Texas, Oklahoma reach out to the SEC

[Alsacs]

The talking points from the last realignment aren't going to be particularly useful in this round. Baylor has good football and great basketball right now. Stanford isn't going to be able to block them out because of the religion issues. West Virginia is absolutely not going to the American. ACC would be lucky to end up with them.

PAC-12 requires only 1 school to vote no and the process is shut down.
Stanford and Cal-Berkeley will not let Baylor in unless it came with a golden ticket like Texas.

Those schools won’t let BYU in when BYU would be a perfect fit for the PAC-12.

WVU knows they are in trouble.

 

[mscanlo]

I think it's been stated, but I don't really understand the value of re-alignments anymore. Yes, you create very deep conferences, but I have a tough time understanding there is more value in Oklahoma playing Ole Miss, Arkansas, Miss St, LSU (and Texas A&M) vs. their current lineup in the Big 12 which the fans are more familiar with.

TV networks are valuing it more, and thus throwing more money which is fueling the re-alignment, but I'm not sure the fans will actually value it more.

 

[Alsacs]

Based on what? They have no fanbase. They are only good at FB when they cheat. They do not have a commitment to FB. FSU would cover Florida, so they don't add much in markets. tehy have a dying FB brand. You are not being objective.

How is SU deadweight? We would add both cable and streaming subs for our gigantic BBall fanbase. We are still a name brand in FB. We wouldn't add much Tier 1/2 money, but when your conference is that big you cannot have every game on TV. We add the state of NY. Is that not worth anything? We are also strong academically. We make the B1G a lot more attractive for ND to join as well. We were previously on the B1G's expansion radar. The good FB schools woudl welcome a tomato can. You still need Ws. NFL style 10-6 playoff teams wouldn't cut it for most fanbases. They want 12-4 which can't happen with only strong programs.

If this is your take on, you better not write that book.

You are underselling Miami and overselling Syracuse.
I am a Syracuse fan and wish we were more valuable but cmon man.

Miami played more prime time games(3) last year on ABC than Syracuse has the previous 15 years(2)

Miami still gets attention.

 

[Toga]

How? The SEC is not taking Miami. The B1G could but if they have FSU they do not need Miami too. Who the F is taking Pitt? The SEC isn't. PA is already covered by PSU. Pitt has a small fanbase and mediocre sports. They really add no value at all. The B1G isn't taking Louisville. Why would the SEC take them? They already have UK. The basketball is good but isn't a must take brand.

Football needs losers. You think Michigan fans who expect 7 home games every year and 10+ wins will be happy with 6 home games and 8 win seasons? Because that is what happens with a super league of all good football teams. You would lose fans (tickets and subscriptions that way.

SU brings a new market, good academics, streaming subscriptions thanks to BBall, and a tomato can for FB. That is a great add.

and an iconic (renovated) venue. Now that's not a huge deal but it does add to the cachet.

 

[RandomGuy]

The information is out there and people don’t get realignment with some of these ideas.

We are basically on borrowed time.
If you aren’t going to go all-in for college football then it’s over.

The ACC can survive if the annual payouts are within the same atmosphere. If they are half of the SEC or Big Ten then it’s over.
Also most people ignore ESPN in this stuff. Htown was on the money earlier.
ESPN has played a major role in this behind the scenes.
They don’t like Fox getting into college football and getting a bunch of the highest rated games.
Here are the top 10 Highest rated games in the regular season

1. Nov. 7: Clemson vs. Notre Dame (NBC): 10.1 million
2. Dec. 19: Notre Dame vs. Clemson (ABC): 9.9 million
3. Oct. 17: Georgia vs. Alabama (CBS): 9.6 million
4. Dec. 19: Alabama vs. Florida (CBS): 8.9 million
5. Dec. 19: Ohio State vs. Northwestern (FOX): 8.0 million
6. Nov. 28: Alabama vs. Auburn (CBS): 6.7 million
7. Oct. 31: Ohio State vs. Penn State (ABC): 6.5 million
8. Nov. 7: Florida vs. Georgia (CBS): 6.3 million
9. Oct. 24: Nebraska vs. Ohio State (FOX): 6.2 million
10. Nov. 21: Indiana vs. Ohio State (FOX): 6.1 million

This explains why ESPN paid 300 million dollars a year for the SEC tier 1 rights.
Fox has the top Big Ten games now.
Fox gets a lot of Texas and Oklahoma games.

ESPN already cut out CBS in 2024 they want to get Oklahoma and Texas as well.
ESPN knows the Big Ten is going to stay with Fox unless they are overpay.
The ACC is under the ESPN umbrella already no need for them to spend more money when they own it.
ESPN owns the American for cheap money.


The PAC-12 is split between Fox and ESPN. I think the PAC-12 and Big Ten will do an alliance reading the tea leafs.

The ACC is in big time trouble.
I just don’t want Notre Dame at this point I see where the end game is and just those jackwagons to be forced into a conference.

^^^^^ THIS

In terms of viewers
UNC/MIA had 3.3M
CLEMSOM/VT. 3.38M
CUSE/ND. 2.84M
ND/UNC 6.08M
CLEMSON/PITT 3.0M
CUSE/Lville 1.03M
ND/BC 5.14M
MIA/VT 1.96M
CLEM/BC 4.38M
ND/GT 3.77M
ND/PITT 2.49M
NCSTATE/UNC 1.0M
ND/LVILLE 3.12M
CLEMSON/GT 2.25M
UNC/FSU 2.2M
CLEMSON/MIA 4.61M
ND/FSU 2.92M
VT/UNC 1.96M
LVille/GT 1.02M
UNC/BC 1.98M
FSU/MIA 2.95M
MIA/LVILLE 3.8M
ND/Duke 4.32M
FSU/Gt 3.52M
CLEMSON/Wake 3.46M

Without Clemson/ND.
Over 3 million
UNC/Mia
MIA/Lville
FSU/GT
Mia/FSU(almost 3M)

About 2M
UNC/BC
UNC/VT
UNC/FSU
MIa/VT

UNC,MIA,FSU, and to a lesser extent VT bring value.

College Football TV Ratings

College football TV ratings for the 2023 regular season, bowls, College Football Playoff and National Championship.

www.sportsmediawatch.com

 

[SU94]

Gambling will get the TV ratings for football.

I don’t get what you are saying the ratings will still be there nationally.

Yes, the ratings will be gangbusters in Texas, the Southeast and the Upper Midwest. And those regions (excluding the Upper Midwest) are only growing. That's all very healthy.

However, the same ratings will slump in the vital regions I mentioned (CA, NY, NE, Mountain) because they won't have a dog in the fight. Some people from those area will watch (gamblers, sports fans, displaced alums), but CFB would be BEST served if these areas were cultivated and did have investment (aka schools/teams) in the sport.

To sum up my point: An American sport that is supported by television ratings cannot thrive to its maximum capacity by ignoring almost 1/3 of its customer base. That's just not good business.

 

[DoctorBombay]

My twitter feed is full of WVU fans wanting to join the ACC.

Let em rot. In terms of value they bring little to the table. Small population and a notoriously delusional azz hole fanbase, that reveled in the ACC’s possible demise years ago. If the shoe was on the other foot, WVU wouldn’t think twice about stomping out the ACC. I believe the imminent doom and gloom forecasts by some, are a little over the top. I don’t see the ACC’s position as precarious…at least not yet. Adding WVU would be a lateral move at best. The conference can do better. JMHO

 

[HRE Otto IV]

You are underselling Miami and overselling Syracuse.
I am a Syracuse fan and wish we were more valuable but cmon man.

Miami played more prime time games(3) last year on ABC than Syracuse has the previous 15 years(2)

Miami still gets attention.

The Miami FB brand isn't worth it. First off the SEC will never take them. So only the B1G would. The B1G would take UNC, UVA, Duke, GA Tech, FSU, Clemson all before Miami. If they are at 20 teams they are not taking 21. So if you take Miami who else are you adding?

If the B1G is sitting at 20 their next target would be ND. Adding SU and BC goes a long way to getting ND. Which puts us ahead of Miami.

 

[Alsacs]

The Miami FB brand isn't worth it. First off the SEC will never take them. So only the B1G would. The B1G would take UNC, UVA, Duke, GA Tech, FSU, Clemson all before Miami. If they are at 20 teams they are not taking 21. So if you take Miami who else are you adding?

If the B1G is sitting at 20 their next target would be ND. Adding SU and BC goes a long way to getting ND. Which puts us ahead of Miami.

ND doesn’t give a chit about SU.
SU fans have to realize that.
BC is a like a little annoying brother to ND.
ND doesn’t care about them.

All ND cares about is ND and they honor Navy because Navy bailed out them during WW2 and they like playing USC.

Miami football brand still has a little juice.

 

[Atlcuse44]

Not only are we ditch diggers in FB we are a good brand. That is hard to find. Most are crappy brands.

So we are amongst the elite ditch diggers.

 

[Cusefan69]

So it will be interesting to see what ESPN does in this situation with the SEC, The Big XII and the ACC. ESPN stops paying for the Texas network when they join the SEC. Presumably they reduce the Big XII dollars significantly once Tx and OK are gone. Probably well below ACC. So does SEC get a bump? Does the ACC convince ESPN to get them a bump? If so. how does the new commish sell it?

 

[Toga]

So we are amongst the elite ditch diggers.

Which is nice.

 

[Toga]

So it will be interesting to see what ESPN does in this situation with the SEC, The Big XII and the ACC. ESPN stops paying for the Texas network when they join the SEC. Presumably they reduce the Big XII dollars significantly once Tx and OK are gone. Probably well below ACC. So does SEC get a bump? Does the ACC convince ESPN to get them a bump? If so. how does the new commish sell it?

One sure hopes the ACC is extensively drawing on the expertise of a certain AD.

 

[chugg21]

You are underselling Miami and overselling Syracuse.
I am a Syracuse fan and wish we were more valuable but cmon man.

Miami played more prime time games(3) last year on ABC than Syracuse has the previous 15 years(2)

Miami still gets attention.

Putting Syracuse anywhere near Miami in terms of football value is delusional. They are multiple tiers ahead of us in every aspect.

 

[Killdozer]

Miami is way more valuable than Syracuse. I wish we were.

You are doing the sales job I get it.
We aren’t likely to be saved if people are objective.
The Big Ten isn’t going to add dead weight.
They and the SEC will add value.

Syracuse hoops fanbase is strong but again we overrate how good our basketball brand is.
ESPN isn’t putting Syracuse home games on the main network all the time. It’s when we play the other good teams for the most part.
I can see the endgame and if people want the truth we are probably more likely than not going to be screwed.

Wow, you have a lot of negativity about SU in general. My suggestion is to oil up your racks and get ready for leaf season. You don't seem like an SU fan so why even bother with this awesome SU sports forum.

 

[baggerbob]

Here is the good news. The current payouts matter but need to be taken in consideration with length of the current GOR agreements. The ACC has time. The ACC needs to get aggressive. The media companies understand that parity is a good thing. ESPN CBS NBC FOX Amazon Netflix etc... are not going to allow one or two groups to dominate. It takes away their leverage.
SU will end up with a chair. I believe the ACC will either be the 2nd or 3rd strongest conference.
Geographic proximity doesn't matter anymore.
I can see an alliance between the Big, the pac, ND or anyone of some very strong 5 schools. Houston Central Florida are 2 that stick out.
Again, if the ACC becomes aggressive while it's GOR is in place it can win. We need to go on offense and force the action vs reacting to it

Back when Texas, Oklahoma, Texas Tech, and Oklahoma St were talking to the Pac 10, the ACC should have added them. The Oklahoma St Billionaire would have kicked in money. But we didn't have a Commissioner who was proactive. Now it's too late.

 

[Alsacs]

Wow, you have a lot of negativity about SU in general. My suggestion is to oil up your racks and get ready for leaf season. You don't seem like an SU fan so why even bother with this awesome SU sports forum.

This is exactly what I am talking about.
Sorry you don’t understand the discussion.
I have been a season ticket holder for football for over 15 years since I graduated.
Sorry you don’t like what I say. You clearly only want to hear what you like.

Thanks for telling me to stop supporting my alma mater because I realize how vulnerable we are.

 

[chugg21]

I think it's been stated, but I don't really understand the value of re-alignments anymore. Yes, you create very deep conferences, but I have a tough time understanding there is more value in Oklahoma playing Ole Miss, Arkansas, Miss St, LSU (and Texas A&M) vs. their current lineup in the Big 12 which the fans are more familiar with.

TV networks are valuing it more, and thus throwing more money which is fueling the re-alignment, but I'm not sure the fans will actually value it more.

It's strictly about the cash. Making the move probably nets an extra $20m a year into the AD budget which will allow them to keep up in the arms race.

 

[ForCuseSake]

Which is nice.

Gunga la gunga!

 

[BomberOrange]

ND doesn’t give a chit about SU.
SU fans have to realize that.
BC is a like a little annoying brother to ND.
ND doesn’t care about them.

All ND cares about is ND and they honor Navy because Navy bailed out them during WW2 and they like playing USC.

Miami football brand still has a little juice.

While I agree that Miami has a little juice, its is hanging on by a thread, and its because every year the "experts" are ready to say that the 'Canes are on their way back to the glory years. Yet every year they disappoint. They're still a name and still a draw but unless they start winning conference championships, they will fade as well. It reminds me of how the Cowboys are Super Bowl "contenders" every year, yet still finish 8-8.
That said, we are not on par with the Canes at all in football and that drives the bus.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

ND doesn’t give a chit about SU.
SU fans have to realize that.
BC is a like a little annoying brother to ND.
ND doesn’t care about them.

All ND cares about is ND and they honor Navy because Navy bailed out them during WW2 and they like playing USC.

Miami football brand still has a little juice.

You are missing the point. ND left the Big East because of SU, Pitt, and BC. ND doesn't give a crap about SU. They do give a crap about making a 12 game Indy schedule. If the B1G takes BC and SU, who the hell is ND going to play? Taking SU and BC forces ND's hand.

 

[Alsacs]

It’s official now.

 

[supp]

Where's omnicarrier? He always had smart takes on realignment.

 

[Alsacs]

You are missing the point. ND left the Big East because of SU, Pitt, and BC. ND doesn't give a crap about SU. They do give a crap about making a 12 game Indy schedule. If the B1G takes BC and SU, who the hell is ND going to play? Taking SU and BC forces ND's hand.

ND will play
Navy
USC
Stanford
BYU

Then find 8 games they can do it. Even without the ACC and Big Ten.
ND doesn’t need SU and BC.

Notre Dame left the Big East because they wanted their Olympic sports to have a better home.
ND negotiatied with the Big XII and ACC and made a deal with the ACC because it helped their Olympic sports and they liked playing 5 games in the ACC region.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Putting Syracuse anywhere near Miami in terms of football value is delusional. They are multiple tiers ahead of us in every aspect.

Miami based on just football alone has more value. Based on the end game they have less. If the B1G destroyed the ACC and P12, then they would have enough power to pick off the AAU SEC schools. Florida would come into play. Taking Miami before wouldn't be wise.