starters for this coming season | Page 3 | Syracusefan.com

starters for this coming season

Chip said:
I think the competition and physicality in camp will be like nothing that many of these guys have ever seen. I can't wait to see how it plays out.
Expand...

I just hope it's not too physical.
We had too many teams limp into the season with half of each line injured.
 
Thanks to everyone for their thoughtful write-ups. IMO, projecting lineups is going to be VERY difficult, because we don't have a good sense yet of the systems, and what the coaches may value in players manning certain positions. The spring game provided SOME evidence, but not enough to slot guys in with confidence.

Here's what I have to say about the OL. The staff went out and recruited an impressive group of transfers, several of whom come in with experience. Essentially, they went out and pulled in a potential full starting unit of guys.
  • Washington started at Colorado [LT]
  • Weatherspoon started at Howard at RT
  • Hornsby started at Grambling at OG
  • Miller redshirted at Georgia -- looks like an OG, but played LT in spring practice
Now, I wouldn't be surprised to see any of them / all four of them in the starting lineup. The coaching staff didn't bring those guys in to sit, and three of them are experienced starters. But is a guy like Weatherspoon too slow to play RT in the ACC? Not suggesting he is, just saying it's a question mark. Does his size help him win out and man RT adequately, or does he kick inside as a massive RG?

But it's important to note that while OL hasn't been a strength of the Syracuse Football Program [understatement], last year's group had better depth / talent than we usually have -- and we needed every bit of it to deal with the injuries that wracked up over the season. Without that depth, we would have been sunk. Which means that even with the players who portalled out, there is still a decent nucleus of returning players:
  • J'Onre Reed -- started every game at center
  • Enrique Cruz Jr. -- returning starter at LT, who has struggled a bit
  • Jakob Bradford -- returning starter at RG who was solid [not great]
  • Mark Petry -- emergency starter at RT who filled in due to injury, was at least decent
  • David Wohlabaugh Jr. -- initial starter at RT who missed almost entire season due to injury
That's five [5] guys who've started games here during their careers, and at minimum a full season of starting [except for Wohlabaugh, who got injured game 2].

Beyond them, we have four other guys who seem to be squarely in the mix, based upon spring practice:
  • Joe Cruz -- valuable reserve who's played quite a bit over his first 2 years, poised for bigger role?
  • Josh Ilaoa -- backup C/G
  • Lysander Moeleo -- injured last year, played a lot in the spring game, looks like he's in the mix
  • Trevion Mack -- high caliber athlete who could be poised for bigger role
I'm going to leave the incoming true frosh out of the discussion for now, as they probably have an uphill climb.

I readily acknowledge that just because guys started in the past, that doesn't mean that they should be penciled in to the starting lineup. New coaching staff, new systems, clean slate. But would anyone really be surprised if someone like Cruz, Jr. hangs onto a starting role? Or if Bradford doesn't surrender a starting spot easily? What if Wohlabaugh bounces back fully [kid began his career as a starter in the SEC]?

I also think that some will dismiss the returnees as "...not good enough," and pencil new faces into roles. But I'm guessing that the starting OL and positions on the two deep will be a mixture of incumbents and new guys.

I also think that our depth is going to be VERY solid at OL, even moreso than last year, with even better quality. And depth / competition is a good thing for performance. If I had to guess -- and I fully qualify this by acknowledging that we won't know until we have a better sense of what the new OL coach / OC are looking for, here's what I'd predict:

LT -- Washington -- 6-8 and massive
LG -- Bradford for now, he'll have to fight off Miller
C -- Reed -- better in his second year now that he's experienced and has better personnel around him?
RG -- Hornsby, an experienced transfer
RT -- Wohlabaugh, unless he's impaired -- if so, then Weatherspoon or Cruz

Second unit:

LT -- Cruz Jr.
LG -- Miller
C -- Ilaoa
RG -- Moeleo
RT -- Watherspoon

Third unit:
OT -- Petry
G / T -- Cruz
T / G -- Mack

That's just my opinion, of course, I could be wrong. But it is EXCITING to think that we'll field a competent, huge, powerful OL for the first time in... damn, 2012 -- then back to the late 90s?

And we have the depth / positional versatility to not have the entire unit sunk by a key injury or three.

I expect some FIERCE camp battles. And they'll have a good DL to square off against in practice to get ready, which is also good.
 
Last edited:
RF2044 said:
Thanks to everyone for their thoughtful write-ups. IMO, projecting lineups is going to be VERY difficult, because we don't have a good sense yet of the systems, and what the coaches may value in players manning certain positions. The spring game provided SOME evidence, but not enough to slot guys in with confidence.

Here's what I have to say about the OL. The staff went out and recruited an impressive group of transfers, several of whom come in with experience. Essentially, they went out and pulled in a potential full starting unit of guys.
  • Washington started at Colorado [LT]
  • Weatherspoon started at Howard at RT
  • Hornsby started at Grambling at OG
  • Miller redshirted at Georgia -- looks like an OG, but played LT in spring practice
Now, I wouldn't be surprised to see any of them / all four of them in the starting lineup. The coaching staff didn't bring those guys in to sit, and three of them are experienced starters. But is a guy like Weatherspoon too slow to play RT in the ACC? Not suggesting he is, just saying it's a question mark. Does his size help him win out and man RT adequately, or does he kick inside as a massive RG?

But it's important to note that while OL hasn't been a strength of the Syracuse Football Program [understatement], last year's group had better depth / talent than we usually have -- and we needed every bit of it to deal with the injuries that wracked up over the season. Without that depth, we would have been sunk. Which means that even with the players who portalled out, there is still a decent nucleus of returning players:
  • J'Onre Reed -- started every game at center
  • Enrique Cruz Jr. -- returning starter at LT, who has struggled a bit
  • Jakob Bradford -- returning starter at RG who was solid [not great]
  • Mark Petry -- emergency starter at RT who filled in due to injury, was at least decent
  • David Wohlabaugh Jr. -- initial starter at RT who missed almost entire season due to injury
That's five [5] guys who've started games here during their careers, and at minimum a full season of starting [except for Wohlabaugh, who got injured game 2].

Beyond them, we have four other guys who seem to be squarely in the mix, based upon spring practice:
  • Joe Cruz -- valuable reserve who's played quite a bit over his first 2 years, poised for bigger role?
  • Josh Ilaoa -- backup C/G
  • Lysander Moeleo -- injured last year, played a lot in the spring game, looks like he's in the mix
  • Trevion Mack -- high caliber athlete who could be poised for bigger role
I'm going to leave the incoming true frosh out of the discussion for now, as they probably have an uphill climb.

I readily acknowledge that just because guys started in the past, that doesn't mean that they should be penciled in to the starting lineup. New coaching staff, new systems, clean slate. But would anyone really be surprised if someone like Cruz, Jr. hangs onto a starting role? Or if Bradford doesn't surrender a starting spot easily? What if Wohlabaugh bounces back fully [kid began his career as a starter in the SEC]?

I also think that some will dismiss the returnees as "...not good enough," and pencil new faces into roles. But I'm guessing that the starting OL and positions on the two deep will be a mixture of incumbents and new guys.

I also think that our depth is going to be VERY solid at OL, even moreso than last year, with even better quality. And depth / competition is a good thing for performance. If I had to guess -- and I fully qualify this by acknowledging that we won't know until we have a better sense of what the new OL coach / OC are looking for, here's what I'd predict:

LT -- Washington -- 6-8 and massive
LG -- Bradford for now, he'll have to fight off Miller
C -- Reed -- better in his second year now that he's experienced and has better personnel around him?
RG -- Hornsby, an experienced transfer
RT -- Wohlabaugh, unless he's impaired -- if so, then Weatherspoon or Cruz

Second unit:

LT -- Cruz Jr.
LG -- Miller
C -- Ilaoa
RG -- Moeleo
RT -- Watherspoon

Third unit:
OT -- Petry
G / T -- Cruz
T / G -- Mack

That's just my opinion, of course, I could be wrong. But it is EXCITING to think that we'll field a competent, huge, powerful OL for the first time in... damn, 2012 -- then back to the late 90s?

And we have the depth / positional versatility to not have the entire unit sunk by a key injury or three.

I expect some FIERCE camp battles. And they'll have a good DL to square off against in practice to get ready, which is also good.
Expand...
Great write up. This is the deepest SU team Ive seen in decades
 
RF2044 said:
Thanks to everyone for their thoughtful write-ups. IMO, projecting lineups is going to be VERY difficult, because we don't have a good sense yet of the systems, and what the coaches may value in players manning certain positions. The spring game provided SOME evidence, but not enough to slot guys in with confidence.

Here's what I have to say about the OL. The staff went out and recruited an impressive group of transfers, several of whom come in with experience. Essentially, they went out and pulled in a potential full starting unit of guys.
  • Washington started at Colorado [LT]
  • Weatherspoon started at Howard at RT
  • Hornsby started at Grambling at OG
  • Miller redshirted at Georgia -- looks like an OG, but played LT in spring practice
Now, I wouldn't be surprised to see any of them / all four of them in the starting lineup. The coaching staff didn't bring those guys in to sit, and three of them are experienced starters. But is a guy like Weatherspoon too slow to play RT in the ACC? Not suggesting he is, just saying it's a question mark. Does his size help him win out and man RT adequately, or does he kick inside as a massive RG?

But it's important to note that while OL hasn't been a strength of the Syracuse Football Program [understatement], last year's group had better depth / talent than we usually have -- and we needed every bit of it to deal with the injuries that wracked up over the season. Without that depth, we would have been sunk. Which means that even with the players who portalled out, there is still a decent nucleus of returning players:
  • J'Onre Reed -- started every game at center
  • Enrique Cruz Jr. -- returning starter at LT, who has struggled a bit
  • Jakob Bradford -- returning starter at RG who was solid [not great]
  • Mark Petry -- emergency starter at RT who filled in due to injury, was at least decent
  • David Wohlabaugh Jr. -- initial starter at RT who missed almost entire season due to injury
That's five [5] guys who've started games here during their careers, and at minimum a full season of starting [except for Wohlabaugh, who got injured game 2].

Beyond them, we have four other guys who seem to be squarely in the mix, based upon spring practice:
  • Joe Cruz -- valuable reserve who's played quite a bit over his first 2 years, poised for bigger role?
  • Josh Ilaoa -- backup C/G
  • Lysander Moeleo -- injured last year, played a lot in the spring game, looks like he's in the mix
  • Trevion Mack -- high caliber athlete who could be poised for bigger role
I'm going to leave the incoming true frosh out of the discussion for now, as they probably have an uphill climb.

I readily acknowledge that just because guys started in the past, that doesn't mean that they should be penciled in to the starting lineup. New coaching staff, new systems, clean slate. But would anyone really be surprised if someone like Cruz, Jr. hangs onto a starting role? Or if Bradford doesn't surrender a starting spot easily? What if Wohlabaugh bounces back fully [kid began his career as a starter in the SEC]?

I also think that some will dismiss the returnees as "...not good enough," and pencil new faces into roles. But I'm guessing that the starting OL and positions on the two deep will be a mixture of incumbents and new guys.

I also think that our depth is going to be VERY solid at OL, even moreso than last year, with even better quality. And depth / competition is a good thing for performance. If I had to guess -- and I fully qualify this by acknowledging that we won't know until we have a better sense of what the new OL coach / OC are looking for, here's what I'd predict:

LT -- Washington -- 6-8 and massive
LG -- Bradford for now, he'll have to fight off Miller
C -- Reed -- better in his second year now that he's experienced and has better personnel around him?
RG -- Hornsby, an experienced transfer
RT -- Wohlabaugh, unless he's impaired -- if so, then Weatherspoon or Cruz

Second unit:

LT -- Cruz Jr.
LG -- Miller
C -- Ilaoa
RG -- Moeleo
RT -- Watherspoon

Third unit:
OT -- Petry
G / T -- Cruz
T / G -- Mack

That's just my opinion, of course, I could be wrong. But it is EXCITING to think that we'll field a competent, huge, powerful OL for the first time in... damn, 2012 -- then back to the late 90s?

And we have the depth / positional versatility to not have the entire unit sunk by a key injury or three.

I expect some FIERCE camp battles. And they'll have a good DL to square off against in practice to get ready, which is also good.
Expand...
Washington, Reed, Hornsby and Wohlabaugh are locks if they are all healthy.
 
kcsu said:
Washington, Reed, Hornsby and Wohlabaugh are locks if they are all healthy.
Expand...
Hornsby a lock based on his HBCU tape? you dont think Bradford or Petry could have played well for Grambling last year?
 
Cover1 said:
Hornsby a lock based on his HBCU tape? you dont think Bradford or Petry could have played well for Grambling last year?
Expand...
I think that Fran brought this kids in for a reason. I like Bradford and Petry but i like this kid better
 
Cover1 said:
Im sure he can hold his own vs HBCU lineman. Had some high blocking grades vs teams like Pitt and Wake
Expand...
Christopher Reeve Reaction GIF



;)
 
baggerbob said:
Like that you named James as KR, but hopefully we come up with situational plays on offense to get him on the field.
Can't teach speed, and at 5-11-200 he should be able to break some tackles.
Expand...
The speed is exceptional, but can he catch, can he block, can he make football moves, does he have enough experience to make correct football decisions all at a p4 level?
Maybe he will be ready this year, but it’s hard to know with true freshmen.
 
IthacaMatt said:
I just hope it's not too physical.
We had too many teams limp into the season with half of each line injured.
Expand...
The problem u run into is when u dont use contact enough, your body isnt used to it. Like boxing, if u dont get hit a bit, when u do its way worse than u expected. Gotta build up toit and as thebDetroit football coach says, its the only way to teach it right.
 
kcsu said:
Washington, Reed, Hornsby and Wohlabaugh are locks if they are all healthy.
Expand...
Someone earlier said Hornsbybis behind 8 ball as he didnt have spring camp and it will hurt him a bit i think
 
RF2044 said:
But it is EXCITING to think that we'll field a competent, huge, powerful OL for the first time in... damn, 2012 -- then back to the late 90s?
Expand...
I think people equate 90s success to every position group, but the OL we had for most of the coach P tenure was average at best. The QB play masked deficiencies. You have to go back to 1987-1992 to find above average line play. And outside of that maybe 2012 and 2018.
 
FrancoPizza said:
I think people equate 90s success to every position group, but the OL we had for most of the coach P tenure was average at best. The QB play masked deficiencies. You have to go back to 1987-1992 to find above average line play. And outside of that maybe 2012 and 2018.
Expand...

Agreed.

Which validates the point I was making -- it's been a long time [and good call on 2018, which I didn't include] since we've had a line that can even be considered average or slightly better. And prior to that, it was 2012. And prior to that, it was in the 90s timeframes.

Also agree that even back then, OL wasn't a historical position of strength -- it was generally adequate, and we had QBs who could make plays on the move which helped to mask the OL's limitations against most teams we faced [but not all].
 
shu 49 said:
The problem u run into is when u dont use contact enough, your body isnt used to it. Like boxing, if u dont get hit a bit, when u do its way worse than u expected. Gotta build up toit and as thebDetroit football coach says, its the only way to teach it right.
Expand...

I get it, but I don't want linemen diving at each others' knees, if you know what I mean.
There's physical in practice and drills, but then there's all out scrimmages where guys are trying to win starting jobs, and maybe go a little "too" full-on.
 
kcsu said:
Washington, Reed, Hornsby and Wohlabaugh are locks if they are all healthy.
Expand...
4 OL locks? In June? With the amount of roster, staff, and coaching technique turnover we've had, absolute statements like this probably don't mean much.
 
007 said:
4 OL locks? In June? With the amount of roster, staff, and coaching technique turnover we've had, absolute statements like this probably don't mean much.
Expand...
He's channeling igor... and I mean that as a complement.
 
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