Shy Cullen to the Supplemental Draft

[rrlbees]

Based on my recollection this is correct: internship in lieu of coursework for a semester. It's why a number of big-sport athletes steer clear of Falk. First, it's more difficult to find an internship in Syracuse than in one of the big Northeastern markets, and many athletes need to be on campus for most of the year. Second, obviously, the program puts a lot of demands on players that make completing an internship practically impossible.

I just looked it up. It’s 45 hours per semester per credit.

 

[bcubs9497]

They can, in the fall. Some take less classes. They do it an attempt to get more than 5 hours of sleep, or go 9 hours without eating, after they're up At 5. Have 1 class you struggle in, and now you're toast.

Who was the QB that recently said College football, and College are not compatible? It is, but it's harder than folks may think. One misstep can destroy the whole thing.

Yep. It's pretty much the equivalent of a 40+ hour a week job on full time student status.

 

[OttoMets]

I just looked it up. It’s 45 hours per semester per credit.

Gotcha. So 12 credits puts you at 540; 14 or 16 quite a few more than that. I don't know what's standard for an undergrad at SU.

 

[bcubs9497]

The whole story of you actually want it is he was late getting signed up for his internship. He signed up with one place but couldn’t make the hours work. He switched to a different place in late October. He did not get enough hours. He had planned to do most them in December but with practice for the bowl and his other classes he didn’t get enough hours. Still his fault don’t get me wrong. Unfortunately it was the only class counting as progressing towards his degree.. he would have taken psychology in the spring as his only class and his second internship in the fall. Along with other filler classes to have enough credits. We didn’t find out he didn’t pass the internship till the end of January and didn’t realize failing it would make him ineligible. It wasn’t until a couple weeks ago that we found out he was ineligible.

The way everything's structured, it's difficult to get those hours...you know that I know. ;D

Praying for a big payday for Shy!

 

[rrlbees]

Full time student(40 hours), D1 football player(40 hours), internship(40 hours). That's only 120 hours a week . Have to write off gameday, so 6 days. I see only 20 hours of work a day. Away games, need to write off a travel day, so 5 days. Only need to work 24 hours a day. How could that ever be a problem?

Sincerely,
The NCAA

Gross exaggeration and incorrect. The ncaa doesn’t require an internship.

 

[RandomGuy]

Are all internships created equally? I cant believe they are all 540 hours. That’s pretty much impossible for anyone unless that’s all you do for the semester with no classes. I don’t think Whitman’s requirement was 540.

That's a D1 athletes regular schedule. Average D1 athlete works 40 hours a week. With film being such a huge part of football, football players personal study (if they want to play, or win) could push it well past 40. Not impossible. Normal NCAA. Adding an internship? Phewwww...

 

[RandomGuy]

Gross exaggeration and incorrect. The ncaa doesn’t require an internship.

The class did, correct?

 

[rrlbees]

Gotcha. So 12 credits puts you at 540; 14 or 16 quite a few more than that. I don't know what's standard for an undergrad at SU.

If your major requires 12 credits of internships which I know many if not most don’t. Some don’t get credit at all, it’s just a requirement to do one just like community service is required. Whitman is a 120 internship but doesn’t have to be all in one semester but has to be business related and at the same company. Same with community service. 75 hour requirement but not all in one semester. No credit for either.

 

[RandomGuy]

Gross exaggeration and incorrect. The ncaa doesn’t require an internship.

FBS players work over 40 a week .

Athletic Travel and Practice Requirements Are Overwhelming Students — The James G. Martin Center for Academic Renewal

Over Thanksgiving break, when most students headed home for the holiday to catch up on sleep and maybe some homework, NC State’s basketball team traveled to the Bahamas. They were … Continue reading "Athletic Travel and Practice Requirements Are Overwhelming Students"

www.jamesgmartin.center

 

[rrlbees]

That's a D1 athletes regular schedule. Average D1 athlete works 40 hours a week. With film being such a huge part of football, football players personal study (if they want to play, or win) could push it well past 40. Not impossible. Normal NCAA Adding an internship? Phewwww...

Ive never seen where the ncaa requires internship. It’s a school thing. Even SUs requirements are different from major to major.

 

[rrlbees]

The class did, correct?

No idea. But I doubt it was a 540 hour requirement in one semester.

 

[rrlbees]

FBS players work over 40 a week .

Athletic Travel and Practice Requirements Are Overwhelming Students — The James G. Martin Center for Academic Renewal

Over Thanksgiving break, when most students headed home for the holiday to catch up on sleep and maybe some homework, NC State’s basketball team traveled to the Bahamas. They were … Continue reading "Athletic Travel and Practice Requirements Are Overwhelming Students"

www.jamesgmartin.center

That’s not the point. You said the ncaa requires an internship.

 

[RandomGuy]

That’s not the point. You said the ncaa requires an internship.

Only going off what bam said. The internship was a requirement of the course, if I understood correctly. The NCAA doesn't require an internship, but they do require a progress towards graduation course. If you need an internship to pass the course ...

Never did say the NCAA required an internship. ;-). If the academic demands of the athlete does? Then what?

 

[rrlbees]

Only going off what bam said. The internship was a requirement of the course, if I understood correctly. The NCAA doesn't require an internship, but they do require a progress towards graduation course. If you need an internship to pass the course ...

I’ll defer back to my very first post in this thread.

 

[djorange1989]

Yep. It's pretty much the equivalent of a 40+ hour a week job on full time student status.

and that job takes a major physical toll that most everyday jobs don't. even that much more difficult

 

[Finwad32]

Are all internships created equally? I cant believe they are all 540 hours. That’s pretty much impossible for anyone unless that’s all you do for the semester with no classes. I don’t think Whitman’s requirement was 540.

Usually closer to 400 in my experience. FWIW - we scrambled to find quality internship placement for all necessary pretty regularly. And the onus is largely put on the student to find one at our level.

 

[Bambrewer]

It was 120 hrs for his class. Not an impossible amount but one that should probably have been handled out of season. It probably wouldn’t have been a problem had he started with the internship the beginning of September but losing 2 months hurt him. He finished around 85 hrs. I can go into the problems he had because he didn’t have a car and everything else that made small problems into this but it really isn’t important. The past is the past. The school has rules the ncaa has rules. It’s hard to be a student athlete but many do it and are very successful. Shy just couldn’t get it done in this case.

 

[RandomGuy]

I’ll defer back to my very first post in this thread.

;-). My larger point, was the load put on the Athlete. NCAA would like folks to believe the 20 hours a week per athlete, fantasy. If an internship is academically required, they really don't care - if it "looks" like they're putting the student part first. They're supposed to be "protecting" the student. They're either, so out of touch, and clueless, or completely heartless.

 

[rrlbees]

It was 120 hrs for his class. Not an impossible amount but one that should probably have been handled out of season. It probably wouldn’t have been a problem had he started with the internship the beginning of September but losing 2 months hurt him. He finished around 85 hrs. I can go into the problems he had because he didn’t have a car and everything else that made small problems into this but it really isn’t important. The past is the past. The school has rules the ncaa has rules. It’s hard to be a student athlete but many do it and are very successful. Shy just couldn’t get it done in this case.

And he has to do the 120 all in one semester? That’s the hard part and a Falk issue. Whitman is also 120 but can be done multiple semesters including the summer.

 

[OttoMets]

;-). My larger point, was the load put on the Athlete. NCAA would like folks to believe the 20 hours a week per athlete, fantasy. If an internship is academically required, they really don't care - if it "looks" like they're putting the student part first. They're supposed to be "protecting" the student. They're either, so out of touch, and clueless, or completely heartless.

I agree...but "the NCAA" in this case is the schools. They're the member institutions who have a say in things like practice limits (instead of deferring to coaches who want to keep up with the Joneses by requiring crazy hours of film review and S&C work). If the greedy chancellors and trustees wanted to put the students first, they could. But they've got other priorities.

 

[bnoro]

Only going off what bam said. The internship was a requirement of the course, if I understood correctly. The NCAA doesn't require an internship, but they do require a progress towards graduation course. If you need an internship to pass the course ...

Never did say the NCAA required an internship. ;-). If the academic demands of the athlete does? Then what?

The internship is a 12 credit class. You don't take any other classes while interning. Most students in Falk do this off campus. I was at MSG for mine, only was on campus 3 times that fall. The Capstone was a requirement to graduate Falk.



EDIT: reading Bam's post it wasn't the Capstone that Shy was referring to. Sorry to confuse.

 

[Bambrewer]

And he has to do the 120 all in one semester? That’s the hard part and a Falk issue. Whitman is also 120 but can be done multiple semesters including the summer.

Yes that is correct

 

[Bambrewer]

The internship is a 12 credit class. You don't take any other classes while interning. Most students in Falk do this off campus. I was at MSG for mine, only was on campus 3 times that fall. The Capstone was a requirement to graduate Falk.



EDIT: reading Bam's post it wasn't the Capstone that Shy was referring to. Sorry to confuse.

I think that was the one he was going to do next fall.

 

[RandomGuy]

With the crazy schedules of college athletes, you'd think the NCAA would realize the time demands, and understand that sometimes, stuff happens. Especially when that student has remained academically eligible for 6+ semesters. To rarely give a waiver, regardless, seems off.

This stinks. Best of luck to Shy.

 

[leftytg]

It was 120 hrs for his class. Not an impossible amount but one that should probably have been handled out of season. It probably wouldn’t have been a problem had he started with the internship the beginning of September but losing 2 months hurt him. He finished around 85 hrs. I can go into the problems he had because he didn’t have a car and everything else that made small problems into this but it really isn’t important. The past is the past. The school has rules the ncaa has rules. It’s hard to be a student athlete but many do it and are very successful. Shy just couldn’t get it done in this case.

I just wanted to commend you for your maturity and level headedness as expressed in this post. More than a few posters on this board could learn a thing or two from you. The impulse to blame anyone and everyone is seductive, but you've stayed centered in your perspective. Such thinking is a credit to you and your children are lucky to have such a father.

Bam can certainly correct me if I'm wrong, but I think people may be getting hung up on the wrong part of the internship thing. As I'm understanding it (and again, correct me if i'm wrong), the NCAA doesn't particularly care about internship or whatever. What the NCAA needs (for perfectly appropriate reasons) is progress toward earning the degree in every semester. Because it seems like the internship was the only class that semester (?), not completing it meant not making any progress toward the degree for that semester. Had Shy taken the internship along with another class that went toward earning the degree - and didn't finish the internship, but did get credit for the other class - he would have been considered making progress toward his degree and so long as the cumulative GPA was acceptable, would not have been ineligible. But since all the eggs were in the internship basket, and the internship was not completed, it was as if Shy played football last fall as a college student without earning any credits.