concept and overall unity? Not a bad idea giving each yearly team leader 44, such as captain status. Most recruits have no clue what the 44 means and who wore it and thus to unretire a number this precious to our history to take a chance on an 18 year old is plain silly.

 

[JHarris44]

I like the idea of making a player prove themselves worthy of donning #44 as their career goes on. Similar to #22 in Lax (i think?)

That can absolutely be used as a recruiting tool; saying to the young man that, "look, in a year or two, if you go out there and become the player we think you can be, you'll get to wear the prestigious #44."

 

[Ish88888]

I like the idea of making a player prove themselves worthy of donning #44 as their career goes on. Similar to #22 in Lax (i think?)

That can absolutely be used as a recruiting tool; saying to the young man that, "look, in a year or two, if you go out there and become the player we think you can be, you'll get to wear the prestigious #44."

Sorry, most 18 year olds would know James Brown before Jim Brown and most want an opportunity to keep their HS digits.

 

[BKCuse]

Sorry, most 18 year olds would know James Brown before Jim Brown and most want an opportunity to keep their HS digits.

I think you'd be surprised how many kids know about 44 thanks to "The Express" film. These kids who are getting recruited are football junkies and there aren't really that many football films so, while not every recruit knows plenty do.

And for those who don't know, it doesn't take long to educate. Kids and families research the schools that are recruiting them and once they learn the history of 44 and watch the film it will carry just as much weight.

 

[cuseguy]

I think you'd be surprised how many kids know about 44 thanks to "The Express" film. These kids who are getting recruited are football junkies and there aren't really that many football films so, while not every recruit knows plenty do. And for those who don't know, it doesn't take long to educate. Kids and families research the schools that are recruiting them and once they learn the history of 44 and watch the film it will carry just as much weight.

Exactly. And by not trying to capitalize on this right after the movie came out, we may have already blown the opportunity to take advantage of the number. It's called smart marketing.

 

[SUFaninNJ]

How the coaching staff wants to use 44 is up to them. The options seem to be: keep it retired, offer it to an incoming freshman, or offer it to an established player who earns it. I'd prefer option #2, myself. Will they always get it right, probably not. Then again, SU's history shows that despite the number's legacy growing to mythic proportions (in the 315 anyway), the focus is on the accomplishments of the Big 3, not of those who never reached those lofty heights. If a single recruit is offered 44 and comes to SU, I think fans and players alike would think that this player must be something special. If "most" recruits don't know why the number is important to SU football, that only emphasizes the point that it isn't offered to most recruits. I'd just like to see the option on the table. I don't want, nor expect it to be offered in a random haphazard fashion. It won't be offered to "most" recruits. Is it taking a chance on tarnishing the hallowed number? I don't think so at all. Brown, Davis and Little's accomplishments will still stand, as will their statues outside of the IPF. If the recruit turns into a special player at SU, then maybe we'll be enjoying some good times again watching SU football. If a high school player wore 42 and not 44, it's not like they're going to force him to switch. (Unless he besmirches the legacy of Kirby Dar Dar). What if he wore 44 and wants to keep it? I think it's the coaches job to get the best players to come to The Hill and to shape them into a winning team. If they think that offering 44 to a player helps them in their mission, more power to them.

 

[TheCusian]

Sorry, most 18 year olds would know James Brown before Jim Brown and most want an opportunity to keep their HS digits.

You're completely wrong. Jim Brown remains the GOAT and is talked about a lot by fans of football. And The Express continues to get mentioned by recruits. Floyd's time on the hill helped educate recruits too - and made a very big impression on Moe Neal.

 

[bnoro]

You're completely wrong. Jim Brown remains the GOAT and is talked about a lot by fans of football. And The Express continues to get mentioned by recruits. Floyd's time on the hill helped educate recruits too - and made a very big impression on Moe Neal.

Exactly. So there's no reason to unretire the number because its legend continues to live on.

 

[MSOrange]

Yes it should be used. We have so few traditions, I hated to see this one die. Sure not every player will turn out to be a legend or star, but I just thought it was a horrible decision to kill it for what I feel was just trying to increase attendance for one game.

 

[JrodCuse]

I think you have two viable uses of the number.

1) Have it be something handed out to an incoming freshman who checks off several boxes (skill position player, good character, morals, values, legitimate high value recruit 4*/5*).

2) Have it become something that is issued to upperclassmen who have earned it through their time at Cuse. A legitimate big time player at a bevy of important positions who has all the key intangibles you require of someone to carry on the tradition. The coaches would have been able to see the player up close and personally for a few years and make the decision to let them wear it as a lease on a year by year basis as long as they keep up their end of the bargain.

I think keeping it retired is kind of silly. At the end of the day it is just a number and we should use it. Let the coaching staff and players continue the legacy, not let it fade off into bolivia.

 

[TheCusian]

Exactly. So there's no reason to unretire the number because its legend continues to live on.

I don't think that's an unreasonable take. I'd just prefer to see someone who is a great player and of high character back on the field wearing the number. I have memories of it on the field (not Davis/Brown/Little, but still very good players). I want my kids to see it the same way I did. A spotlight on a deserving kid who is honoring those who came before.

 

[Ish88888]

I think you have two viable uses of the number.

1) Have it be something handed out to an incoming freshman who checks off several boxes (skill position player, good character, morals, values, legitimate high value recruit 4*/5*).

2) Have it become something that is issued to upperclassmen who have earned it through their time at Cuse. A legitimate big time player at a bevy of important positions who has all the key intangibles you require of someone to carry on the tradition. The coaches would have been able to see the player up close and personally for a few years and make the decision to let them wear it as a lease on a year by year basis as long as they keep up their end of the bargain.

I think keeping it retired is kind of silly. At the end of the day it is just a number and we should use it. Let the coaching staff and players continue the legacy, not let it fade off into bolivia.

Very reasonable, while i am all for keeping it retired but see you half way in REWARDING it to a player that has earned captain status whether on offense, defense, or special teams. But, for the love of god let's not give it to some wildcard incoming frosh!

 

[orange79]

Very reasonable, while i am all for keeping it retired but see you half way in REWARDING it to a player that has earned captain status whether on offense, defense, or special teams. But, for the love of god let's not give it to some wildcard incoming frosh!

I don't think you can give 44 to the captain who is also a center, guard, or tackle. Seems rather exclusionary to the big uglies.

 

[Ish88888]

Good point! College is much more liberal with number distribution to different positions, like defensive ends and 320# d tackles wearing single digits. Question is can you give the Oline 44? A QB? Hell, Flutie sported #22.

 

[cuse62]

I thought I read somewhere Steve Ishmael wanted 8 because of Marvin Harrison. So, I started wondering what were the numbers of the greatest players by position. 44 by running back, ? For linebacker, ? For QB, etc

 

[orange79]

Good point! College is much more liberal with number distribution to different positions, like defensive ends and 320# d tackles wearing single digits. Question is can you give the Oline 44? A QB? Hell, Flutie sported #22.

From the 2015 NCAA Football Rules and Interpretations manual:

According to this, the QB can technically be anything from 1 to 49. And even though the wording says 'It is strongly recommended' and not required, if I am Syracuse, I am not taking my chances with any unusual interpretations of NCAA rules. Personally, I have never seen an interior lineman wear anything but 50-79.