Shy Cullen to the Supplemental Draft

MSOrange

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With the crazy schedules of college athletes, you'd think the NCAA would realize the time demands, and understand that sometimes, stuff happens. Especially when that student has remained academically eligible for 6+ semesters. To rarely give a waiver, regardless, seems off.

This stinks. Best of luck to Shy.
I can understand not going down the road with waivers. That would seem to open up questions about why in some cases and not in others.

But this whole thing certainly doesn't lend itself to the idea of athletes taking serious majors. Credit to Bam and Shy for how they have handled the situation. Getting a better understanding of the true time commitment of athletes has been eye-opening. I wasn't naive - I knew it was a huge commitment but it's been interesting to learn even more about it.
 

Bambrewer

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I just wanted to commend you for your maturity and level headedness as expressed in this post. More than a few posters on this board could learn a thing or two from you. The impulse to blame anyone and everyone is seductive, but you've stayed centered in your perspective. Such thinking is a credit to you and your children are lucky to have such a father.

Bam can certainly correct me if I'm wrong, but I think people may be getting hung up on the wrong part of the internship thing. As I'm understanding it (and again, correct me if i'm wrong), the NCAA doesn't particularly care about internship or whatever. What the NCAA needs (for perfectly appropriate reasons) is progress toward earning the degree in every semester. Because it seems like the internship was the only class that semester (?), not completing it meant not making any progress toward the degree for that semester. Had Shy taken the internship along with another class that went toward earning the degree - and didn't finish the internship, but did get credit for the other class - he would have been considered making progress toward his degree and so long as the cumulative GPA was acceptable, would not have been ineligible. But since all the eggs were in the internship basket, and the internship was not completed, it was as if Shy played football last fall as a college student without earning any credits.
Thank you for the kind words. Yes you are correct in what you said. I think random guy was more pointing out the overall demands of an athlete though. I think he was saying a school asking for an internship on top of all the regular class and football stuff is a bit much. He isn’t wrong but again a lot of kids do make it through. I think if your a player and aren’t very organized in your time management you can be run over by the schedule. I can tell you there is a lot of kids struggling with grades or on probation. It’s a hard schedule to pull off.
 

rrlbees

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With the crazy schedules of college athletes, you'd think the NCAA would realize the time demands, and understand that sometimes, stuff happens. Especially when that student has remained academically eligible for 6+ semesters. To rarely give a waiver, regardless, seems off.

This stinks. Best of luck to Shy.
falk
 

SmilinBob

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Sorry to hear Shy won't be able to continue at SU...one heck of a life lesson. Good luck with whatever path he takes and we'll always be rooting for him.

Thank you for posting and as many have said, being of stable mind even when you had situations that many would complain to all that could hear. You show by example how your son should live his life and your posts here were, are and will be always appreciated.
 

OttoMets

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I can understand not going down the road with waivers. That would seem to open up questions about why in some cases and not in others.

But this whole thing certainly doesn't lend itself to the idea of athletes taking serious majors. Credit to Bam and Shy for how they have handled the situation. Getting a better understanding of the true time commitment of athletes has been eye-opening. I wasn't naive - I knew it was a huge commitment but it's been interesting to learn even more about it.
I remember a DO piece from a few years back about Marrone steering his players out of STEM majors because the coursework would interfere with football.
 

CuseLegacy

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I remember a DO piece from a few years back about Marrone steering his players out of STEM majors because the coursework would interfere with football.
And that's not right. Schools and the NCAA should be making more effort for kids to succeed and get a useful education. The majority of these kids are never going to play professionally in any sport.
 

MSOrange

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And that's not right. Schools and the NCAA should be making more effort for kids to succeed and get a useful education. The majority of these kids are never going to play professionally in any sport.
Exactly. I'm a huge sports fan but as I've matured, I've realized that having productive members of society is just a wee bit important also. Not to say you can't do that without a college degree, but having a useful degree helps.
 

OttoMets

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And that's not right. Schools and the NCAA should be making more effort for kids to succeed and get a useful education. The majority of these kids are never going to play professionally in any sport.
Just imagine - a 19-year-old kid has leveraged his football skill to earn admission to college (which is likely his athletic ceiling). And the man who's his mentor prevents him from best a) enriching himself and b) monetizing the experience by earning an engineering degree. All for what? More time in the film room?

It's antithetical to higher education.
 

RandomGuy

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And that's not right. Schools and the NCAA should be making more effort for kids to succeed and get a useful education. The majority of these kids are never going to play professionally in any sport.
There's a conflict of interest, in what the NCAA says, and the reality of it. To me, it just seems if they truly cared about the education part, they'd be able to work with situations like this. But that would take an admittance that football comes first, and that's not going to happen. Disheartening. I feel for Shy and his family. Wishing the best.
 

rrlbees

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There's a conflict of interest, in what the NCAA says, and the reality of it. To me, it just seems if they truly cared about the education part, they'd be able to work with situations like this. But that would take an admittance that football comes first, and that's not going to happen. Disheartening. I feel for Shy and his family. Wishing the best.
You keep saying ncaa, but SU made him ineligible because basically he didn’t complete his internship on time. I’d falk had the same internship requirements as Whitman and probably other SU schools, he might be eligible. You want to dig and get answers, find out why falk, unlike Whitman and athletes there like Dungey and Whitney, has the internship as a credit bearing course that has to all be done in the same semester.
 

RandomGuy

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You keep saying ncaa, but SU made him ineligible because basically he didn’t complete his internship on time. I’d falk had the same internship requirements as Whitman and probably other SU schools, he might be eligible. You want to dig and get answers, find out why falk, unlike Whitman and athletes there like Dungey and Whitney, has the internship as a credit bearing course that has to all be done in the same semester.
Understood. Falk, too. I say NCAA because they'd be the ones a waiver might have to go through(almost always denied), for similar circumstances. It'd be nice if the NCAA worked with the schools(with full understanding of demands), in an attempt to find a path towards graduation.

Mostly, I hate when crappy things happen to good people.
 

CuseLegacy

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You keep saying ncaa, but SU made him ineligible because basically he didn’t complete his internship on time. I’d falk had the same internship requirements as Whitman and probably other SU schools, he might be eligible. You want to dig and get answers, find out why falk, unlike Whitman and athletes there like Dungey and Whitney, has the internship as a credit bearing course that has to all be done in the same semester.
I agree with you. There is something wrong with the Falk internship requirement, especially when you have a student athlete that has a learning disability. But I also think that the bureaucracy that is the NCAA needs to be less heartless in their appeal process. The goal should always be to help these kids become successful.
 

OttoMets

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I agree with you. There is something wrong with the Falk internship requirement, especially when you have a student athlete that has a learning disability. But I also think that the bureaucracy that is the NCAA needs to be less heartless in their appeal process. The goal should always be to help these kids become successful.
Hopefully I'm not stepping into a steaming pile of h0t takes right now, but it's a necessary flaw in the degree program (we are talking about sport management, right?). Because it's more of a trade than a discipline -- and there are only so many relevant courses a kid can take -- they've got to fill up a semester somehow and simulated career experience is as good a way as any to do that.
 

rrlbees

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I agree with you. There is something wrong with the Falk internship requirement, especially when you have a student athlete that has a learning disability. But I also think that the bureaucracy that is the NCAA needs to be less heartless in their appeal process. The goal should always be to help these kids become successful.
IMO, it would open a huge can of worms if the ncaa gave waivers to athletes who were declared ineligible by the school. And if the school looked the other way and made him eligible, that opens a can of worms with other SU students, athletes or not. With so many athletes in the falk school, it really makes things real difficult for them with the internship being credit bearing thus making it part of the progress to graduation formula. 120 hrs over the 15 weeks is 8 per week on average. Not impossible obviously but not a slam dunk with all their other time requirements.
 

RandomGuy

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Hopefully I'm not stepping into a steaming pile of h0t takes right now, but it's a necessary flaw in the degree program (we are talking about sport management, right?). Because it's more of a trade than a discipline -- and there are only so many relevant courses a kid can take -- they've got to fill up a semester somehow and simulated career experience is as good a way as any to do that.
Nahh. That's not a steaming pile. I don't question the need for an internship. When you look at the time demands it can become -problematic, at least in season.
 

rrlbees

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Hopefully I'm not stepping into a steaming pile of h0t takes right now, but it's a necessary flaw in the degree program (we are talking about sport management, right?). Because it's more of a trade than a discipline -- and there are only so many relevant courses a kid can take -- they've got to fill up a semester somehow and simulated career experience is as good a way as any to do that.
Sports management is only one of several falk majors. And internships are great. It’s s matter of making them credit bearing or not.
 

CuseLegacy

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IMO, it would open a huge can of worms if the ncaa gave waivers to athletes who were declared ineligible by the school. And if the school looked the other way and made him eligible, that opens a can of worms with other SU students, athletes or not. With so many athletes in the falk school, it really makes things real difficult for them with the internship being credit bearing thus making it part of the progress to graduation formula. 120 hrs over the 15 weeks is 8 per week on average. Not impossible obviously but not a slam dunk with all their other time requirements.
I wasn't saying to give them a waiver if they are ineligible by the school but rather for the NCAA to consider the circumstances of the situation of how the loss of progression towards graduation occurred. If it had simply been a situation of Shy taking courses and obtaining a certain gpa to be readmitted to SU, like any other student, I think he would be back on campus next month. But because there was only that one course, the internship, he lost his NCAA eligibility. The coaches' plan for an appeal to the NCAA was a Hail Mary. I would hope that a student athlete wouldn't be advised to take only one course that would determine NCAA eligibility and loss of scholarship if failed.
 

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I would hope that a student athlete wouldn't be advised to take only one course that would determine NCAA eligibility and loss of scholarship if failed.
It sounds like Shy had 3 courses to complete over 3 semesters. 1 a semester to meet progress towards graduation? Beats me.

You mention he should have the same opportunity as any other student for readmittance. I whole heartedly agree. NCAA rules don't seem to allow that. Crazy.
 

rrlbees

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You mention he should have the same opportunity as any other student for readmittance. I whole heartedly agree. NCAA rules don't seem to allow that. Crazy.
what ncaa rule doesn't allow su to readmit him?
 

CuseLegacy

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what ncaa rule doesn't allow su to readmit him?
And if readmitted he probably couldn't afford the tuition because he lost his scholarship when declared ineligible by the NCAA.
 

Shark58

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sorry to have heard the news

Shy is a hell of person and was hoping to see him crush from LB this year. Bam was (is) great both on this board and in the stands. wish him him and his family nothing but the best. Shy wore his Orange well.
 

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