Time to recalibrate.

[GoSU96]

The #'s dwindling at 2008 and 2009 help tell a story though. 9 to 7 to 4 to 4. And in 2009 you have a drafted FB, a drafted OL, an oft injured TB, and a guy that I can't believe you included and I'm not sure what favor was called in to get him a contract, no offense to him I'm sure he's a nice guy and I know he has a good education.

You give Marrone a pretty long leash to turn over a roster, but you've often posted that GRob didn't get that same leash because he was "flashing his NFL rings" and should have had recruits lining up. But in the same breath, you'll agree with OrangePa about just how far we fell behind in the Facilities Arms Race. It's not very consistent.

This whole premise seems flawed to me, free agent contracts given to some of those guys, to me, is challenging to make an argument. Perry Patterson? Sunday? Really?

The names are from the SU website. Somebody wants to research who stuck and who didn't have at it.

I have no idea what you are trying to say with your second paragraph.

 

[rrlbees]

We were probably 2 or 3 plays away from being bowl eligible in Marrone's first year. Catch a pass or two against Minny and punt one outta bounds against UL. GRob left some decent skill guys behind, better than P did. P's guys were liabilities. And Paulus did help.

More or less the same last season. Pick six against RU (or no stupid slant to a WR who had not played) and whatever against UConn.

Yep. I know it is cheap to play the woulda, coulda, shoulda game, or the ifs ands or buts and that there are no moral victories...but we were a few plays away from going to 3 straight bowl games. That says 2 things to me loud and clear compared to the prior 4 years. One, that Marrone did a pretty good job coaching them up and that the talent brought in by GRob was that so terribly bad. If we were oh so close to 3 bowls, the program wasn't close to having cratered, unless you want to say Marrone is God, which I think last year showed he wasn't.

Another way of looking at it is that in P's last 3 years, he was 16-20 with all P recruits. In Marrone's first 3 years, with mostly GRob kids (or at least a lot of them contributing), we were 17-20. People can't have it both ways, although they try.

 

[Scooch]

Another way of looking at it is that in P's last 3 years, he was 16-20 with all P recruits. In Marrone's first 3 years, with mostly GRob kids (or at least a lot of them contributing), we were 17-20. People can't have it both ways, although they try.

Yep, either the program was wrecked and Marrone is masterful. Or there was at least *some* talent left behind and Marrone is good-ish.

Thing is... 4 of those 17 wins for Marrone were against D-1AA teams. Only 1 of Pasqualoni's was. Marrone has also gone 6-15 against the Big East, while P was 8-12.

Now of course you just play the games on the schedule and all. But there's an argument that can be made that Marrone's 17-20 is a lot "softer" than P's 16-20.

And that gets to the contention that this program is "back" to where it was in 2004. I don't think it is, personally. And that's not exactly a lofty bar, IMHO.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Thing is... 4 of those 17 wins for Marrone were against D-1AA teams.

Yeah, it appears that those 4 wins get weighted really heavily, while the Big East record isn't weighted as heavily by the Marrone Fan Club.

 

[kcsu]

no he had weapons he just didnt play loose. He played not to lose. One win against those teams should have been pretty easy. Lets see if he learned i think he has and we are going to see a very exciting O this year

 

[GoSU96]

Yep. I know it is cheap to play the woulda, coulda, shoulda game, or the ifs ands or buts and that there are no moral victories...but we were a few plays away from going to 3 straight bowl games. That says 2 things to me loud and clear compared to the prior 4 years. One, that Marrone did a pretty good job coaching them up and that the talent brought in by GRob was that so terribly bad. If we were oh so close to 3 bowls, the program wasn't close to having cratered, unless you want to say Marrone is God, which I think last year showed he wasn't.

Another way of looking at it is that in P's last 3 years, he was 16-20 with all P recruits. In Marrone's first 3 years, with mostly GRob kids (or at least a lot of them contributing), we were 17-20. People can't have it both ways, although they try.

Mostly GRob kids? Uh, no.

I would hope that after 4 recruiting classes some would contribute.

Year two on offense it was 13 Robinson/9 Marrone (6/5 starters) kids on the offensive two deep (and that includes Pugh, Lemon and Phillips as Robinson recruits).

On defense the starting unit was 2 Pasqualoni/6 Robinson/3Marrone,
2/10/10 on the two deep.

Here's a point of reference. For Robinson's last game on both offense and defense 6 of the starters were Pasqualoni recruits. There are a total of 7 Robinson recruits on the entire roster going into Marrone's fourth year.

Marrone took the best of what Robinson recruited over 4 years and blew up the rest of the roster.

 

[Scooch]

Marrone took the best of what Robinson recruited over 4 years and blew up the rest of the roster.

But then what are you saying, Go?

In year 2 your math shows that there were 12 GRob recruits starting, 8 Marrone, and 2 Pasqualoni. How does that square with the program being a heap of burning ruins?

I mean I get that one can question why just 1 year removed from the Robinson era just more than half of the starters were his recruits. That's fair, and does reveal a significant problem. But there's a huge leap from "significant problem" to "wasteland", which is what you keep saying.

 

[rrlbees]

Mostly GRob kids? Uh, no.

I would hope that after 4 recruiting classes some would contribute.

Year two on offense it was 13 Robinson/9 Marrone (6/5 starters) kids on the offensive two deep (and that includes Pugh, Lemon and Phillips as Robinson recruits).

On defense the starting unit was 2 Pasqualoni/6 Robinson/3Marrone,
2/10/10 on the two deep.

Here's a point of reference. For Robinson's last game on both offense and defense 6 of the starters were Pasqualoni recruits. There are a total of 7 Robinson recruits on the entire roster going into Marrone's fourth year.

Marrone took the best of what Robinson recruited over 4 years and blew up the rest of the roster.

You can list them, I'm not going to look them up. Seems like GRob kids were in the mix a lot more than that on O. Pretty much covered QB, RB, WR, TE and part of the OL.

Nassib
Carter
Bailey
Chew
Sales
Lemon
Graham
Provo
Stevens
Bart
Pugh

Would have been even more if certain kids didn't leave, like Speller and White, for less things than kids are doing now. As to 7 on the roster now, that's all in one class. 5 will start on O. The rest were sent packing and that turned out to be a mistake.

 

[MadNY3]

Talking about hot seats is definitely a bit premature. It's just year number four and progress has been made.

Talking about how bad things used to be is a bit overdone. It's year number four and we need to see more progress.

 

[DeepThrowIt]

NEWSFLASH: Robinson and Marrone run the SAME west coast offense. Who cares who's kids were who's? They were all recruited to play in the same system!!!!! I hate the "well they we're grob's kids" excuse. It makes no sense.