Thank You Adam Weitsman

[MikeSU02]

One wonders if players getting big NIL $ will now be paying taxes when they may not have when they were getting bags that were out of view. Players probably dependents on their parents' taxes.

Yeah, I think that's a totally fair question. I mean, it's going to take a bit before it settles and it's easy to navigate.

Right now it's the wild west and trying to stake your claim/get your money.

 

[pwong]

It's problematic. Top 75 kids assures nothing. Torean Thompson was a Top 75 guy, so was Kaleb Joseph, so was Jalen Carey, just to name a few of late in this category who didn't even come close to being productive and panning out. All of whom transferred.

Donors will primarily do so because of interest and the love for the program, school, etc. first and foremost, not because of the individual. And, most will want to see it paying dividends on the court, field, etc. Coaches soon will likely/potentially also be dealing with complaints, etc. from donors, especially the higher $$$ ones, as "their guy" cries to them about lack of playing time, etc., unhappiness, etc. and bolting to the portal in a heartbeat.

Coaches will have to deal with these additional external pressures, scrutiny, etc. and all the potential ramifications that may come with it versus simply playing guys the minutes HE sees fit (strictly from a coach perspective) on HIS team that is most deserving.

It's a cluster.

Think of it this way, do you think kids that were top 75 were looking for benefits before, at least some of them? For sure.

Absolutely, top 75 kids will be asking for NIL, especially because it's legal now and there will be legit people working to make money off those deals.

There won't be a cutoff. It's going to be pretty crazy and messy. There will be people asking for NIL deals that shouldn't even remotely be humored with them.

As someone else noted, non revenue sports might be in real trouble.

But it’s not like you pay the bottom end kids as much as you pay the top 50 kids. Lets say you get a top 50 kid for $250k, you shouldn’t be paying a top 75 kid that much.

Most top 50 kids are rotation players off the bench on good basketball teams, most top 75 kids you hope pan out in year 2 or year 3. If they transfer, then you don’t have to give them NIL anymore.

You only give NIL to revenue making sports. It’s the same as funding from the athletic department, non revenue making sports get no money either. I know SU’s vball facilities are bottom tier.

 

[orangecuse]

One wonders if players getting big NIL $ will now be paying taxes when they may not have when they were getting bags that were out of view. Players probably dependents on their parents' taxes.

Ha, of course they will. No different than many of us likely being able to relate to the time when we were young and perhaps paid "under the table" to when we no longer were. It's simply income and it will be taxed at the ordinary income level once the pertinent threshold (per tax year) is reached.

 

[Fly Rodder]

It is very alarming and almost all schools are looking for guidance from the government. Without some sort of rules what is most likely to happen is that many programs will be cut. For instance, one 500k NIL player makes more than the entire annual budget for one of the non rev programs. Lots of kids are going to suffer. It's a mess.

Wait till you find out what the President of the NCAA makes. Colleges didn't give two spits about salaries for piles and piles of administrators and vice presidents and directors and asst directors to the vice president or dean when the was money rolling in. The free cash party is over.

The governing body paid Emmert a total of $2.99 million in 2020, according to new tax filings provided to Front Office Sports. That’s up 3% from the previous year.

• The widely criticized Emmert will step down by the end of June 2023.
• The NCAA paid almost $52.5 million in legal fees, less than the $68 million it reported in 2019-20.
• Of course, $52.5 million is still a hefty price tag in the year that it lost the Supreme Court case NCAA v. Alston 9-0. The opinion found the NCAA is subject to antitrust scrutiny.

The NCAA spent $470,000 in lobbying as its interim NIL policy went into effect without a federal NIL law — something officials hoped to pass. The number is, however, about $30,000 less than the previous year.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Livvy Dunne is like the prime showcase of it. I can't imagine what she's raking in already. In fact, her just being in her teammates' videos is probably making *them* serious money.

Cavender sisters at U of M basketball, too.

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Miami's Cavinder twins are taking college basketball by storm

Haley and Hanna Cavinder, two twin sisters who play for the Miami Hurricanes, are taking the college basketball scene by storm.

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[MikeSU02]

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Miami's Cavinder twins are taking college basketball by storm

Haley and Hanna Cavinder, two twin sisters who play for the Miami Hurricanes, are taking the college basketball scene by storm.

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Yeah, they are killing it.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

For instance, one 500k NIL player makes more than the entire annual budget for one of the non rev programs. Lots of kids are going to suffer. It's a mess.

I don’t understand that take. The money doesn’t come out of the schools budget. The boosters were already throwing big bucks at kids. IMO, donations won’t go down. At SU, attendance might go up.

 

[MikeSU02]

But it’s not like you pay the bottom end kids as much as you pay the top 50 kids. Lets say you get a top 50 kid for $250k, you shouldn’t be paying a top 75 kid that much.

Most top 50 kids are rotation players off the bench on good basketball teams, most top 75 kids you hope pan out in year 2 or year 3. If they transfer, then you don’t have to give them NIL anymore.

You only give NIL to revenue making sports. It’s the same as funding from the athletic department, non revenue making sports get no money either. I know SU’s vball facilities are bottom tier.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but remember, us versus a Kentucky versus a Richmond aren't looking at a kid like Elijah Moore (just as an example), the same way.

So Elijah has a ranking (let's say he ends up 55th in the class).

What team out of those three are coveting him the most? It's not Kentucky. And he may be too much of a reach for Richmond. But he's in *our* wheelhouse.

So now, it's not just a blanket "what do you pay the 55th ranked kid" as an NCAA team, it's what are the Syracuse's of the world paying for that NIL deal, right? Meaning, Elijah Moore is of different value to different teams.

It's why kids that go mid major were still asking for money before this was all legal. That kid may be worth $0 to us, but to a mid major, he is worth $50k. So maybe Elijah doesn't get the same money as a DJ Wagner, but Elijah can also leverage that Syracuse *needs* talent, Elijah has connections to other talented kids we may be involved with.

Now, I'm just using Elijah and hypotheticals as an example. But the point is, these top 75 kids will get paid as much as they can leverage to get paid. And it's not like we're negotiating with the kid or his parents. We're negotiating with another party. Who likely has a background in this.

 

[pwong]

I don’t understand that take. The money doesn’t come out of the schools budget. The boosters were already throwing big bucks at kids. IMO, donations won’t go down. At SU, attendance might go up.

It’s also an open market, like the job market. People don’t complain that a stock broker makes significantly more money than like a janitor. Or like how people don’t complain that the men’s basketball facilities are much better than like cross country or volleyball.

 

[phil77]

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Miami's Cavinder twins are taking college basketball by storm

Haley and Hanna Cavinder, two twin sisters who play for the Miami Hurricanes, are taking the college basketball scene by storm.

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I don't even know who these kids are is that bad?

 

[phil77]

I'm not disagreeing with you, but remember, us versus a Kentucky versus a Richmond aren't looking at a kid like Elijah Moore (just as an example), the same way.

So Elijah has a ranking (let's say he ends up 55th in the class).

What team out of those three are coveting him the most? It's not Kentucky. And he may be too much of a reach for Richmond. But he's in *our* wheelhouse.

So now, it's not just a blanket "what do you pay the 55th ranked kid" as an NCAA team, it's what are the Syracuse's of the world paying for that NIL deal, right? Meaning, Elijah Moore is of different value to different teams.

It's why kids that go mid major were still asking for money before this was all legal. That kid may be worth $0 to us, but to a mid major, he is worth $50k. So maybe Elijah doesn't get the same money as a DJ Wagner, but Elijah can also leverage that Syracuse *needs* talent, Elijah has connections to other talented kids we may be involved with.

Now, I'm just using Elijah and hypotheticals as an example. But the point is, these top 75 kids will get paid as much as they can leverage to get paid. And it's not like we're negotiating with the kid or his parents. We're negotiating with another party. Who likely has a background in this.

If they are starting to pay kids based on rankings then whose rankings are we using? Seen some kids ranked 50-75 range on one system and not ranked in another. Then are we going to start getting parents paying the people who do the rankings under the table to get kids higher in the rankings than they should be? I mean paying a guy 10k under the table to rank the kid in the top 50 so they can get a 150k deal wouldn't be out of the question now right? What if a kids busts out like Benny do we get a refund? lol

 

[MikeSU02]

I don't even know who these kids are is that bad?

Not at all. I have kids that have tried Tik Tok and other social media, so I'm on any platform they are on for visibility and to learn about it. But if you're on Tik Tok, you'll eventually run into Livvy Dunne and the Cavinder sisters.

 

[Nicknack]

One of the things I wonder about is how are people who are offering NILs making sure to be moving in the best interest of the program? Can the Adams of the world talk with the coach about their priorities? That would be insane to think they don't. You know there is so much shady stuff happening - anytime there is this much money involved people get greedy and look for ways to cut corners.

 

[OCESIP]

But it’s not like you pay the bottom end kids as much as you pay the top 50 kids. Lets say you get a top 50 kid for $250k, you shouldn’t be paying a top 75 kid that much.

Most top 50 kids are rotation players off the bench on good basketball teams, most top 75 kids you hope pan out in year 2 or year 3. If they transfer, then you don’t have to give them NIL anymore.

You only give NIL to revenue making sports. It’s the same as funding from the athletic department, non revenue making sports get no money either. I know SU’s vball facilities are bottom tier.

How NIL $$ in general are actually determined and dispensed on an individual basis would be interesting information for the uninitiated to know. Wouldn't need to know specific names, just how the process works.

I believe in the case of AW we were told in another thread that JB identifies players of interest and that information is passed on to Adam by a third party. It would be interesting to know if there's a relative value placed on those recruits by JB, or if that's solely the prerogative of AW. Rankings per sea probably aren't as important as JB's perspective on the relative need of each recruit. He always minimized rankings and preferred his own judgement in the past.

 

[Nicknack]

I believe in the case of AW we were told in another thread that JB identifies players of interest and that information is passed on to Adam by a third party. It would be interesting to know if there's a relative value placed on those recruits by JB, or if that's solely the prerogative of AW. Rankings per sea probably aren't as important as JB's perspective on the relative need of each recruit. He always minimized rankings and preferred his own judgement in the past.

However they're doing it, you've got to know that there must be a LOT of communication going on (whether that's through a third party or not). There are so many moving parts with recruiting so for the NIL deals to be effective, they've got to be in lockstep with the coach.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I love this post to the moon and back. I hear ya about NIL. Adam has even said that he isn't a huge fan of NIL. But it's the world we live in, and Adam is spending tons of time and money to help SU sports thrive. I know he's a wealthy guy and made mistakes in his past, but this dude is so genuine about doing good in CNY. He wants to mentor his NIL signees, and they're not marketing his businesses - they'll be doing charitable and civic things in the community. I love that.

I loved that quote about mentoring these NIL kids for their careers, to help them build better lives. His group with Jeff Knauss and that motivational author, "Profound", is a great platform. Adam's PR is spot on (thanks to Jeff ...).

I've met Jeff on a couple occasions, and he is a very bright guy, with a big heart. He was into crypto and spoke about it at one event I attended as an investment opportunity to an urban entrepreneur audience as we're still mid-pandemic. This was maybe 18 months ago.

Struck me at the time that there were more substantive things he could have talked to this audience of new business owners about that might have been of more practical value to them. He knows a lot about business, but he didn't read this audience right, IMO.

So, he's not "all seeing / all knowing" as some make him out to be in this town. But he's a solid dude who also does a lot of good in Upstate NY.

 

[IthacaMatt]

You guys are nutty.

Since he's been around the program, what exactly has occurred that is "successful"? You guys sautee Boeheim and this is Jim's guy but this program will succeed or fail based on the coaching and the direction of the athletic director.

To be so effusive of a guy who is a booster is weird/SEC type stuff IMO. I appreciate him being so generous with his tickets courtside and having celebrities show up with him, but i haven't seen a huge uptick in SU Hoops.

Coaching will dictate our success ultimately. Any player who wants a bounty NIL wise is a 1 and done and to me those are wildcards

You're kind of missing the point that he isn't just a quiet booster of the program who is content to be in the background and have a building or a gym named after him one day.

He is helping us enormously with our branding as a program, trying to keep us cool and relevant to the young recruits. With the talk about our coaches not going out on the road much in recent years, he has become our own World Wide Wes.

He's getting good input on who are the right people to invite court side to boost our brand. He's helping us a lot more than you realize.

 

[IthacaMatt]

“How does the CNY-based owner of a scrap metal recycling/processing business become friends with rappers and actors and Logan and/or Jake Paul and Dan Bilzerian?” is a question I keep running over and over in my head.

By flying them places to big events, covering their tickets and entertainment. It's an investment.

 

[Cuse181]

By us, you mean Adam. SU has no funding obligations at all.
People on head root for the Red Sox and Yankees, but want SU to not jump into the deep end of spending (and it’s not SU’s money.)

I actually think “us” means all of us as fans. The “collective us” if you will. We (whether it be through the Syracusefan collective or others) all play a role in where that money goes even if some play smaller roles than other.

 

[Cuse181]

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Miami's Cavinder twins are taking college basketball by storm

Haley and Hanna Cavinder, two twin sisters who play for the Miami Hurricanes, are taking the college basketball scene by storm.

amp.marca.com

Interesting.. what do all three of those girls have in common… I wonder if other girls without their “gift” will receive anything close to what they’re raking in.

Just saying… you think SU could be bad with player disparity in pay, imagine their teams.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Definitely more than top 75 kids getting paid. I know a neighboring high school from where I grew up that paid for a player to come from NYC to upstate in 2002 so they could win our league and sectionals.

 

[cuseallday]

For those who like this sort of stuff, just got confirmation from Adam W. about his guests tonight.

 

[tbonezone]

there will be lawsuits when some team members get paid and others don't. some sports get paid and others don't. it will get messy. NIL is BS and the ruination of a once great tradition. this will create more problems than it seeks to cure for a privevledged few.

 

[Jake]

Does Adam know this is Giants / Bills country? Hurts is as likely to get booed than cheered.

 

[Cuse181]

there will be lawsuits when some team members get paid and others don't. some sports get paid and others don't. it will get messy. NIL is BS and the ruination of a once great tradition. this will create more problems than it seeks to cure for a privevledged few.

I don’t think there will be law suits as there’s no reason for them, the contracts that are drawn up shouldn’t have any performance related metrics for pay out. What are you going to sue on? Your feelings? Sounds like a great way to run through a bunch of money and get slapped with a fine for bringing a frivolous lawsuit.

College sports was never a “great tradition” it was exploitative and only held any semblance of respect because a college education used to be a massive benefit versus the bare minimum requirement it is today. Imagine offering something corporations are willing to pay billions for and not seeing a single penny. Tuition would be considered a benefit if non-revenue generating individuals weren’t getting the same benefit (top level academic students and non-rev generating sports).