Sounds like Hacket's genius was on full display

[orangenirvana]

I know, I know...can't judge a team based on their spring game, this could mean that our defense is dominant, Hackett didn't call plays, they were being vanilla on O for fear of spies, etc.

My biggest concern is the utter lack of development we have seen from each position on offense under this coaching staff, especially from the OLine (supposedly Marrone's area of expertise) and QB.

So is the Quarterback issue a red flag as to the coaching staff's ability (or lack thereof) of developing the position at the appropriate rate a BCS program should be developing them? Or is it the coaching staff's poor eye for talent with regard to the position...and they've just gotten all they can out of Nassib's limited abilities?

Or is it Greg Robinson's fault?

 

[orangeinohio]

We have to hope that Broyld and Hunt both make a tremendous amount of progress over the next year. I don't know how this is supposed to happen but we can pray.

 

[JeremyCuse]

I know, I know...can't judge a team based on their spring game, this could mean that our defense is dominant, Hackett didn't call plays, they were being vanilla on O for fear of spies, etc.

My biggest concern is the utter lack of development we have seen from each position on offense under this coaching staff, especially from the OLine (supposedly Marrone's area of expertise) and QB.

So is the Quarterback issue a red flag as to the coaching staff's ability (or lack thereof) of developing the position at the appropriate rate a BCS program should be developing them? Or is it the coaching staff's poor eye for talent with regard to the position...and they've just gotten all they can out of Nassib's limited abilities?

Or is it Greg Robinson's fault?

The fact we couldnt score one touchdown (from what I heard) against our own defense during the spring game is a huge red flag. The good news is that with Lemon being hurt we were missing him and several other guys who can make a difference ie AAM and the incoming freshmen TE's. I agree 100% on Hacket though I hope hes the O coordinator in name only because his play calling last year was abysmal.

 

[PhatOrange]

The fact we couldnt score one touchdown (from what I heard) against our own defense during the spring game is a huge red flag. The good news is that Lemon was hurt and we are missing some other guys who can make a difference ie AAM and the incoming freshmen TE's. I agree 100% on Hacket though I hope hes the O coordinator in name only because his play calling last year was abysmal.

Hackett can't be dumped soon enough for me.

 

[OttoForLife]

The fact we couldnt score one touchdown (from what I heard) against our own defense during the spring game is a huge red flag. The good news is that Lemon was hurt and we are missing some other guys who can make a difference ie AAM and the incoming freshmen TE's. I agree 100% on Hacket though I hope hes the O coordinator in name only because his play calling last year was abysmal.

Lemon, yes, is a contributor. AAM and incoming freshmen are not what I would categorize as "good news" just yet.

Hate to be overly critical based on a scrimmage, but yeesh...

 

[JeremyCuse]

Hackett can't be dumped soon enough for me.

I have no idea why he wasnt let go this past year, I know Marrone likes him personally but there way to many play calling blunders last year for him to survive.

 

[JeremyCuse]

Lemon, yes, is a contributor. AAM and incoming freshmen are not what I would categorize as "good news" just yet.

Hate to be overly critical based on a scrimmage, but yeesh...

Getting those two highly rated TE's in the summer will be a big help. Our TE situation needs some help big time those two plus Cornelius will be welcome additions.

 

[Upstate]

Everyone has claimed that the Spring game has been vanilla for the last 3 seasons, when in reality, it's just the offense SU is going to run. We've played this game before, and nothing has changed.

 

[OrangeCrush22]

Closed practices then a sh@tty spring game, I'm not too enthralled.

 

[orangenirvana]

Hackett can't be dumped soon enough for me.

2011 was supposed to be the year that the offense took a huge step and carried the team as the young defense was rebuilding. That didn't happen.

Marrone's retaining of Hackett was an awful move and Marrone deserves to take major heat when it doesn't work out this season (despite those who think he is immune to criticism because facilities are so poor).

 

[OrangePA]

I know, I know...can't judge a team based on their spring game, this could mean that our defense is dominant, Hackett didn't call plays, they were being vanilla on O for fear of spies, etc.

My biggest concern is the utter lack of development we have seen from each position on offense under this coaching staff, especially from the OLine (supposedly Marrone's area of expertise) and QB.

So is the Quarterback issue a red flag as to the coaching staff's ability (or lack thereof) of developing the position at the appropriate rate a BCS program should be developing them? Or is it the coaching staff's poor eye for talent with regard to the position...and they've just gotten all they can out of Nassib's limited abilities?

Or is it Greg Robinson's fault?

So you lead with a pretty provocative statement and then immediately back off with the logical observation that one can draw very few conclusions from a spring game. I don't get it.

And then you state that there has been no development at any position on the offense.

I don't know what you're watching.

Kobena looks much improved. Macky looks improved. Foy looks improved. Jerome Smith looks much improved. PT Gulley looks improved. Max Beaulieu even looks improved at TE.

And, in three years Nassib has improved a great deal. Clearly he is no Marino or Cam Newton, but has become a steady manager of the offense. He has won 13 games in two years including a bowl game. I think the comment you have included as a suggestion is probably accurate - the coaches have squeezed just about all that can be squeezed out of Ryan Nassib.

 

[orange126]

Thought play calling was fine, lots of effort, some guys looked like playmakers and some didn't.
Years of watching this process would lead me to predict that in the opener we will not shut out Northwestern nor will they shut us out. It was interesting and fun to watch the team in a controlled scrimmage. Crowd was decent but typically subdued. I re-located my season tickets to a perferred location. Can't wait for opener.

 

[Orange Rust Belt]

Vanilla offense, maybe, but Hackett is without question in the top 10 for most under qualified coaches at the BCS level. Take away the WV game and a blind man picking plays out of a hat would have had as much success as Hackett did. Anyone who doesn't think Hacketts retainment was political is wearing very thick and orange tinted Buddy Holly glasses.

 

[OrangePA]

Vanilla offense, maybe, but Hackett is without question in the top 10 for most under qualified coaches at the BCS level. Take away the WV game and a blind man picking plays out of a hat would have had as much success as Hackett did. Anyone who doesn't think Hacketts retainment was political is wearing very thick and orange tinted Buddy Holly glasses.

I'm just curious.

What basis do you have for making the statement that Hackett is under qualified - other than your lay observations of how the team plays on Saturdays?

Are you a football coach?

Have you reviewed one of his game plans? Can you explain the schematics of his offense? Have you watched him break down film? Have you watched and listened as he has coached on the field during practice?

Maybe I'm wrong but I suspect that you have no basis other than what you think you see during games and your perceived ability to extrapolate from a resume. (By the way, the Resume thing can be deceiving. Greg Robinson had a pretty good Resume) And the fact is that you - and I for that matter - have really no idea what is happening during games or why it is happening - especially on the offensive side of the ball.

Was he a great coach against WVU/K-State and a terrible coach against Cincy this past season?

I mean, how do you explain that dynamic?

And, do you think he would coached better last year had he had Marcus Sales?

Look, the fire the OC stuff has been going on around here for as long as Syracusefan.com has been in existence. It was DeLeone, Pariani, White, Browning, Spence and now it's Hackett.

I know that lay fans always look to the offensive coaches because they think they know what's going on on that side of the ball.

But it's really old stuff.

 

[PhatOrange]

I'm just curious.

What basis do you have for making the statement that Hackett is under qualified - other than your lay observations of how the team plays on Saturdays?

Are you a football coach?

Have you reviewed one of his game plans? Can you explain the schematics of his offense? Have you watched him break down film? Have you watched and listened as he has coached on the field during practice?

Maybe I'm wrong but I suspect that you have no basis other than what you think you see during games and your perceived ability to extrapolate from a resume. (By the way, the Resume thing can be deceiving. Greg Robinson had a pretty good Resume) And the fact is that you - and I for that matter - have really no idea what is happening during games or why it is happening - especially on the offensive side of the ball.

Was he a great coach against WVU/K-State and a terrible coach against Cincy this past season?

I mean, how do you explain that dynamic?

And, do you think he would coached better last year had he had Marcus Sales?

Look, the fire the OC stuff has been going on around here for as long as Syracusefan.com has been in existence. It was DeLeone, Pariani, White, Browning, Spence and now it's Hackett.

I know that lay fans always look to the offensive coaches because they think they know what's going on on that side of the ball.

But it's really old stuff.

I would just prefer someone with 5-10 years of proven/successful - coordinating, someone with proven QB coaching on the resume and someone who can recruit.

 

[RMH44]

I would just prefer someone with 5-10 years of proven/successful - coordinating, someone with proven QB coaching on the resume and someone who can recruit.

With our payroll?????? Besides, didn't the previous OC meet all your stated criteria?

 

[OrangePA]

I would just prefer someone with 5-10 years of proven/successful - coordinating, someone with proven QB coaching on the resume and someone who can recruit.

Like who?

Bobby Petrino?

I don't mean to be flippant, but you and I have no idea who is qualified and who is not.

I thought Greg Robinson was a proven football coach. And we know how that turned out

I thought Brian White was a proven OC and few on this board liked him. Same thing with Browning. Proven guy who did nothing on the Hill.

Rob Spence - proven OC and QB coach. And few on this board liked him.

You're gonna have to give Doug Marrone some credit. It's his butt on the line. He's not going to hire or keep a guy who can't coach.

Be patient. And wait to see what Hackett and the rest of the coaches can do with better and more experienced talent.

I strongly suspect that Ashton Broyld and Marcus Sales will make Hackett a better coach this fall.

 

[kingottoiii]

Look, the fire the OC stuff has been going on around here for as long as Syracusefan.com has been in existence. It was DeLeone, Pariani, White, Browning, Spence and now it's Hackett.

I do get people being upset with our system the last two years, and what looked like today will be this year's system. That IMO really doesn't fall on Hackett. I do not understand why he has been singled out by some here, when he has done a decent job calling plays. The issue IMO is the playbook he has to choose plays from, not the plays he is choosing. We did mix in some zone read and PA off of it last year and in this Spring game. Hopefully that trend will continue this season and next. If we run our base O the last two years with the QBs we have on our roster, 2013 will be ugly.

I have seen both Loeb and Kinder in the Spring games and ED scrimmages and IMO in each of them Kinder has outperformed Loeb. Granted that most of the plays Kinder has made have been in the more improvisational variety, but that IMO just shows that the system is part of the issue. Kinder has made some plays out there. Loeb isn't making plays. So how is it that Kinder has not passed Loeb on the depth chart? I wouldn't be surprised if Loeb knows the O more. I wouldn't be surprised if Loeb is better at executing in practice within the context of the O. But when Loeb has shown no ability to move the O, while Kinder has made plays, at some point don't you think the O might be part of the issue? Why not put the player who has the ability to make plays out there? I by no means think Kinder should be getting PT this year, and hope that Hunt or Broyld beat him out in 2013. But if we ever needed to have Kinder or Loeb take snaps in a game, IMO Kinder would give us the best chance of moving the football and scoring points. That IMO should be the most important factor for the depth chart. Who gives you the best chance to win.

 

[tipphill]

I'm just curious.

What basis do you have for making the statement that Hackett is under qualified - other than your lay observations of how the team plays on Saturdays?

Are you a football coach?

Have you reviewed one of his game plans? Can you explain the schematics of his offense? Have you watched him break down film? Have you watched and listened as he has coached on the field during practice?

Maybe I'm wrong but I suspect that you have no basis other than what you think you see during games and your perceived ability to extrapolate from a resume. (By the way, the Resume thing can be deceiving. Greg Robinson had a pretty good Resume) And the fact is that you - and I for that matter - have really no idea what is happening during games or why it is happening - especially on the offensive side of the ball.

Was he a great coach against WVU/K-State and a terrible coach against Cincy this past season?

I mean, how do you explain that dynamic?

And, do you think he would coached better last year had he had Marcus Sales?

Look, the fire the OC stuff has been going on around here for as long as Syracusefan.com has been in existence. It was DeLeone, Pariani, White, Browning, Spence and now it's Hackett.

I know that lay fans always look to the offensive coaches because they think they know what's going on on that side of the ball.

But it's really old stuff.

i was not at the game, in reading the threads re:same, the message i get is the product is very lacking, it doesn't matter who or what you want to blame, bottom line is,it's still below par. what screams out to me is 9PTS. spin it anyway you want it still READS VERY BAD. well, anyway we will see in the fall and un-like me, i'm going for 8-4 last year i said 4-8. hoping marrone has finally brought the meaning of team back as he had for the pinstripe bowl.the blame game is worthless, it begins and ends with doug---i am still on board---

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Daniel Anyaegbunam. Jesse Wolf-Gould.

This was the right side of the starting OL for one of the two teams today.

No wonder Bromley and Sharpe had a field day.

 

[OrangePA]

I do get people being upset with our system the last two years, and what looked like today will be this year's system. That IMO really doesn't fall on Hackett. I do not understand why he has been singled out by some here, when he has done a decent job calling plays. The issue IMO is the playbook he has to choose plays from, not the plays he is choosing. We did mix in some zone read and PA off of it last year and in this Spring game. Hopefully that trend will continue this season and next. If we run our base O the last two years with the QBs we have on our roster, 2013 will be ugly.

I have seen both Loeb and Kinder in the Spring games and ED scrimmages and IMO in each of them Kinder has outperformed Loeb. Granted that most of the plays Kinder has made have been in the more improvisational variety, but that IMO just shows that the system is part of the issue. Kinder has made some plays out there. Loeb isn't making plays. So how is it that Kinder has not passed Loeb on the depth chart? I wouldn't be surprised if Loeb knows the O more. I wouldn't be surprised if Loeb is better at executing in practice within the context of the O. But when Loeb has shown no ability to move the O, while Kinder has made plays, at some point don't you think the O might be part of the issue? Why not put the player who has the ability to make plays out there? I by no means think Kinder should be getting PT this year, and hope that Hunt or Broyld beat him out in 2013. But if we ever needed to have Kinder or Loeb take snaps in a game, IMO Kinder would give us the best chance of moving the football and scoring points. That IMO should be the most important factor for the depth chart. Who gives you the best chance to win.

I want to love Kinder, but I did not see much from him today. I think he threw one fairly nice seem route. Otherwise he seemed to be throwing the ball up for grabs. And he lost a bad fumble that Sharpe I think returned for a TD. I thought he had a tough day.

I thought Loeb was more effective.

I know we have had the "system" debate in the past, but for gosh sakes which "system" do think would make Kinder bigger, faster and a better and more accurate passer? And, don't you think these coaches spend hours and hours trying to put together a "system" that accomodates the talent of the team?

Do you really think that we see things - without knowing much about football - that the coaches don't see on the field and on the film?

 

[OrangePA]

i was not at the game, in reading the threads re:same, the message i get is the product is very lacking, it doesn't matter who or what you want to blame, bottom line is,it's still below par. what screams out to me is 9PTS. spin it anyway you want it still READS VERY BAD. well, anyway we will see in the fall and un-like me, i'm going for 8-4 last year i said 4-8. hoping marrone has finally brought the meaning of team back as he had for the pinstripe bowl.the blame game is worthless, it begins and ends with doug---i am still on board---

Oh for gosh sakes, it was a scrimmage.

Who cares how many points were scored?

Broyld didn't score but anybody who was there today came away very impressed.

 

[kingottoiii]

I know we have had the "system" debate in the past, but for gosh sakes which "system" do think would make Kinder bigger, faster and a better and more accurate passer? And, don't you think these coaches spend hours and hours trying to put together a "system" that accomodates the talent of the team?

Kinder kinda reminds me a bit of Nunes. He will either pull a nice play out of his ass or make you scream What! I rather have that then nothing at all. I am by no means high on Kinder. I do not want to see him on the field but if I had to choose between him and Loeb, I rather see Kinder.

No system would make Kinder a more more accurate passer. But that is kinda my point. In CFB you don't need to be perfect to move the ball or score points. Teams are highly flawed on O and on D. In the NFL you have world class athletes with tons of experience who are professionals and at the top of their game. The slightest flaw a player has can make him a liability to an entire O or D unit. That is why the NFL has the combine.

IMO our OLs when McNabb was here weren't all that good. But our system and his abilities helped to mask that. Had we run our 2010 or 2011 Os with those tams, IMO we would not have been as explosive or put up as many PPG as we did. I think we have NFL coaches who over think things. In the NFL you need complexity and execution to move the ball and score points. IMO CFB is about simplicity and making plays. I really think they are too smart for CFB. I think we are seeing signs of change with wrinkles like the zone read and getting Broyld on the field having multiple rolls. That gives me hope that we aren't stuck in pro style O where you NEED talent at every position and superior execution to make it run well.

 

[tipphill]

Oh for gosh sakes, it was a scrimmage.

Who cares how many points were scored?

Broyld didn't score but anybody who was there today came away very impressed.

orangepa i enjoy your posts, and your articulation, always thought out and well presented---and have been around as long as i therefore know the history--sorry, i think that sometimes you may be too defensive--its not about the points.it's about the PROCESS to score the points. i am almost positive that n'western and usc will not be as impressed as we. anyway as i said, i'm still on board (how many seasons now?)by the way where do you have to travel from?i am in bethlehem pa. could not attend, had to go to 90th birthday party for my son inlaws grandfather

 

[PhatOrange]

With our payroll?????? Besides, didn't the previous OC meet all your stated criteria?

Who was the previous OC - Spence?