the crane the crane

[bnoro]

When does the new roof go on? I guess they decided it was easier to do the other renovations first.

The cables all being laid is a great sign of progress. Everything will move pretty quickly once those are up.

 

[Cusefan78]

Cool vid, just wish it gave one continuous shot though, didn't need the cuts. Easier to spot things without pausing a million times.

The cuts make the video flow and Keeps your attention. Drone footage is pretty boring by itself.

 

[sutomcat]

The cables all being laid is a great sign of progress. Everything will move pretty quickly once those are up.

This is an interesting point. Are you assuming this or does this come from inside info?

If you compare the drawing of the new roof on the Geiger site, which I think is the best thing we have to work with to date, you can see that it appears they are attempting to stage the cable structure the new roof will have on the floor of the dome.

JMA Dome (formerly Carrier Dome) at Syracuse University | Geiger Engineers

The first and still the only covered stadium in New York State - is a 50,000-seat multipurpose domed stadium. Since its opening in 1980 it has served not only the university’s athletics department but also the campus and the greater Syracuse community through hosting a myriad of events. The...

www.geigerengineers.com

There are a couple of possible problems with this though.

On the drawing, it looks like the cables that will be used over most of roof above the dome floor are not going to be flat, 'normal' cables, but ones that are fixed in a series of arcs. I don't see normal cables below them. It looks like the arcs are what they are mostly going to use above the dome floor.

I have already heard from a reliable source that the drawing is not correct, so maybe this was changed, but that seems unlikely to me.

Also, if you look at the Geiger drawing carefully...it appears there are two cables, that appear to be completely arc based, that run at 45 degree angles to all the rest of the cables. All the cables are at a diagonal except these two, which I think run north-south and east-west. The drawing appears to have been done by hand and not done very well but if you believe the drawing, there is more to do.

I think they at minimum need to add a north-south and an east-west cable.

It will be interesting to see how the arc effect is achieved. Maybe they will use normal cables and have a bunch of steel arc sleeves that they will thread through them to get the needed shape? I can't imagine they are precasting lengths of arc steel 90 feet long and transporting them from Montreal, or Italy or who knows where. They are probably modular and bolt together, no?

Regardless, based on these pictures, I think that approach Pfeifer used at Olympic Stadium in Montreal to raise all the main cables at the same time is looking very likely to be used here too. Even though the structure of the cable network being raised is completely different.

NJCuse97, insiders, anyone else have thoughts on this?

 

[sutomcat]

My wife and I were both in grad school at the time. She was the same way. Lol.

I was a student then. I somehow got one of those orange construction helmets everyone on the crew was wearing and on days when I wanted to check out progress, I just brought it and walked right in. It was scary but cool. Never brought a camera. These pictures bring back memories...

 

[AZOrange]

Cool vid, just wish it gave one continuous shot though, didn't need the cuts. Easier to spot things without pausing a million times.

I thought there was concern about having the interior concrete exposed for a long period?

 

[AZOrange]

This is an interesting point. Are you assuming this or does this come from inside info?

If you compare the drawing of the new roof on the Geiger site, which I think is the best thing we have to work with to date, you can see that it appears they are attempting to stage the cable structure the new roof will have on the floor of the dome.

JMA Dome (formerly Carrier Dome) at Syracuse University | Geiger Engineers

The first and still the only covered stadium in New York State - is a 50,000-seat multipurpose domed stadium. Since its opening in 1980 it has served not only the university’s athletics department but also the campus and the greater Syracuse community through hosting a myriad of events. The...

www.geigerengineers.com

View attachment 181409

There are a couple of possible problems with this though.

On the drawing, it looks like the cables that will be used over most of roof above the dome floor are not going to be flat, 'normal' cables, but ones that are fixed in a series of arcs. I don't see normal cables below them. It looks like the arcs are what they are mostly going to use above the dome floor.

I have already heard from a reliable source that the drawing is not correct, so maybe this was changed, but that seems unlikely to me.

Also, if you look at the Geiger drawing carefully...it appears there are two cables, that appear to be completely arc based, that run at 45 degree angles to all the rest of the cables. All the cables are at a diagonal except these two, which I think run north-south and east-west. The drawing appears to have been done by hand and not done very well but if you believe the drawing, there is more to do.

I think they at minimum need to add a north-south and an east-west cable.

It will be interesting to see how the arc effect is achieved. Maybe they will use normal cables and have a bunch of steel arc sleeves that they will thread through them to get the needed shape? I can't imagine they are precasting lengths of arc steel 90 feet long and transporting them from Montreal, or Italy or who knows where. They are probably modular and bolt together, no?

Regardless, based on these pictures, I think that approach Pfeifer used at Olympic Stadium in Montreal to raise all the main cables at the same time is looking very likely to be used here too. Even though the structure of the cable network being raised is completely different.

NJCuse97, insiders, anyone else have thoughts on this?

Hmmm interesting...I always thought the tension came from cables attached to the ring pulling the roof up?

 

[upperdeck]

Well since the school wont provide us a camera.. Doesnt anyone on the board have a fancy drone they can just leave in hover position for maybe a week or 2 once real stuff starts again and just hover over the 50.. Might need to strap on an extended battery though.

 

[sutomcat]

Hmmm interesting...I always thought the tension came from cables attached to the ring pulling the roof up?

The crown truss will hold the roof up.

I am referring here to a specific video I believe CuseLegacy posted on how Pfeifer, who is involved with this project, started the process of building the roof at Olympic Stadium in London.

It is a much different design (the roof at Olympic is circular and even a full roof), but if they are staging cables on the floor in a similar fashion, it would seem likely will are going to bring them all up at the same time, using a similar process.

This is probably the biggest mystery in the whole phase 1 process. We are all wondering how the raising of the roof will get done. Will it be piece meal? Will all the cables come up at once? Only a subset?


As an aside, it looks like they are detaching the cables for the back stay over Gate B, the one the camera on Lawrinson points at directly. The west wall is now clean of back stays. The south just has the Gate B one and the one it is attached to left. I can see at least one on the southeast diagonal wall. There are a few more on the north wall and the diagonals it attaches to and we are done. Well over half way complete with the back stay removals now.

 

[bnoro]

The cuts make the video flow and Keeps your attention. Drone footage is pretty boring by itself.

Something like this had no problem keeping my attention:

 

[bnoro]

This is an interesting point. Are you assuming this or does this come from inside info?

If you compare the drawing of the new roof on the Geiger site, which I think is the best thing we have to work with to date, you can see that it appears they are attempting to stage the cable structure the new roof will have on the floor of the dome.

JMA Dome (formerly Carrier Dome) at Syracuse University | Geiger Engineers

The first and still the only covered stadium in New York State - is a 50,000-seat multipurpose domed stadium. Since its opening in 1980 it has served not only the university’s athletics department but also the campus and the greater Syracuse community through hosting a myriad of events. The...

www.geigerengineers.com

View attachment 181409

There are a couple of possible problems with this though.

On the drawing, it looks like the cables that will be used over most of roof above the dome floor are not going to be flat, 'normal' cables, but ones that are fixed in a series of arcs. I don't see normal cables below them. It looks like the arcs are what they are mostly going to use above the dome floor.

I have already heard from a reliable source that the drawing is not correct, so maybe this was changed, but that seems unlikely to me.

Also, if you look at the Geiger drawing carefully...it appears there are two cables, that appear to be completely arc based, that run at 45 degree angles to all the rest of the cables. All the cables are at a diagonal except these two, which I think run north-south and east-west. The drawing appears to have been done by hand and not done very well but if you believe the drawing, there is more to do.

I think they at minimum need to add a north-south and an east-west cable.

It will be interesting to see how the arc effect is achieved. Maybe they will use normal cables and have a bunch of steel arc sleeves that they will thread through them to get the needed shape? I can't imagine they are precasting lengths of arc steel 90 feet long and transporting them from Montreal, or Italy or who knows where. They are probably modular and bolt together, no?

Regardless, based on these pictures, I think that approach Pfeifer used at Olympic Stadium in Montreal to raise all the main cables at the same time is looking very likely to be used here too. Even though the structure of the cable network being raised is completely different.

NJCuse97, insiders, anyone else have thoughts on this?

All the cables will definitely be lifted at the same time, to make sure there's not unnecessary tension on certain points of the crown truss.

I'd expect hydraulics to be connected to the laid out cables that connect to the truss, and they will be raised slowly to their final position, and once the cables are connected to the truss, the roof will be constructed.

No inside info but just from what I've seen before. I've followed enough construction builds over at SkyscraperCity that I feel like it makes the most sense.

 

[hoopsupstate]

My thoughts are that some of the cables will be attached in the same locations as the old ones. There will be additional cables that connect these cables to the crown truss. This allows the truss to give additional height to the roof and relieve stress from the perimeter ring.

 

[Cusefan78]

Something like this had no problem keeping my attention:

That video is brutal. But I get what you’re saying. You’re just looking for a drone shot to show off the features and fly around slowly. Most people wouldn’t get through that video though, I lasted 20 seconds

 

[orangecuse]

I thought there was concern about having the interior concrete exposed for a long period?

Interior concrete isn't a thing, concrete is concrete.

Now, the longer that concrete is exposed to sunlight, the better IMO as the sun may "bleach out" some of the flooring, step stains, etc. from the years of traffic use, etc., especially if they are not going to pretty it up any by pressure washing it, concrete stain, etc.

 

[upperdeck]

no sure thats true

based on this there is a difference in concrete

 

[Cusefan78]

no sure thats true

based on this there is a difference in concrete

The only differences is finish, psi, and what they are using to strengthen It, ie fibers.

 

[orangecuse]

The only differences is finish, psi, and what they are using to strengthen It, ie fibers.

Yeah. The components that make up concrete are the same; it's made up of three basic components: water, aggregate (rock, sand, or gravel) and Portland cement. I imagine the Dome's poured concrete walls, flooring, etc. were all done with the obvious given exposure to the elements taken into effect, as it otherwise would've been quite an improbable task to attain. It wasn't as if they tarped off, covered, etc. the interior sides of it for the duration it sat curing, etc, along with the extended time frame prior to the initial Dome roof getting installed.

 

[SWC75]

It must be cool to know stuff.

 

[sutomcat]

My thoughts are that some of the cables will be attached in the same locations as the old ones. There will be additional cables that connect these cables to the crown truss. This allows the truss to give additional height to the roof and relieve stress from the perimeter ring.

It looks to me as though all of the cables they are laying out will connect to columns like the old cables did. It looks to me as though they are recreating the same basic cross hatch cable setup they had with the old roof, with the exception that the perimeter part of the new roof will be hard shell and for roof 2, the structural cables will be held in place this time by cables tying them to the crown truss (instead of being held up by air).

 

[NJCuse97]

Yeah. The components that make up concrete are the same; it's made up of three basic components: water, aggregate (rock, sand, or gravel) and Portland cement. I imagine the Dome's poured concrete walls, flooring, etc. were all done with the obvious given exposure to the elements taken into effect, as it otherwise would've been quite an improbable task to attain. It wasn't as if they tarped off, covered, etc. the interior sides of it for the duration it sat curing, etc, along with the extended time frame prior to the initial Dome roof getting installed.

They did. It was precast
That said, concrete is porous and as such it is not great in weather without a sealer. I doubt they used a sealer on the dome interior precast, but perhaps the exterior. Water infiltration can be a huge problem in concrete, especially reinforced concrete (this is why the garage at the MONY buildings collapsed in 1993. My structures professor was a professional/forensic witness). The walls of the Dome are tilted up double "T"s and that is a well known precast shape for bridge roadways and building floor slabs. The Dome used them in a unique way (vertical instead of horizontal) for speed of construction. That is why they cannot take structural loading, they are designed to take force in what would be a lateral direction for the Dome.

 

[NJCuse97]

This is the Tottenham structure (Populous). I do not think our roof will be structured in the same way (and I also don't think that was implied by bnoro ). I put it here because it is similar to the London Olympic roof in that the cables form a tension ring to help support the roof. I can't be certain (no inside info) but I don't think our roof will be supported in quite the same way.

 

[bnoro]

View attachment 181433
This is the Tottenham structure (Populous). I do not think our roof will be structured in the same way (and I also don't think that was implied by bnoro ). I put it here because it is similar to the London Olympic roof in that the cables form a tension ring to help support the roof. I can't be certain (no inside info) but I don't think our roof will be supported in quite the same way.

Yeah ours is completely different to that one. But they will need to apply similar principals to pull the cables up to the crown truss.

 

[reedny]

They did. It was precast
That said, concrete is porous and as such it is not great in weather without a sealer. I doubt they used a sealer on the dome interior precast, but perhaps the exterior. Water infiltration can be a huge problem in concrete, especially reinforced concrete (this is why the garage at the MONY buildings collapsed in 1993. My structures professor was a professional/forensic witness). The walls of the Dome are tilted up double "T"s and that is a well known precast shape for bridge roadways and building floor slabs. The Dome used them in a unique way (vertical instead of horizontal) for speed of construction. That is why they cannot take structural loading, they are designed to take force in what would be a lateral direction for the Dome.

I assume this is why they reinforced the corners with steel (and possibly whey they expanded some of the footers a week or so ago). Is this because the load is greater in the corners, or because the corners are weaker relative to the side walls?

 

[NJCuse97]

I assume this is why they reinforced the corners with steel (and possibly whey they expanded some of the footers a week or so ago). Is this because the load is greater in the corners, or because the corners are weaker relative to the side walls?

I assume that it is because the corners take forces from both east/west and north/south. The reinforcing is cross bracing, which implies to me that the forces they are trying to resolve are in the direction to the "left" or "right" of the "X".

 

[NJCuse97]

This is an interesting point. Are you assuming this or does this come from inside info?

If you compare the drawing of the new roof on the Geiger site, which I think is the best thing we have to work with to date, you can see that it appears they are attempting to stage the cable structure the new roof will have on the floor of the dome.

JMA Dome (formerly Carrier Dome) at Syracuse University | Geiger Engineers

The first and still the only covered stadium in New York State - is a 50,000-seat multipurpose domed stadium. Since its opening in 1980 it has served not only the university’s athletics department but also the campus and the greater Syracuse community through hosting a myriad of events. The...

www.geigerengineers.com

View attachment 181409

There are a couple of possible problems with this though.

On the drawing, it looks like the cables that will be used over most of roof above the dome floor are not going to be flat, 'normal' cables, but ones that are fixed in a series of arcs. I don't see normal cables below them. It looks like the arcs are what they are mostly going to use above the dome floor.

I have already heard from a reliable source that the drawing is not correct, so maybe this was changed, but that seems unlikely to me.

Also, if you look at the Geiger drawing carefully...it appears there are two cables, that appear to be completely arc based, that run at 45 degree angles to all the rest of the cables. All the cables are at a diagonal except these two, which I think run north-south and east-west. The drawing appears to have been done by hand and not done very well but if you believe the drawing, there is more to do.

I think they at minimum need to add a north-south and an east-west cable.

It will be interesting to see how the arc effect is achieved. Maybe they will use normal cables and have a bunch of steel arc sleeves that they will thread through them to get the needed shape? I can't imagine they are precasting lengths of arc steel 90 feet long and transporting them from Montreal, or Italy or who knows where. They are probably modular and bolt together, no?

Regardless, based on these pictures, I think that approach Pfeifer used at Olympic Stadium in Montreal to raise all the main cables at the same time is looking very likely to be used here too. Even though the structure of the cable network being raised is completely different.

NJCuse97, insiders, anyone else have thoughts on this?

I may owe some apologies here in that the more that I look at it, the more I think it may be a bit more like the London Olympic stadium than I had thought and was lead to believe. I think they may employ a more rigid bottom chord to the truss that the hard roof will frame into and the half-hoops in the PTFE are there to give the rigidity needed to create the outward force that is needed to essentially hold the roof in place.

All guesswork here.

 

[dollarbill44]

I'm pretty sure I heard the roof was going to go up like a camping tent. There will be two long tension poles that are 3 foot sections that have to be put together. Then, they vey fed through the nylon sleeves and attached at each corner. If you get a guy at each corner pushing the ends downward, the whole roof will pop up into place. The byotch is going to be getting the super large rain cover in place and tight enough so it doesn't touch the roof anywhere.